Now I become death...the destroyer of worlds
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14-12-2013, 02:21 PM
RE: Now I become death...the destroyer of worlds
This thread reminds me of Ape and Essence. Read it if you haven't. It's very good.

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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14-12-2013, 02:22 PM
RE: Now I become death...the destroyer of worlds
(14-12-2013 10:32 AM)kim Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 08:56 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  Boris Yeltsin almost launched a nuclear barrage against the U.S.
The only reason such accidents can happen is because of science.

No. The only way such "accidents" can happen is because of a gluttonous EGO.

"My rocket is bigger than yours, stand down."
"No YOU stand down."
"I'm not standing down, I'm fucking great and you suck."
"No, you suck; NUKES!"
"I have more NUKES than you and I have more exclamation marks!!! "

Religion is notorious for feeding the ego to the point of insanity and beyond.
***

Blow yourself home, Woodman; I have always greatly enjoyed my Vedanta songs and readings of the Mahabharata quite a bit. Oppenheimer was simply coming to similar conclusions I printed above.

Man decides he needs the excuse of god in order to justify becoming one.

Please stop hijacking the real, human thoughts of others and distorting them for your own twisted use. Drinking Beverage

Ego or religion had nothing to do with the Norwegian Rocket incident which could have resulted in the deaths of billions of people. Fear provided the motivation, science provided the means.

In a world without religion we could still destroy ourselves. In a world without science we could not. Oppenheimer was commenting that the world had been changed by scientists.
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14-12-2013, 02:30 PM
RE: Now I become death...the destroyer of worlds
(14-12-2013 02:22 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 10:32 AM)kim Wrote:  No. The only way such "accidents" can happen is because of a gluttonous EGO.

"My rocket is bigger than yours, stand down."
"No YOU stand down."
"I'm not standing down, I'm fucking great and you suck."
"No, you suck; NUKES!"
"I have more NUKES than you and I have more exclamation marks!!! "

Religion is notorious for feeding the ego to the point of insanity and beyond.
***

Blow yourself home, Woodman; I have always greatly enjoyed my Vedanta songs and readings of the Mahabharata quite a bit. Oppenheimer was simply coming to similar conclusions I printed above.

Man decides he needs the excuse of god in order to justify becoming one.

Please stop hijacking the real, human thoughts of others and distorting them for your own twisted use. Drinking Beverage

Ego or religion had nothing to do with the Norwegian Rocket incident which could have resulted in the deaths of billions of people. Fear provided the motivation, science provided the means.

In a world without religion we could still destroy ourselves. In a world without science we could not. Oppenheimer was commenting that the world had been changed by scientists.

I'm pretty sure I could destroy you without science! I lack the motivation to do so however!Drinking Beverage

Onward, my faithful steed!
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14-12-2013, 02:30 PM
RE: Now I become death...the destroyer of worlds
(14-12-2013 02:09 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 09:42 AM)Smercury44 Wrote:  Science does not have the ability to be "good" or "evil"

It is the motives of people who use it which can be good or evil

You are conflating good and evil with dangerous and harmless. This thread isn't about whether or not science is good(I think it is). This thread is about whether or not science is more dangerous than religion(again I think it is).

Well then you are comparing apples to cucumbers. Science is trying to explain what is observed. Religion is making up whatever absurd story you want and getting people to believe you. Sorry but science works whether or not you want to know about it.

Religion comes knocking and insists that it is true no matter how ridiculous the claims and insists that you believe it, usually in a threatening manner. Which sounds more dangerous?

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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14-12-2013, 06:07 PM
RE: Now I become death...the destroyer of worlds
(14-12-2013 08:56 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 08:39 AM)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:  Um. With TECHNOLOGY, you mean.

Technology in the hands of Religion.

Think: Iran with nukes. Or, even worse, Pat Robertson for President.

Boris Yeltsin almost launched a nuclear barrage against the U.S.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norwegian_rocket_incident

The only reason such accidents can happen is because of science.

And the only reason the majority of the human population is alive right now is because of science.

Through scientific exploration our ancestors were able to make (actually start) farming and later improve it with irrigation and increasingly better methods to increase over-all yield which allowed population increase, and they developed better weapons for defence and hunting, more food and territory, more humans. Plus experimentation with boats when it became necessary to move past rivers or because why the fuck not, lead to expansion and greater population viability.
Plus there was the architecture side of things; Roman, Grecian and Egyptian buildings were far advanced for their time due to their advances and ability to understand basic physics enough to hoist and move construction material (like big rock blocks) with relative ease, making better housing (and other utilities like the Roman aqueducts), from which we have advanced upon and in some instances, still use today.
Not to mention what has become medicine, by which now we may live so long.

The people closely associated with the namesake of female canines are suffering from a nondescript form of lunacy.
"Anti-environmentalism is like standing in front of a forest and going 'quick kill them they're coming right for us!'" - Jake Farr-Wharton, The Imaginary Friend Show.
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14-12-2013, 06:33 PM
RE: Now I become death...the destroyer of worlds
I'm sorry Heywood but are you suggesting that perhaps our society is not sufficiently morally or ethically developed to safely handle our scientific and technological advances?
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14-12-2013, 06:45 PM
RE: Now I become death...the destroyer of worlds
(14-12-2013 04:32 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  The following is a short clip from an interview with Robert Oppenheimer where he reflected on the Trinity test and the birth of the atomic age. Please take a minute to watch it as it frames the discussion.





It takes religion to fly airplanes into buildings but with science you can destroy the world.

What is really more dangerous? Science or religion?

Oooh oooh. I know I know it's a trick question!
The answer is irrational people!

Dangerous technology in rational hands is safe but in the hands of a fanatical mad man we're all doomed! ... Am I right? Have I won?

I'll offer this for a bonus point to highlight what I am saying. ... If I give a rational man a book full of bronze age myths he'll say. This is an intriguing insight into how our ancestors thought and lived. BUT the same book in the hands of an irrational maniac will say it's ALL TRUE AND IT'S THE WORD OF GOD SO DO AS I SAY! ... Have i won the star prize? :Big Grin

Hey... this is a scary thought. .. Imagine if a lunatic got his hands on dangerous technology AND the bronze age book at the same time!!! GASP Smile

A man blames his bad childhood on leprechauns. He claims they don't exist, but yet still says without a doubt that they stole all his money and then killed his parents. That's why he became Leprechaun-Man

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14-12-2013, 06:53 PM
RE: Now I become death...the destroyer of worlds
No.

Think of this.
Is knowledge alone dangerous? Depends on who has that knowledge.
I have the knowledge on how to make pipebombs.
Is it dangerous for me?
No,cuz i do not want to make pipebombs.
Is it dangerous if a psyco has it? Fuck yes. Run!!!!

Science is not dangerous,the people who use it wrongly are.

Science provided the knowledge for nuclear powerplants,but that same knowledge was used to create nukes.

I don't really like going outside.
It's too damn "peopley" out there....
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14-12-2013, 07:54 PM
RE: Now I become death...the destroyer of worlds
(14-12-2013 08:56 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 08:39 AM)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:  Um. With TECHNOLOGY, you mean.

Technology in the hands of Religion.

Think: Iran with nukes. Or, even worse, Pat Robertson for President.

Boris Yeltsin almost launched a nuclear barrage against the U.S.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norwegian_rocket_incident

The only reason such accidents can happen is because of science.

Irrelevant. I've SEEN Pat Robertson, before he ran for fucking president, going on about the Israel-Palestine conflict and predicting it would turn to world war and he said (paraphrased) "Hallelujah, Armageddon!"

With RELIGION -- and especially with Pat fucking ROBERTSON -- the end of life on this planet WOULDN'T be an ACCIDENT.

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


You can't have your special pleading and eat it too. -- WillHop
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14-12-2013, 08:13 PM
RE: Now I become death...the destroyer of worlds
I think you're comparing apples and oranges because the term "science" in your question can be substituted with any other amoral tool (ex. a knife) and the end result would be the same.

It can be used to develop technology that destroys people's lives, but it can also be used to invent things that save people's lives.

Religion, much like politics and nationalism, can be used as a justification to do either of those things with or without science.

Spider-Man once said that "with great power comes great responsibility" and I think he may be on to something there.

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