One Of The Worst Anti-Abortion Arguments I've Heard
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06-11-2014, 06:23 PM
One Of The Worst Anti-Abortion Arguments I've Heard
I was having a conversation yesterday with a friend (his kids are my age and close friends of mine since childhood), and I asked him if he voted. He said he did not because he doesn't like Republican policies, but he won't vote for Democrats because they are pro-choice.

I think it's a bit ridiculous that people will choose to vote a certain way, or not vote all, simply because of their stance on one single issue. So I asked him "Well, if abortion were illegal and all the extra babies brought into the world were put up for adoption, do you realize how incredibly expensive it would be to feed, clothe, medicate, and educate all of those kids? If people aren't willing to pay the extra tax dollars to do what's right, then there is no reason why this should be an issue."

His response: "But we shouldn't have to!"
Me: "What do you mean 'We shouldn't have to'?"
Him: "I mean we shouldn't have to because people should just take care of their kids."
Me: "Well, we don't live in idealistic world, so we can't run our society as though we do."


I just bit my tongue and left it at that, because he's a really nice person and I didn't want to get in a heated argument with him, but his excuse is just ridiculous. Yeah, in an idealistic world we wouldn't need abortion because people wouldn't be having unwanted pregnancies. We also shouldn't have to have Child Services because people shouldn't be beating the shit out of their kids or sexually abusing them - but you know what? It fucking happens! Should we just abolish Child Services as well because in an idealistic world we wouldn't need it? He's not alone in this line of thinking either. Many people think that being an idealist simply makes you a positive person, so that's the way they like to think. The problem is, using solutions that would work in an idealistic world and applying them to real world problems never works.

This, of course, is on top of the fact that I feel that it is a person's choice on what they do with their own body.

“Religion was invented when the first con man met the first fool.” - Mark Twain
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06-11-2014, 07:00 PM
RE: One Of The Worst Anti-Abortion Arguments I've Heard
Quote:His response: "But we shouldn't have to!"
Me: "What do you mean 'We shouldn't have to'?"
Him: "I mean we shouldn't have to because people should just take care of their kids."
Me: "Well, we don't live in idealistic world, so we can't run our society as though we do."


Hmm... this is why I always consider abortion to be the equivalent of the abolitionist movement prior to the civil war. The people who were against slavery were simply that. Against slavery. They had no plan for what would happen if they suddenly got their wish. Suddenly "freeing" 4 million slaves and having no idea where they would go or what they would do. What eventually happened of course was similar and we ended up with share-cropping ( basically feudalism ) and 100 years of Jim Crow laws by a white majority which shit its pants every time a black person popped into their view.

The anti-abortion - and it is now growing to anti-contraception - crowd does not think about the ramifications of their position any more than your friend does. They only care about the end result.

Once abortion was illegal they wouldn't care if every one of those kids starved to death. It isn't on their radar.

Atheism is NOT a Religion. It's A Personal Relationship With Reality!
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06-11-2014, 08:17 PM
RE: One Of The Worst Anti-Abortion Arguments I've Heard
(06-11-2014 06:23 PM)WindyCityJazz Wrote:  I was having a conversation yesterday with a friend (his kids are my age and close friends of mine since childhood), and I asked him if he voted. He said he did not because he doesn't like Republican policies, but he won't vote for Democrats because they are pro-choice.

I think it's a bit ridiculous that people will choose to vote a certain way, or not vote all, simply because of their stance on one single issue. So I asked him "Well, if abortion were illegal and all the extra babies brought into the world were put up for adoption, do you realize how incredibly expensive it would be to feed, clothe, medicate, and educate all of those kids? If people aren't willing to pay the extra tax dollars to do what's right, then there is no reason why this should be an issue."

His response: "But we shouldn't have to!"
Me: "What do you mean 'We shouldn't have to'?"
Him: "I mean we shouldn't have to because people should just take care of their kids."
Me: "Well, we don't live in idealistic world, so we can't run our society as though we do."


I just bit my tongue and left it at that, because he's a really nice person and I didn't want to get in a heated argument with him, but his excuse is just ridiculous. Yeah, in an idealistic world we wouldn't need abortion because people wouldn't be having unwanted pregnancies. We also shouldn't have to have Child Services because people shouldn't be beating the shit out of their kids or sexually abusing them - but you know what? It fucking happens! Should we just abolish Child Services as well because in an idealistic world we wouldn't need it? He's not alone in this line of thinking either. Many people think that being an idealist simply makes you a positive person, so that's the way they like to think. The problem is, using solutions that would work in an idealistic world and applying them to real world problems never works.

This, of course, is on top of the fact that I feel that it is a person's choice on what they do with their own body.

That's an awful reason. But you were probably right for walking away from that discussion.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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06-11-2014, 08:25 PM (This post was last modified: 06-11-2014 08:31 PM by WindyCityJazz.)
RE: One Of The Worst Anti-Abortion Arguments I've Heard
(06-11-2014 07:00 PM)Minimalist Wrote:  The anti-abortion - and it is now growing to anti-contraception - crowd does not think about the ramifications of their position any more than your friend does. They only care about the end result.

Once abortion was illegal they wouldn't care if every one of those kids starved to death. It isn't on their radar.

Yep. That's my point. A lot of anti-abortionists just want to give themselves a pat on the back for being anti-abortion, when really they're the most heartless assholes on the planet, and will gladly allow children to starve to death in order to avoid paying any more taxes.

Others, like my friend's dad, are not heartless people. They simply, as you said, don't think about the ramifications. They don't want people to starve or children to suffer, but they don't think about the big picture. They just think that if the kid is born they will live in a loving family and everything will turn out ok. That's just not reality.


(06-11-2014 08:17 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  That's an awful reason. But you were probably right for walking away from that discussion.

Yeah, I figured it was the right thing to do. He's a very nice person, and I know that his intentions in his stance are good. They are simply unrealistic. I didn't want to hurt his feelings, and nobody wants to create unnecessary tension with good friends. Sometimes you just have to let it be.

“Religion was invented when the first con man met the first fool.” - Mark Twain
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