OBI-WAN KANOBI
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21-11-2014, 11:20 PM
RE: OBI-WAN KANOBI
(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  I believe in aliens (space aliens)
The way I think about the term "believe" is that it denotes two things.
1. Acknowledgement of multiple plausible "possibilities"
2. Close mindedness to all but the one possibility you choose to believe in.


If 1. is true then why choose to close your mind to the other possibilities? Why not keep the door open. Sure you can state your preference, but why not acknowledge that you are open to the other possibilities too?
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22-11-2014, 12:32 AM (This post was last modified: 22-11-2014 03:45 PM by Free Thought.)
RE: OBI-WAN KANOBI
G'day and welcome, Donistan, to our (arguably) humble abode.

I wish you luck in your time.

That said; let's get started, shall we?

(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  By dictionary, I am defined as an atheist. but I'm a different type,
as I happen to be a strong believer in an afterlife, and nature. I just
don't believe there is a grey-bearded man looking down at me from
above, and i happen to believe "ON" CHRIST, but not "IN" CHRIST.
(There is a difference)

Define the different between "believing on" and "believing in".
Once we've got that out of the way, perhaps you would like to detail the afterlife in which believe?
Also; how does one 'believe' in nature, exactly? By natures very... nature... 'belief' in it seems redundant at best.

(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  My spritial beliefs can mostly be summed up with OBI-WAN KANOBI'S words, "LET THE FORCE BE WITH YOU." (two longwinded posts to follow. This is just the first shot across the bow)

I know it's a famous line and all, but when explaining ones beliefs, using that as a descriptor is pointless as it doesn't actually say anything. 'Force' is vague and undefined so the term is unhelpful for explanatory purposes.

(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  I am a Naturalist, and an Evolutionist.

I'm not quite sure of that; you've stated that you believe in at least two things outside the realm of what would usually be considered 'natural'. Your stated beliefs at this point are far closer to mysticism than naturalism.

The term 'Evolutionist' is just silly. It's not like there are any Gravityists going around...

(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  I believe in aliens (space aliens) and that they are now around, and likely have been around since long before modern humans evolved.

Good for you; I'm not opposed to the idea of aliens myself (it seems far more likely than the alternative, given the scale of the universe), though I don't feel the need to differentiate to 'space aliens'. They certainly aren't from Earth if any do exist at all.

(21-11-2014 07:57 PM)pablo Wrote:  This thread has two lives.

Side note: 2000 posts! Big Grin

Weak. Drinking Beverage

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The people closely associated with the namesake of female canines are suffering from a nondescript form of lunacy.
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22-11-2014, 12:52 AM
RE: OBI-WAN KANOBI
(22-11-2014 12:32 AM)Free Thought Wrote:  G'day and welcome, Donistan, to our (arguably) humble abode.

I wish you luck in your time.

That said; let's get started, shall we?

(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  By dictionary, I am defined as an atheist. but I'm a different type,
as I happen to be a strong believer in an afterlife, and nature. I just
don't believe there is a grey-bearded man looking down at me from
above, and i happen to believe "ON" CHRIST, but not "IN" CHRIST.
(There is a difference)

Define the different between "believing on" and "believing in".
Once we've got that out of the way, perhaps you would like to detail the afterlife in which believe?
Also; how does one 'believe' in nature, exactly? By natures very... nature... 'belief' in it seems redundant at best.

(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  My spritial beliefs can mostly be summed up with OBI-WAN KANOBI'S words, "LET THE FORCE BE WITH YOU." (two longwinded posts to follow. This is just the first shot across the bow)

I know it's a famous line and all, but when explaining ones beliefs, using that as a descriptor is pointless as it doesn't actually say anything. 'Force' is vague and undefined so the term is unhelpful for explanatory purposes.

(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  I am a Naturalist, and an Evolutionist.

I'm not quite sure of that; you've stated that you believe in at least two things outside the realm of what would usually be considered 'natural'. Your stated beliefs at this point are far closer to mysticism than naturalism.

The term 'Evolutionist' is just silly. It's not like there are any Gravityists going around...

(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  I believe in aliens (space aliens) and that they are now around, and likely have been around since long before modern humans evolved.

I would very much enjoy discussing, the issue with anyone interested

Good for you; I'm not opposed to the idea of aliens myself (it seems far more likely than the alternative, given the scale of the universe), though I don't feel the need to differentiate to 'space aliens'. They certainly aren't from Earth if any do exist at all.

(21-11-2014 07:57 PM)pablo Wrote:  This thread has two lives.

Side note: 2000 posts! Big Grin

Weak. Drinking Beverage
[/quote]

It does have two lives...there is another just like it in introductions. Drinking Beverage
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22-11-2014, 02:28 AM
RE: OBI-WAN KANOBI
(21-11-2014 10:42 PM)Rahn127 Wrote:  Be one with force. Run into a brick wall as fast as you can.

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22-11-2014, 06:37 AM
RE: OBI-WAN KANOBI
(21-11-2014 10:42 PM)Rahn127 Wrote:  Well Doni, the space aliens thing is possible.
As humans we have landed on a comet a mere 2000 years or more after we began to write.

I could envision an intelligent culture on Venus very long ago that had to leave once the greenhouse atmosphere was too overwhelming.

I could even see a dinosaur culture expanding out into space from 65 million years ago, but in all of these things, we have no evidence .

And when we have no evidence , what should we do ?
Answer - Not believe it.

Be one with force. Run into a brick wall as fast as you can.

Haha! I love that scene in The Men Who Stare at Goats:




Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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22-11-2014, 07:33 AM
RE: OBI-WAN KANOBI
(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  By dictionary, I am defined as an atheist. but I'm a different type,
as I happen to be a strong believer in an afterlife, and nature. I just
don't believe there is a grey-bearded man looking down at me from
above, and i happen to believe "ON" CHRIST, but not "IN" CHRIST.
(There is a difference)

My spritial beliefs can mostly be summed up with OBI-WAN KANOBI'S
words, "LET THE FORCE BE WITH YOU." ( two longwinded posts to
follow. this is just the first shot across the bow)

I am a Naturalist, and an Evolutionist.

I believe in aliens (space aliens) and that they are now around, and
likely have been around since long before modern humans evolved.

I would very much enjoy discussing, the issue with anyone interested

You appear to lack critical thinking skills, especially any respect for evidence. Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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22-11-2014, 08:05 AM
Re: RE: OBI-WAN KANOBI
(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  "LET THE FORCE BE WITH YOU."

When you can retrieve your TP from across the room, then and only then can you use this phrase. [Image: 2e02a03d13a46f5ec92b646ecf3baace.jpg]
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22-11-2014, 12:22 PM
RE: OBI-WAN KANOBI
I like the name Obi Wan Kenobi... I prefer to spell it Obi wanken Obi though...

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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22-11-2014, 12:54 PM
RE: OBI-WAN KANOBI
(22-11-2014 12:32 AM)Free Thought Wrote:  G'day and welcome, Donistan, to our (arguably) humble abode.

I wish you luck in your time.

That said; let's get started, shall we?

(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  By dictionary, I am defined as an atheist. but I'm a different type,
as I happen to be a strong believer in an afterlife, and nature. I just
don't believe there is a grey-bearded man looking down at me from
above, and i happen to believe "ON" CHRIST, but not "IN" CHRIST.
(There is a difference)

Define the different between "believing on" and "believing in".
Once we've got that out of the way, perhaps you would like to detail the afterlife in which believe?
Also; how does one 'believe' in nature, exactly? By natures very... nature... 'belief' in it seems redundant at best.

(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  My spritial beliefs can mostly be summed up with OBI-WAN KANOBI'S words, "LET THE FORCE BE WITH YOU." (two longwinded posts to follow. This is just the first shot across the bow)

I know it's a famous line and all, but when explaining ones beliefs, using that as a descriptor is pointless as it doesn't actually say anything. 'Force' is vague and undefined so the term is unhelpful for explanatory purposes.

(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  I am a Naturalist, and an Evolutionist.

I'm not quite sure of that; you've stated that you believe in at least two things outside the realm of what would usually be considered 'natural'. Your stated beliefs at this point are far closer to mysticism than naturalism.

The term 'Evolutionist' is just silly. It's not like there are any Gravityists going around...

(21-11-2014 07:44 PM)doniston Wrote:  I believe in aliens (space aliens) and that they are now around, and likely have been around since long before modern humans evolved.

I would very much enjoy discussing, the issue with anyone interested

Good for you; I'm not opposed to the idea of aliens myself (it seems far more likely than the alternative, given the scale of the universe), though I don't feel the need to differentiate to 'space aliens'. They certainly aren't from Earth if any do exist at all.

(21-11-2014 07:57 PM)pablo Wrote:  This thread has two lives.

Side note: 2000 posts! Big Grin

Weak. Drinking Beverage
[/quote]
Yours was the first response which actually asked a reasonable question. The difference between on, and in, This USED to be the definition to believe in Christ, wad to believe he was a god, or part of the Trinity. to believe on him which is what was reported he stated, was to believe generally in what he believed, in short. to go with him I happen to believe in christen principles of behavior. As for your other questions, please bear with me as I am about to load on the first installment of my beliefs and how I came by them. these two installments will likely answer most of my distractor's questions. (but Of course I realize that most will disagree. that come with the territory.)

"I don't Debate, I Discuss" I offer my opinions, and listen to yours, I will not require proof of opinions, but I may ask for clarification or state that I reject your position and why, & if asked, I will further clarify mine --- However, I reject any requirement that I PROVE my position is accurate and proper.
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22-11-2014, 01:00 PM
LET THE FORCE BE WITH YOU
To start at the beginning. When I was 13, and starting High school, I and the whole auditorium of kids were informed of the makeup of an atom by a guest lecturer, It was explained how the parts of the atom,--Nucleus, Electrons, and Positrons were comparable to our own solar system with comparatively speaking, as much space between the particles as there is between the sun and the planets, thus, if it wasn't for some presently unknown magnetic force, you could pass one thru the other without fear of colision . Thus you could also pass one hand right thru the other. This started me on my road to knowledge.
Further, Science has told us that solids, (matter) is simply energy which has become relatively stationary, thus the mini universes with all their relative space, because of some magnetic force become solid and perhaps a part of our bodies.as fingers, toes, and kidneys.


At that time it was taught that there were millions of stars in the universe, and many universes Now we know there are untold billions of stars in the universe, and billions of universes. And in the past few years they are finding a multitude of planets around these stars. This is where the first ofthree unanswerable questions come in.

HOW FAR IS UP” & WHERE ARE WE?

Einstein said that space is curved thus implying it is like a ball. I don't believe that. As we know space, it is between this and that. Beween two walls, then two fields—two towns, , two countries, two planets, two stars, two galaxies. But what is on the other side of that last viewed galaxy ???
a stone wall? another series of galaxies? We simply don't know, and when we arrive at that point, what is on the other side of that? And where are we located.? --In a ball of matter of unimaginable size? And then,of course, where is that ball of mud???

We have also learned that within these atoms (mini solar systems) in a much smaller scale are particles which could (repeat) COULD be be like “ mini micro” solar systems in turn, made up of even smaller particles but similar to our own? Is it possible that our present solar system is simply an atom in a gigantic organism so huge that we can't comprehend? WE JUST DON'T KNOW 

Science has also informed us that in each of the galaxies there is a so-called black hole that is so dense that even light can't escape.( Thus,it is called a BLACK hole.) Contrary to my own belief, these holes swallow up all matter in it's vicinity to become even larger and denser, and if it
came close enough to this planet, it would eat us up. Hmm! Yet in billions of years we, and the milky way are still here. Further knowledge of the present beliefs concerning black holes lead me to believe that at some point the Black hole becomes unstable, and emits a stream of energy known as a “quazar” It is believed that the stream of energy later slows down and become matter ---which in turn becomes stars and ultimately, with planets.
The big bang theory suggests that this all started with an exclamation point of nothingless and exploded to become the universe. I do beieive that what might really have happenedwas that there was a multitude of miniature big bangs called quazars, which in our own case created the milky way. To me, that is my original “CREATOR” except that before that there had to be other Galaxies which had black holes which emitted quarzars, etc. thus the 2nd unanswerable question

“ WHO or WHAT BEGAT THE BEGATOR”

(and it continues to who or what begat it. I simple don't believe it was a grey haired man looking down on us from above.
Some weeks ago I was watching the beginning of a 12 part miniseries led by a preacher who promised an insight into the disparages between Creationism, and Evolution. I am always trying to learn, so I tuned in, The first introduction was interesting enough that I tuned into the 2nd. However when he started explaining that Tyrantisourus Rex roamed the earth in the past several thousand years, and god had somehow sped up time to cause those bones to petrify, and be buried far below the surface, I ceased tuning in.
I realize that many religous people still believe that God created earth several thousand years ago, but I believe there is an abundance of evidence that it simply isn't true. There are Ruins of structures scientifically dated back as much as twelve thousand years, and many of those ruins and structures are built with such precision that primative man could not have accomplished --such as stonework carving which appear to have been cut by lasers They are so intricly and precisely carved it could only have been done with 
something like a laser. (But supposedly there was no lasers back then). Throughout the world, there are structures similar in nature to have been planned and designed by the same persons in places of the world so distant and
remote as to be literally impossible for our primativesto have raveled there, For instance,some 12 years ago, the remains of a fourth pyramid was discovered, and is now being excavated. One which would have been larger than
the so-called Tower of Gisa, and not only was it constructed, it was also destroyed,and most of the massive blocks of stone with which it was constructed have somehow disappeared. ----WHERE?? and HOW??

PAUSE!!!!

I'm going to change my approach to this issue to an installment process because I see it is going to be much longer and complicated than I thought. Therefore, I will indicate a future set of related issues for later instalment with some preliminary incite as to their content,

BUT BEWARE, I will likely upset some of your most cherished Religious beliefs with my future offering such as:
Proof that the world wide flood could not have happened ( to a -more localized area,like the Black sea area, one is likely)
That Alien lifeforms are likely here and have been almost forever, and have played agreat role in our development and culture
Most specifically, that the story of Jesus is a near duplicate of the story of a simila rperson and circumstances, referenced in ancient Hebrew texts at least two thousand years before Christ. And that tho the Bible is a greatsource of history, There is scientific proof of, and reasons for many of the Bible stories.

In the meantime I will go back to the start of this thread, and attempt to answer all of my soon to be detractor's present questions.

I'LL BE BAAAAACK!!

"I don't Debate, I Discuss" I offer my opinions, and listen to yours, I will not require proof of opinions, but I may ask for clarification or state that I reject your position and why, & if asked, I will further clarify mine --- However, I reject any requirement that I PROVE my position is accurate and proper.
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