Oh yeah? Prove it
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03-03-2012, 07:54 AM
Oh yeah? Prove it
This simple phrase may be the most important of any ever spoken.

This is how every scientific discovery is started:
"The earth revolves around the sun" - Oh yeah? Prove it
"The Universe is over 14 billion years old" - Oh yeah? Prove it
"We are the products of evolution by natural selection" Oh yeah? prove it.

Children use this phrase all the time:
"I'm smarter than you" - Oh yeah? Prove it
"I can do 100 push ups" - Oh yeah? Prove it
"My bike is faster than yours" - Oh yeah? Prove it

If you were told there was a person belonging to a tribe in the Amazon jungle who could flap his arms and fly and it was observed by hundreds of people in his village would we say, "Wow, thats amazing". No we would say, "Oh yeah? Prove it" We would demand evidence.

So why when people look at some of the astounding claims made by religion do they simply take for granted that they happened without any evidence at all. Simply because some people 2,000 years ago wrote it down. As the man himself said, "Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence"

A God created humans out of mud - Oh yeah? Prove it
Jesus rose from the dead - Oh yeah? Prove it
God answers my prayers - Oh yeah? Prove it
I will go to heaven if I go to church - Oh yeah? Prove it
You will go to hell if you don't - Oh yeah? Prove it

From now on when someone claims religious stories or beliefs as fact just say "Oh yeah? Prove it."

.

.
I wasn't . . . until I was
I am . . . until I'm not
.
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03-03-2012, 09:39 AM
RE: Oh yeah? Prove it
But, dude, I can already hear the reply (and you said it yourself)... the proof is in the book!

The problem is the unwillingness to accept the definition of "proof".
As we all know, the scientific method is deeply flawed (look at all the mistakes they've made along the way).
Whereas, the faithers have the advantage of more ancient methodology...
1) Proof by Faith
2) Proof by Authority
3) Proof by Revelation
4) Proof by Tradition

(btw, these 4 are easy to remember when engaged in your next a/theistic tussle... FART! or Proof by Hot Air)

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03-03-2012, 01:04 PM
RE: Oh yeah? Prove it
You forget the Eternal Verity Sidestep:

Some things are truer than fact: beyond reason and immune to proof.

If you pray to anything, you're prey to anything.
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03-03-2012, 01:10 PM
RE: Oh yeah? Prove it
(03-03-2012 01:04 PM)Peterkin Wrote:  You forget the Eternal Verity Sidestep:

Some things are truer than fact: beyond reason and immune to proof.

Oh yeah? Prove it!

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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03-03-2012, 06:09 PM
RE: Oh yeah? Prove it
(03-03-2012 01:10 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(03-03-2012 01:04 PM)Peterkin Wrote:  You forget the Eternal Verity Sidestep:

Some things are truer than fact: beyond reason and immune to proof.

Oh yeah? Prove it!

Simple. "Does the set of all sets that do not contain themselves as members contain itself?" All you have to do is introduce negation and self-reference and the whole thing goes to shit quick.

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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03-03-2012, 06:28 PM
RE: Oh yeah? Prove it
(03-03-2012 01:10 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(03-03-2012 01:04 PM)Peterkin Wrote:  You forget the Eternal Verity Sidestep:

Some things are truer than fact: beyond reason and immune to proof.

Oh yeah? Prove it!

This actually has been proven. Tongue

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6del'...s_theorems
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03-03-2012, 06:53 PM
RE: Oh yeah? Prove it
(03-03-2012 06:28 PM)Ben Wrote:  
(03-03-2012 01:10 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(03-03-2012 01:04 PM)Peterkin Wrote:  You forget the Eternal Verity Sidestep:

Some things are truer than fact: beyond reason and immune to proof.

Oh yeah? Prove it!

This actually has been proven. Tongue

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6del'...s_theorems

When most are presented with a choice between consistency and completeness, they choose consistency. I say fuck that, give me completeness and let the lunacy ensue. Big Grin

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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04-03-2012, 09:01 AM
RE: Oh yeah? Prove it
(03-03-2012 09:39 AM)DLJ Wrote:  But, dude, I can already hear the reply (and you said it yourself)... the proof is in the book!

From the moment I started down my path of analyzing why people believe in religions I have always come back to this very frustrating conclusion. This book is their proof, their evidence, their reason for believing. That's it, period. Is there any other extraordinary claim that modern society takes as truth base on the writings alone without supporting evidence?

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I am . . . until I'm not
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07-03-2012, 04:35 PM
RE: Oh yeah? Prove it
(04-03-2012 09:01 AM)free2011 Wrote:  
(03-03-2012 09:39 AM)DLJ Wrote:  But, dude, I can already hear the reply (and you said it yourself)... the proof is in the book!

From the moment I started down my path of analyzing why people believe in religions I have always come back to this very frustrating conclusion. This book is their proof, their evidence, their reason for believing. That's it, period. Is there any other extraordinary claim that modern society takes as truth base on the writings alone without supporting evidence?

Even to prove that established scientific 'fact" will eventually give way to new "facts'
or vice versa, cannot be proven......at least by us!
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07-03-2012, 05:24 PM
RE: Oh yeah? Prove it
I just changed my FB status to 'Oh Yeah? Prove It!'

“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect.”

-Mark Twain
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