Open the Pod Bay Doors Hal
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29-07-2016, 01:33 AM
RE: Open the Pod Bay Doors Hal
But it is about her body, and her choice. That's the entire point I'm trying to illustrate here, and which you keep dodging.

Far from being "irrelevant", it's the only actual issue that matters in this discussion: under what circumstances can we (or can we at all) justify invading the personal bodily integrity of a citizen?

I have tried to show you why this is the question at stake, and you refuse to acknowledge it, presumably because it destroys the point you think you are making. "My body, my choice" asserts that we do not have the right to deny to women in reproductive matters the same level of bodily integrity we would expect for ourselves in other medical matters. I wholeheartedly concur with this.

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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29-07-2016, 02:18 AM
RE: Open the Pod Bay Doors Hal
(29-07-2016 01:33 AM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  But it is about her body, and her choice. That's the entire point I'm trying to illustrate here, and which you keep dodging.

Far from being "irrelevant", it's the only actual issue that matters in this discussion: under what circumstances can we (or can we at all) justify invading the personal bodily integrity of a citizen?

I have tried to show you why this is the question at stake, and you refuse to acknowledge it, presumably because it destroys the point you think you are making. "My body, my choice" asserts that we do not have the right to deny to women in reproductive matters the same level of bodily integrity we would expect for ourselves in other medical matters. I wholeheartedly concur with this.

I don't have a problem with your position as long as you would also be okay with a sentient space ship exercising its bodily integrity by expelling its human crew into the vacuum of space. But if you are not willing to accept the "my body my choice" argument for sentient machines, it becomes hypocritical to accept it for women.
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29-07-2016, 02:28 AM
RE: Open the Pod Bay Doors Hal
Facepalm
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29-07-2016, 05:28 AM
RE: Open the Pod Bay Doors Hal
(29-07-2016 01:06 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  I didn't start this thread to argue that abortion was wrong. I started it to demonstrate that an argument people use to defend pro-abortion rights is flawed.

And you have failed on every level.

(29-07-2016 01:06 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  When you ask questions about abortion and they have nothing to do with the subject of this thread, its not a dodge if I ignore your irrealavent question.

Since the subject of the thread is abortion, questions about abortion are probably relevant.

(29-07-2016 01:06 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  The reason the "my body my choice" argument is garbage is because it only makes sense when you are not the violinist or Dave.

I notice you fail to address my argument that your opinion is irrelevant. The same points support the position that a woman has the right to choose because it is her body.

Help for the living. Hope for the dead. ~ R.G. Ingersoll

Freedom offers opportunity. Opportunity confers responsibility. Responsibility to use the freedom we enjoy wisely, honestly and humanely. ~ Noam Chomsky
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29-07-2016, 07:47 AM
RE: Open the Pod Bay Doors Hal
(29-07-2016 02:18 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  But if you are not willing to accept the "my body my choice" argument for sentient machines, it becomes hypocritical to accept it for women.

This is what I mentioned on page one.
You are dishonestly presenting two different analogies as the same to get you to a point where you can somehow get someone to agree that the "my body" argument is garbage.
Gotcha!
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29-07-2016, 09:31 AM
RE: Open the Pod Bay Doors Hal
(28-07-2016 10:29 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(28-07-2016 09:45 PM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  As someone has already noted, that was not the scenario in the movie.

You are nit picking. The scenario doesn't have to match the movie exactly. The movie is just an interesting/entertaining way to convey that violinist type arguments are only compelling if you have no fear of every being the violinist.

The Hal type thought experiment shows there is something seriously wrong with "Its my body therefore it is my choice" line of argumentation.

No it doesn't. All you've demonstrated by your stupid false analogy and lack of definitions, is, that like many patronizing ignorant OLD men, you feel the NEED to tell women how to handle their reproductive lives, (which is actually rather creepy). And you utterly failed to make any link to the Constitution.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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29-07-2016, 10:13 AM
RE: Open the Pod Bay Doors Hal
(28-07-2016 07:07 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  I am arguing that this argument:

[Image: tumblr_m5gip4ewwg1qiou2ro1_250.png]

Is garbage.

You are an odious cunt.
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29-07-2016, 10:19 AM
RE: Open the Pod Bay Doors Hal
(28-07-2016 07:09 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  
(28-07-2016 05:48 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  You are burying your head into the sand. It doesn't matter that a HAL 9000 doesn't exist today. The concept of it exists and that allows us to construct moral scenarios to see if our thinking is consistent.

You shouldn't have to change your position about the "Its My body, therefore it is my choice" argument because technology advances.

So you're implying that your body, Blowjob's body, is not your own therefore you don't have a choice if another life can exist, can survive from the body you have? That your body can give life to another you have no say so in the matter? Is this what you're asking?

Well Blowme, you have a kidney that can give life to another, you have an extra eye, you have parts of your body you can donate to give life to other people dying from various diseases. Why aren't you volunteering your body parts to save another life? If you're body isn't your own and you don't have a choice then it should be legal to harvest Blowme's body parts. Lets cough up a kidney Blowme.

Or what about a law saving ticks, which are more sentient than collection of fetal cells that hasn't yet developed a central nervous system. Doesn't matter if the tick is transmitting Lyme disease which will attack Blowjob's CNS and affect the quality of his own life. After all, all life is precious and must be preserved.
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29-07-2016, 10:23 AM
RE: Open the Pod Bay Doors Hal
(28-07-2016 07:29 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  The "my body my choice" argument depends on the premise that having dominion over a body allows one the choice to kill other beings that inhabit that body. If that premise were true, then its okay for sentient ships to eject/kill other beings which inhabit it.

You mean eject / kill other beings like tape worms?
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29-07-2016, 12:14 PM
RE: Open the Pod Bay Doors Hal
(29-07-2016 10:23 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(28-07-2016 07:29 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  The "my body my choice" argument depends on the premise that having dominion over a body allows one the choice to kill other beings that inhabit that body. If that premise were true, then its okay for sentient ships to eject/kill other beings which inhabit it.

You mean eject / kill other beings like tape worms?

An AI might just treat you like a tape worm if it buys into the "My body therefore My Choice" argument.
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