Opioid "epidemics"?
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22-06-2017, 09:36 AM
Opioid "epidemics"?
Wasn't sure where to put this, but decided I want more a scientific opinion than a political one, so here goes.

Recently, I've been seeing A LOT of articles about evil Pharma and the big opioid addiction epidemics. The thing is, as far I was aware, we still do not have another type of painkiller and everything we have so far is based on the way opium works. If this is case (please, do correct me if I'm wrong, I'm really looking for an answer on this), what's with the demonisation of what is for MANY the only thing that makes their lives even remotely livable. I mean, there are people living with severe chronic pain, what are they supposed to do?

People have abused EVERYTHING that could possibly be abused, why the sudden (or maybe not so sudden) hatred for opioids?

And seeing as we have some really smart and knowledgeable folk here, I'd truly appreciate opinions and expertise on this.

"E se non passa la tristezza con altri occhi la guarderò."
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22-06-2017, 09:46 AM
RE: Opioid "epidemics"?
Rich white kids are dying so it must be the pharmaceutical companies and doctors who are to blame. It's certainly not the fault of the people who don't follow the guidelines of their prescriptions. So the only solution is obviously to have a nanny state and tell people in horrible pain to take Advil and do yoga.
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22-06-2017, 10:12 AM
RE: Opioid "epidemics"?
Opioids are widely used by the elderly to commit rational suicide. It's written off as "accidental overdose", people get to collect insurance monies, and the opioid epidemic gets blamed and adds numbers. Nuts.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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22-06-2017, 10:12 AM (This post was last modified: 22-06-2017 10:23 AM by RearViewMirror.)
RE: Opioid "epidemics"?
The ease of access to these types of drugs is what I see as the main issue. I'm a huge marijuana advocate as it has been shown to alleviate pain without the issue of overdosing on opioids. I've been clean and sober for 6 years now. I freely admit that I used percocet because I liked the feeling that it gave me. My Dr. would hand them out like candy so it was no issue with me getting my hands on them. In reality pain pills are a type of synthetic heroin. Back before the elderly were overdosing and causing damage to their liver they came in 10/500mg. The 500mg was for the acetaminophen (which in reality is the only "pain killer" in pain pills) and the 10 was the opioid mg. Once they figured out that the elderly were taking pain pills and also tylenol they dropped the acetaminophen down to 325 mg to make it harder for an overdose or damage to their liver to happen.

Now... What this did for me is allow me to take more as you are only recommended 4000mg of acetaminophen per day. The issues was I was drinking at the time also so I remember sitting down and doing math to try to figure out how many pain pills I could take and how much I could drink without fucking up my liver. Looking back that is extremely sad but that is where I was at the time. It took me hitting rock bottom to finally break free of any addiction but, if I'm honest, I still miss the feeling that the pain pills gave me. I admitted to my Dr. what I was doing and made him draft up a contract that he is not allowed to prescribe me pain pills unless I lose a limb or something major. To his credit he has done just that and the only prescription that I get now is for ibuprofen.

So to answer your question in a long round about way is, pain pills are extremely addictive. The only pain killer in pain pills is the acetaminophen and the opioid "basically" just makes you forget about the pain. I came damn close to overdosing on them that night I hit rock bottom. I'll never touch them again.

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22-06-2017, 10:17 AM
RE: Opioid "epidemics"?
Here is article (little dated) that may help you, even if it isn't exactly on subject.

Depending on who is doing demonizing answer would be vastly different. Could be competitors where answer is obvious - their drug bad, our good. Could be politicians trying to score point as noble sheriffs fighting with addictions. Or just people lacking in empathy reading some shit and misunderstanding even it. There is also small possibility of religious wackos claiming that pain is gift from god or some kind of trial - such lunatics I can easily imagine demonizing drugs.

Ultimately I think it comes to lack of empathy and authoritarian tendencies - every (exaggeration is intended) uneducated clown thinks he know best and gramps told him that real men don't need drugs so he - knowing best - will save those soft whiners from abusing substance they allegedly don't need.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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22-06-2017, 10:18 AM
RE: Opioid "epidemics"?
NSAIDS have major issues.

I just am recovering from a stomach ulcer caused by NSAID consumption to combat arthritis in cold weather. Using recommended dosages. I wouldn't wish it on anyone - a whole other kind of excruciating pain lurking there.

There are no decent pain pills.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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22-06-2017, 10:19 AM
RE: Opioid "epidemics"?
The point of the epidemic is not that those people who severly depend on opioids due to chronical pain are getting addicted, its the fact that people with *normal* tooth aches or similarly mundane shit get opioid prescriptions. After taking the shit for too long, they get addicted, but the doc doesnt want to give them more. Guess where they go next (hint: dealer).

I watched a docu about this problem, and the underlying problem seems to have been big pharma and one of its newest products they were promoting a cuple of years ago, Oxycodone: An opioid that didint have to be administered evey few hours, but one dose could be taken over a longer period of time, and thus it wouldnt get you addicted (and make docs work easier by having you less around him after giving you this *awesome* stuff)....at least thats what they said. This way it was very agressively marketed to the doctors, who in return prescribed it like fucking M&Ms.

Long story short: Oxy was developed and marketed like Heroin in the early 20th century: An opioid being more effective but less addictive than Morphine. Then it was put on the market for everyone (who clearly didnt need it at all). Go figure.

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22-06-2017, 10:23 AM (This post was last modified: 22-06-2017 11:05 AM by Vera.)
RE: Opioid "epidemics"?
Um, acetaminophen is not what people are foaming in the mouth about (and it can have some really serious side-effects when taken too long). Nor does it really help with pain. It IS the opioids that "make you forget about the pain" - this is the WHOLE point. We don't have anything else BUT the mechanism opium uses to *alleviate* pain.

Also, the fact it can be abused is still not a good enough answer. Like I said, EVERYTHING can and has been abused. And seeing as we do NOT have an alternative yet...

Yes, marijuana should be legalised, yes it certainly helps. No, I don't think it can replace a stronger painkiller for more serious cases.

ETA: Sorry, Dom. Sounds horrible. NSAIDS have NEVER worked for me.

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22-06-2017, 10:30 AM
RE: Opioid "epidemics"?
Opioids are white-collar. Someone who takes Oxycotin without a prescription, and someone else taking heroin, are doing basically the same thing. But the social acceptance of one is vastly different than the other.

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22-06-2017, 10:34 AM
RE: Opioid "epidemics"?
Only, opioids actually have a primary reason for existing which is NOT the entertainment (or however you want to call it) value.

The fact that people would abuse anything that comes their way shouldn't mean that people living in excruciating pain should be denied the only thing we have so far that can help them.

"E se non passa la tristezza con altri occhi la guarderò."
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