One question that completely refutes atheism
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
23-07-2014, 11:07 AM (This post was last modified: 23-07-2014 11:10 AM by true scotsman.)
RE: One question that completely refutes atheism
(22-07-2014 11:10 AM)diddo97 Wrote:  
(22-07-2014 11:07 AM)cjlr Wrote:  I guess "ad hominem" is just one more thing we'll have to add to the list of things you don't understand.

But no, that wasn't one. And yes, if you act like an idiot, people will helpfully point out why.


Presuppositionalism is a cesspit of intellectual failure.
(aka "I have no argument and can't prove anything, so I will just continue to loudly repeat my assertions in the vain hope that it will eventually make them true")

You can swim in that shitlake, if you're so inclined, but you'll have to pardon me for refraining.

How do you dismiss presuppositional apologetics so easily? They are what single handedly stopped me from being an atheist. I was a fundimentalist atheist untill I heard Sye Ten, now I see atheism as dumb.

Since it has been shown to you why the argument (TAG) of presuppositional apologetics is invalid because it commits the fallacies of begging the question and the stolen concept and your argument against the validity of logic has been refuted, I think you need to renounce your belief in God. You said that the arguments of presuppositional apologetics were "what single handedly stopped me from being an atheist" so what is left for you but to admit that you were wrong. You have to admit that now or you can no longer say that you "care what's true".

There are no arguments for you to fall back on now since it is not only TAG that commits the fallacy of the stolen concept, but every single argument for God that has ever been presented and ever will be presented.

So now your choice is clear. Embrace reason, come back to reality, or willfully continue to live in a fantasy world of your imagination.

Do not lose your knowledge that man's proper estate is an upright posture, an intransigent mind and a step that travels unlimited roads. - Ayn Rand.

Don't sacrifice for me, live for yourself! - Me

The only alternative to Objectivism is some form of Subjectivism. - Dawson Bethrick
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes true scotsman's post
23-07-2014, 11:35 AM (This post was last modified: 23-07-2014 11:39 AM by Drunkin Druid.)
RE: One question that completely refutes atheism
(23-07-2014 10:11 AM)Logisch Wrote:  
(23-07-2014 10:02 AM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  I'm going to spell this shit out.
There has yet to be any comments or questions asked that could point out any flaw in (for lack of a better term) atheistic reasoning.
Or (perhaps more simply put) any question that could refute the "no god hypothesis" hasn't been asked.

You're gonna have to define "atheistic reasoning" to me, since atheism is just a lack of belief in god... are you defining something called "lack-of-belief-in-a-deity-istic-reasoning"????? Last I checked, just simple reasoning and logic and rational thinking was what most people talk about. I'm unaware of a specific type of logical reasoning that comes with specifically lacking a belief in a god that is different from other logical or rational forms of reasoning.

I'm being serious.
As I said. For lack of a better term. What I mean is reasoning that would lead to the atheist position.
At any rate the point I'm trying to make is that no question has been asked that might refute atheism. It's not fucking hard to understand!
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Drunkin Druid's post
23-07-2014, 11:43 AM
RE: One question that completely refutes atheism
(23-07-2014 11:35 AM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  
(23-07-2014 10:11 AM)Logisch Wrote:  You're gonna have to define "atheistic reasoning" to me, since atheism is just a lack of belief in god... are you defining something called "lack-of-belief-in-a-deity-istic-reasoning"????? Last I checked, just simple reasoning and logic and rational thinking was what most people talk about. I'm unaware of a specific type of logical reasoning that comes with specifically lacking a belief in a god that is different from other logical or rational forms of reasoning.

I'm being serious.
As I said. For lack of a better term. What I mean is reasoning that would lead to the atheist position.
At any rate the point I'm trying to make is that no question has been asked that might refute atheism. It's not fucking hard to understand!

That clarifies a bit better. I agree with you that there hasn't been any questions raised that refute a lack of belief in a deity. It's sort of like saying, "I have an argument that disproves that you have a lack of belief in something!" which is intellectually dishonest. The other side to that would be, "Your lack of belief is insignificant now because I am willing to take the burden of proof on the argument and can prove god exists." but I have yet to see that happen.

Till it does... I'll maintain my lack of belief Smile

Official ordained minister of the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Please pm me with prayer requests to his noodly goodness. Remember, he boiled for your sins and loves you. Carbo Diem! RAmen.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
23-07-2014, 11:46 AM (This post was last modified: 23-07-2014 11:55 AM by Drunkin Druid.)
RE: One question that completely refutes atheism
(23-07-2014 08:15 AM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  So when is the question that refutes atheism going to be asked?
I said some shit here but I've decided to leave it alone.... So I have changed this post.

Edited..
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
23-07-2014, 01:11 PM
RE: One question that completely refutes atheism
This one mostly addresses first-cause arguments, but the omniscience vs solipsism thing gets roasted to.



Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Reltzik's post
23-07-2014, 01:57 PM
RE: One question that completely refutes atheism
(22-07-2014 11:10 AM)diddo97 Wrote:  How do you dismiss presuppositional apologetics so easily? They are what single handedly stopped me from being an atheist. I was a fundimentalist atheist untill I heard Sye Ten, now I see atheism as dumb.

Perhaps Diddo, your perception of atheism is something more than what it actually is. Atheism is not a theistic claim rather it lacks or even rejects any theistic claims. Atheism carries no faith in the existence of a deity; that is all.

Not atheism:
theism |ˈθēˌizəm|
noun
belief in the existence of a god or gods, esp. belief in one god as creator of the universe, intervening in it and sustaining a personal relation to his creatures.

One does not "follow" atheism ... for there is nothing to believe, no faith to adhere to... there is nothing to follow.

One is not an atheist rather, one is atheist. To be atheist is simply to be not a theist.

To be atheist is to not have a belief in the existence of a god or gods, esp. belief in one god as creator of the universe, intervening in it and sustaining a personal relation to his creatures.
***

Have you been under the impression that being atheist means being part of something other than humanity? Have you perceived it as being something akin to a "religion"?

I get the impression that this my be what is confusing your impression of atheism and being atheist, Diddo. I can see why you might be caught up in someone's seemingly intellectual, yet completely insubstantial blather. There is a determined lack of reason within the theist mindset, which often puts all thoughts on a circular track.

Something to watch out for. Shy

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like kim's post
23-07-2014, 04:27 PM
RE: One question that completely refutes atheism
Can I just go on a tangent about something here? Well wouldn't matter what you would have said I would do it anyway.

The problem with this argument is that it is not even valid as it makes christianity more confusing. Lets say hypothetically I decided to smoke enough drugs to think sye ten's argument is actually valid. So now I sit there incredibly high now as a I sit saying I am a christian now because I can know every thing with god. So as I sober up I walk down the street and meet a black hebrew israelite. Seeing as I am negro my self he creches to me that all whites, asians, and all non-negro,native america, and hispanic people are going to hell for being born in the wrong race. I sit there, already being stupid and gullible enough to swallow what he is saying as truth, and that god revealed it to me in such a way I can know it for certain. What is the problem with this? I am getting to that wait patiently sir/mam/other. So after I am a presuppositionlist apologist and a black hebrew israelite I end up meeting a sye clone, oh boy this is where it gets hot. We get into an argument on the bible and he says I have been tricked by satan, and I go no you have god has reveled to me the the white man is esau, who god hated, and that satan speaks lies to them. And he goes "no satan is speaking to you, god has reveled to me that all those who follow christ can be in the kingdom not just one race." See the problem yet? I sure hope so. The problem is that in christian eyes you can't say weather it is satan or god objectively. Lets say that a christian burns down a abortion clinic, some chrisitains say that is not what god wants, others cheer in the fact he did gods work. In that is a subjective feeling. Case and point. I am basically asking how one can know it is god revealing or satan? You can say that it is god because you think he did it, mean while a hebrew israelite can say god has reveled things to him in a certain way. Now if this argument here is to make atheist christians, then you must get rid of the road block, how to objectively know when satan is reveling things to you or god, because seeing how many christians agree and disagree with each other it is hard to tell which one is on gods side, even with the bible, seeing how in the bible you can turn the words "Rape and eat the children" to "Jesus loves puppies."

Also before I end this about the whole every body knows the christian god exist is there scientific evidence for that? You can run to the bible all you want but that is just the claim, and reading it a again is still just the claim. Is there a test in which we can determine weather every one knows jesus is god or some shit like that? Any neurological studies to show it? There probably is not. So how can you say all believe in god, but have no evidence showing this. That bothers me, a lot actually, in fact it keeps me up at night. That you atheist are not a religious group. It means lack of a belief in gods. That is all it is. Hell you can follow a holy book and believe in its prophecies and miracles and even that its end times are happening, but if you don't believe in a god you are still an atheist, no matter how much magical bull shit you believe in.


Alright that is it I am done.

Bye for now

[Image: giphy.gif]

[Image: Guilmon-41189.gif] https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCOW_Ioi2wtuPa88FvBmnBgQ my youtube
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Metazoa Zeke's post
24-07-2014, 09:12 AM
RE: One question that completely refutes atheism
After 17 pages, that I didn't read, I returned to the original question and had to reword it for it to make any sense to me.

Does an understanding of everything that exists.....exist. To me that's what absolute truth is, verses your normal everyday truth.
And the answer would be no, not as far as I know. I have no idea what all there is in "everything" and since humans (so far) are the only intelligent minds I am aware of, I don't think we have that kind of depth of understanding about "everything".

We know quite a bit, considering where and how we live. I sometimes think we are the equivalent of bacteria constructing devices that measure fluctuations in the quantum states of quarks

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
24-07-2014, 10:11 AM
RE: One question that completely refutes atheism
(24-07-2014 09:12 AM)Rahn127 Wrote:  Does an understanding of everything that exists.....exist. To me that's what absolute truth is, verses your normal everyday truth.
That makes sense to me.

And now that you're clarification has shed some light on how atheism has been completely refut... oh wait. Consider Diddo still has some explaining to do.

I am not accountable to any God. I am accountable to myself - and not because I think I am God as some theists would try to assert - but because, no matter what actions I take, thoughts I think, or words I utter, I have to be able to live with myself.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
24-07-2014, 11:34 AM
RE: One question that completely refutes atheism
Ok. The title of the post is driving me crazy.

You can't refute atheism. That's like telling a hole that it is no longer a hole.

Are you trying to refute the concept of someone lacking belief in deities?

Good luck with that.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Zippo's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: