Ohio 'heartbeat bill' - abortion
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09-12-2016, 05:27 PM
RE: Ohio 'heartbeat bill' - abortion
(09-12-2016 02:46 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  
(08-12-2016 05:02 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  What a bunch of fucking idiots.
Ectopic pregnancies can have beating hearts, and unless terminated are deadly to both mother and baby.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mj2q62IarUE

Yeah but this bill applies to only those pregnancies implanted in the womb and allows a doctor to make a determination if a medical requirement exists "to prevent the death of the pregnant woman or to prevent a serious risk of the substantial and irreversible impairment of a major bodily function of the pregnant woman."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/emilywilling...6fa481bdc5

It's unconstitutional, and has been ruled so in the past. There is no exception for rape and incest. It FAILS in every way. Of course YOU know nothing AT ALL about health care, so your opinion on the matter is utterly irrelevant. The bill was clearly written by religionists. "Moment of conception" .. LMAO. There is no such "moment".

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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09-12-2016, 05:33 PM
RE: Ohio 'heartbeat bill' - abortion
(08-12-2016 05:02 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(07-12-2016 11:03 AM)Impulse Wrote:  In other words, don't support it when it might lose, but support it when it might win. WTF? So rightness and wrongness don't matter? What happened to it being unconstitutional? Fuck these people! Angry

What a bunch of fucking idiots.
Ectopic pregnancies can have beating hearts, and unless terminated are deadly to both mother and baby.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mj2q62IarUE

A friend of mine had one - and they performed surgery to correct it.....

Her mother came unglued and called her a "baby murderer"....

......

I tried to convince her that her daughter would have died, if they hadn't taken care of it --- she told me "God would have taken care of her".....

Stupid knows no boundaries..

.......................................

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09-12-2016, 06:05 PM
RE: Ohio 'heartbeat bill' - abortion
(09-12-2016 05:27 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(09-12-2016 02:46 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Yeah but this bill applies to only those pregnancies implanted in the womb and allows a doctor to make a determination if a medical requirement exists "to prevent the death of the pregnant woman or to prevent a serious risk of the substantial and irreversible impairment of a major bodily function of the pregnant woman."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/emilywilling...6fa481bdc5

It's unconstitutional, and has been ruled so in the past. There is no exception for rape and incest. It FAILS in every way. Of course YOU know nothing AT ALL about health care, so your opinion on the matter is utterly irrelevant. The bill was clearly written by religionists. "Moment of conception" .. LMAO. There is no such "moment".

How is it unconstitutional? I'm not aware of the supreme court tackling the issue of heartbeat abortions. If Kasich does sign it into law, it will take a year or two before it comes before the supreme court. Which will soon have a 5-4 or 6-3 majority of justices that will probably agree with this law.

Ohio passed two abortion laws over the last two days. The heartbeat law and a 20 week ban. In the interest of preventing outrage, and Kasich being fairly moderate, he might veto the heartbeat bill and allow the 20 week ban go into effect.

"Evil will always triumph over good, because good is dumb." - Lord Dark Helmet
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09-12-2016, 06:31 PM
RE: Ohio 'heartbeat bill' - abortion
http://www.cnn.com/2016/12/09/politics/o...index.html

Facepalm

So now, even if the fetus is no longer viable at 20 weeks, they're going to force the woman to incubate it.

Ignorance is not to be ignored.

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09-12-2016, 07:32 PM (This post was last modified: 09-12-2016 08:03 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Ohio 'heartbeat bill' - abortion
(09-12-2016 06:05 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  
(09-12-2016 05:27 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  http://www.forbes.com/sites/emilywilling...6fa481bdc5

It's unconstitutional, and has been ruled so in the past. There is no exception for rape and incest. It FAILS in every way. Of course YOU know nothing AT ALL about health care, so your opinion on the matter is utterly irrelevant. The bill was clearly written by religionists. "Moment of conception" .. LMAO. There is no such "moment".

How is it unconstitutional? I'm not aware of the supreme court tackling the issue of heartbeat abortions. If Kasich does sign it into law, it will take a year or two before it comes before the supreme court. Which will soon have a 5-4 or 6-3 majority of justices that will probably agree with this law.

Ohio passed two abortion laws over the last two days. The heartbeat law and a 20 week ban. In the interest of preventing outrage, and Kasich being fairly moderate, he might veto the heartbeat bill and allow the 20 week ban go into effect.

Dream on.
There is NO reason to expect the court to change (that fast) or at all.
It has been decided on a N. Dakota law.
http://world.wng.org/2013/07/judge_stops...rtbeat_law
http://www.cleveland.com/court-justice/i...ser_1.html
The 20 week ban is also unconstitutional.
Women have the right to abortion. It's settled law. The SCOTUS is not going to change that.
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/201...-abortion/

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09-12-2016, 08:17 PM
RE: Ohio 'heartbeat bill' - abortion
(09-12-2016 06:31 PM)Loom Wrote:  http://www.cnn.com/2016/12/09/politics/o...index.html

Facepalm

So now, even if the fetus is no longer viable at 20 weeks, they're going to force the woman to incubate it.

It's all about punishing women--driven by legislators who are male and so have no risk to their own health. If a few females die pushing out dead fetuses, no worries. Then their partners get to audition a bunch of new vaginas for their next batch of offspring.
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10-12-2016, 05:53 AM (This post was last modified: 10-12-2016 01:19 PM by Vosur.)
RE: Ohio 'heartbeat bill' - abortion
(09-12-2016 05:21 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  How about you explain why you abhor abortion, and then justify your "abhorrence" of abortion, and tell us if and why you think you get to interfere with the decisions of women about their reproductive cycle.
I'm sorry to disappoint you, but if you don't already see why someone would think that having one's offspring killed is abhorrent, then there's nothing I can say to help you better understand that feeling. As far as interfering with someone's decision about their reproductive cycle goes, I think I made my position on the legality of the procedure crystal clear in the post you responded to and if you don't think that's sufficient, well, that's your problem.

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10-12-2016, 09:00 AM
RE: Ohio 'heartbeat bill' - abortion
(10-12-2016 05:53 AM)Vosur Wrote:  
(09-12-2016 05:21 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  How about you explain why you abhor abortion, and then justify your "abhorrence" of abortion, and tell us if and why you think you get to interfere with the decisions of women about their reproductive cycle.
I'm sorry to disappoint you, but if you don't already see why someone would think that having one's offspring killed is abhorrent, then there's nothing I can say you to help you better understand that feeling. As far as interfering with someone's decision about their reproductive cycle goes, I think I made my position on the legality of the procedure crystal clear in the post you responded to and if you don't think that's sufficient, well, that's your problem.

It's quite common for men to urge the women they've impregnated to terminate the pregnancy, and to offer to pay for this procedure...so your abhorrence is not universal. It's certainly not a given that everyone would "already see" your position.

Of course conception is by no means always consensual (on the male or female side). A rapist or child molester may feel outraged that the woman he forcibly impregnated wants to terminate; a man who isn't interested in offspring may feel outraged that a woman he impregnated decided to have the child.

I'd argue that it's at least questionable, morally, to perpetuate the genes of a rapist, as well as to bring children into the world that won't be wanted, loved, or properly provided for, but it's still the woman's choice, because she bears entirely the pregnancy's physical risks, as well (often) as the majority share of the long-term economic consequences of carrying a pregnancy to term.

I do support men's being able to opt out of the financial responsibility for their offspring, if they want their partner to have an abortion while the procedure is legal and are willing to pay half of the abortion costs, but their partner refuses (I believe there should be better established legal mechanisms for this kind of situation).
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10-12-2016, 09:32 AM
RE: Ohio 'heartbeat bill' - abortion
(10-12-2016 05:53 AM)Vosur Wrote:  
(09-12-2016 05:21 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  How about you explain why you abhor abortion, and then justify your "abhorrence" of abortion, and tell us if and why you think you get to interfere with the decisions of women about their reproductive cycle.

I'm sorry to disappoint you, but if you don't already see why someone would think that having one's offspring killed is abhorrent, then there's nothing I can say you to help you better understand that feeling. As far as interfering with someone's decision about their reproductive cycle goes, I think I made my position on the legality of the procedure crystal clear in the post you responded to and if you don't think that's sufficient, well, that's your problem.

You couldn't disappoint me. This is what I suspected.
You really have no rational explanation for your irrational and uneducated emotion based opinions on this subject. "Feelings" are hardly rational bases for law and ethics. Abortion is not "killing" and a clump of cells with no brain and no neural tube is not "offspring" (yet). You simply invoke all the bullshit emotional baggage and non-scientific irrational tripe that religionists invoke concerning this subject.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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10-12-2016, 09:43 AM
RE: Ohio 'heartbeat bill' - abortion
(10-12-2016 09:00 AM)julep Wrote:  It's quite common for men to urge the women they've impregnated to terminate the pregnancy, and to offer to pay for this procedure...so your abhorrence is not universal. It's certainly not a given that everyone would "already see" your position.
You're not telling me anything I don't already know. I even said that my view isn't shared by many of my peers in an earlier post.

(10-12-2016 09:32 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  You couldn't disappoint me. This is what I suspected.
You really have no rational explanation for your irrational and uneducated emotion based opinions on this subject. "Feelings" are hardly rational bases for law and ethics. Abortion is not "killing" and a clump of cells with no brain and no neural tube is not "offspring" (yet). You simply invoke all the bullshit emotional baggage and non-scientific irrational tripe that religionists invoke concerning this subject.
It's your prerogative to spout statements based on ignorance and it's my prerogative to laugh at you for doing so. As a great man once said, the absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. And with that, I wish you a nice day.

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