Organic Foods dirty little secret
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27-05-2015, 01:59 PM
RE: Organic Foods dirty little secret
I don't care about the label. I do tend to favor locally grown stuff that's in season.


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27-05-2015, 02:02 PM
RE: Organic Foods dirty little secret
(27-05-2015 01:59 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  I don't care about the label. I do tend to favor locally grown stuff that's in season.

Fun (?) fact: in most parts of the world most locally-grown crops are more carbon-intensive to produce than industrially-produced goods that may have travelled several thousand kilometres.

There are parallel arguments to be made in favour of it - economics or biodiversity, say - but, yeah. Optimising food production is not a simple issue.

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27-05-2015, 02:09 PM
RE: Organic Foods dirty little secret
My food attitude is simple:

If it was eaten some 100 years ago, it's good to eat today. Our bodies have evolved processing it.

It's not good to eat anything in excess.

Food additives and pesticides have not been tested long term and I avoid them.

And yes, the stuff I grow in my garden does taste better, it has the full sugar content. Veggies and fruit are supposed to be sweet, but they lose the sweetness during storage and/or because they are not ripened properly. Of course there are years when the weather doesn't cooperate and produce isn't up to it's usual flavor.

There is not near enough testing of things that are used in or in conjunction with our food. No testing of long term effects, no testing of interactions. Even once things like food colorings or types of plastics are known to cause cancer, it takes years to remove them from the food supply.

So I am sticking with food that has not been tampered with as best I can. Tastes better, too.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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27-05-2015, 02:22 PM
RE: Organic Foods dirty little secret
I only want to eat superfoods. And by that, I mean foods that have been so genetically modified, that they will never need pesticides in the first place. I'm all about that intelligent GMO.
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27-05-2015, 02:26 PM
RE: Organic Foods dirty little secret
(27-05-2015 02:09 PM)Dom Wrote:  My food attitude is simple:

If it was eaten some 100 years ago, it's good to eat today. Our bodies have evolved processing it.

It's not good to eat anything in excess.

Food additives and pesticides have not been tested long term and I avoid them.

And yes, the stuff I grow in my garden does taste better, it has the full sugar content. Veggies and fruit are supposed to be sweet, but they lose the sweetness during storage and/or because they are not ripened properly. Of course there are years when the weather doesn't cooperate and produce isn't up to it's usual flavor.

There is not near enough testing of things that are used in or in conjunction with our food. No testing of long term effects, no testing of interactions. Even once things like food colorings or types of plastics are known to cause cancer, it takes years to remove them from the food supply.

So I am sticking with food that has not been tampered with as best I can. Tastes better, too.

Yep. "It tastes better".

Perhaps it's not that it's "organic" which makes the food taste better, but due to a higher nutrient content in the soil relative to the depleting soil on which industrial agriculture is based. Or the slower maturation time allowing relatively higher nutrient uptake than IA counterparts, rather than tasteless things like dyes...

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27-05-2015, 02:39 PM
RE: Organic Foods dirty little secret
Organic has nothing to do with flavor at all.

The produce only tastes better for a short time. The sooner after picking you eat, the better the flavor. Refrigerate it or leave it sitting too long and the flavors diminish.

And you are likely right about the soil, mine gets a top layer of rich compost every year before planting.

Also, the varieties make a difference. Veggies used to be cultivated for flavor - now they are bred to be disease resistant and to have tough skins for ease of harvest and handling etc. I mostly raise heirloom varieties - and plant several different ones so that if I do get a pest it will only affect parts of the crop.

I do grow completely organic, since I am not surrounded by gardens/farms that kill all insects, I have a healthy balance - the bugs eat each other and the birds eat them too. I have never had insect damage that was big enough to bother me. I grow in raised beds and there are next to no weeds.

I am a lazy gardener - and since I live in a natural environment practicing no interference is the easiest.


BTW, the criteria for organic certification are quite explicit: http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?c=e...ain_02.tpl

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27-05-2015, 02:40 PM
RE: Organic Foods dirty little secret
(27-05-2015 02:09 PM)Dom Wrote:  My food attitude is simple:

If it was eaten some 100 years ago, it's good to eat today. Our bodies have evolved processing it.

It's not good to eat anything in excess.

Food additives and pesticides have not been tested long term and I avoid them.

And yes, the stuff I grow in my garden does taste better, it has the full sugar content. Veggies and fruit are supposed to be sweet, but they lose the sweetness during storage and/or because they are not ripened properly. Of course there are years when the weather doesn't cooperate and produce isn't up to it's usual flavor.

There is not near enough testing of things that are used in or in conjunction with our food. No testing of long term effects, no testing of interactions. Even once things like food colorings or types of plastics are known to cause cancer, it takes years to remove them from the food supply.

So I am sticking with food that has not been tampered with as best I can. Tastes better, too.

Mass-market varietals are bred for durability and longevity - not taste. So, if you (or someone local to you) is actually growing different crop breeds, they will taste different. And probably better. I say probably because taste is, naturally enough, a matter of taste. Tongue

The wider alternative to cutting-edge biotechnology is mass starvation. I like gardening too, when I've got the real estate for it, but the energy input per unit of caloric or nutritional output is astronomically higher for what I grow in my backyard versus what I grab off the shelf at the supermarket.

And indeed, there is nothing in any modern human's diet that can be traced more than a century or two backwards, and that's way too short a timescale to be speaking of evolutionary adaptations. Likewise, the difference between 21st century and 19th century practices re: food production are far, far more quantitative than qualitative.

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27-05-2015, 02:48 PM
RE: Organic Foods dirty little secret
(27-05-2015 02:40 PM)cjlr Wrote:  
(27-05-2015 02:09 PM)Dom Wrote:  My food attitude is simple:

If it was eaten some 100 years ago, it's good to eat today. Our bodies have evolved processing it.

It's not good to eat anything in excess.

Food additives and pesticides have not been tested long term and I avoid them.

And yes, the stuff I grow in my garden does taste better, it has the full sugar content. Veggies and fruit are supposed to be sweet, but they lose the sweetness during storage and/or because they are not ripened properly. Of course there are years when the weather doesn't cooperate and produce isn't up to it's usual flavor.

There is not near enough testing of things that are used in or in conjunction with our food. No testing of long term effects, no testing of interactions. Even once things like food colorings or types of plastics are known to cause cancer, it takes years to remove them from the food supply.

So I am sticking with food that has not been tampered with as best I can. Tastes better, too.

Mass-market varietals are bred for durability and longevity - not taste. So, if you (or someone local to you) is actually growing different crop breeds, they will taste different. And probably better. I say probably because taste is, naturally enough, a matter of taste. Tongue

The wider alternative to cutting-edge biotechnology is mass starvation. I like gardening too, when I've got the real estate for it, but the energy input per unit of caloric or nutritional output is astronomically higher for what I grow in my backyard versus what I grab off the shelf at the supermarket.

And indeed, there is nothing in any modern human's diet that can be traced more than a century or two backwards, and that's way too short a timescale to be speaking of evolutionary adaptations. Likewise, the difference between 21st century and 19th century practices re: food production are far, far more quantitative than qualitative.

Re the energy input - it is more troublesome to drive into town to buy stuff than to walk out back and grab some. I spend about 2 hours in the spring adding a layer of compost, and two hours again sticking plants in the ground. Then I turn on the drip irrigation and come back when it's ready to eat.

Like I said, I am a lazy gardener.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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27-05-2015, 03:48 PM
RE: Organic Foods dirty little secret
(26-05-2015 09:59 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(26-05-2015 09:41 AM)jennybee Wrote:  I still prefer (and do) by organic. I just don't want the pesticides. I'm vegan and fruits/veggies are a large part of my diet. Trader Joe's sells a really good fruit and veggie wash.

Except there is no noticeable difference between the Organic and non-organic. It has always been a scam to prey on fear.

http://www.trueactivist.com/study-this-i...ampaign=sh

*YAWN*

It's my decision to eat organic foods. I wish people who don't eat it would just be happy with their own decision and stop trying to make themselves feel better by convincing themselves by telling others that there is no difference except cost.

It's the same tired arguments again and again.

As usual I'll just reply that for me it's not just about pesticides but also probability of not being vulnerable to the next food scare because of the intense commercial pressure to produce food as cheaply as possible at the expense of quality and health concerns.
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27-05-2015, 04:02 PM
RE: Organic Foods dirty little secret
Of course when I grow my own soft fruit and it has a load of pests, I use an organic pesticide rather than a systematic synthetic pesticide that soaks into the leaves and fruit for a long time to provide long term protection against living creatures. I don't ever have people posting studies funded by vested interests on discussion groups telling me how I should grow my own fruit. Yet these are exactly the same kind of pesticides that they say I am a fool not to be digesting if I buy it from the shops.
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