Personal experience argument
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06-07-2015, 01:53 PM
Personal experience argument
Hello, what would you answer to someone who argues a case for Christianity from a personal experience.
I have translated this story from another language, so there might be some typos.

Here's the story:

"I had been an atheist my whole life and thought religous people were just kinda dumb. My whole family were atheists and we didnt have any religous things at home etc. At some point of my life i decided "Okay, let's see in what do they actually believe". I listened to some religous radiostation while reading the bible, i didnt really get into it, but the topic was still sticking with me. One day i was thinking all the contradictions in the bible and still tried to pray from the bottom of my heart. After that something amazing happened.


While i was praying my whole body started to feel this weird power / presence and an amazing feeling of being loved. After that i started to hear this "talking" inside my head, but it wasnt really "talking". If telepathy was real, that's propably how i would explain it to feel. The voice told me it was an angel, but didnt point to any character etc, it was like the angel itself was the message from god, or god or something like that.But in that moment it was very logical. At first it was calming me down and saying multiple times "There is nothing to fear, everything is fine". Even saying it like that, it comes out a little clumsy, because the situation was very non-linear. Just afterwards i have been putting it into a linear order in my head. So i will try to explain it clearly and to dress it so human's could understand it better.


Well, right there it was letting me ask all kinda questions. Every question got answered in a second and i didnt need to ask any follow up questions because all the answers were so perfect. I asked when Jesus is coming back and why did he come in the first place. The most important answer for me was that one of my good friend had passed away couple years ago and i asked how is he doing and God answered "He has been saved, and everything is fine for him."
It was really amazing since i never thought my friend was religous at all.


When i asked why Jesus came for the first time at the point that he did, the answer was simple: "Because the time was right." After that i was able to go deeper in to the answer and i started to get the history of Jews and meaning of old testament. I remember this one thing that the journey of Jews and God
started about 6000 years ago. This is actually something i didnt know back then and got goosebumps when at some point it caught my eye that the calendar of jews start from the year 3761 eaa, that has been the year thought to be the first year of creation of the world.


When i asked when Christ is coming back it was the bible answer "He comes when he needs to come" A lot of Christians think that there is a date when Christ is coming back, but that is not true. In our time we have free will and our actions will point when the time is right. It could take 10 years or 1000 years.


And what do i think about contradictions in the Bible now? Nothing. In the speech of god, bible was mentioned multiple times that the bible is written by humans and has many many errors because in our time human is a human, not god.
The old testament made it possible for Jesus to come for the first time and that's what happened. The new testament made it possible for Jesus to come for the second time, and that's what is going to happen.


How do i know it was God communicating with me? It got pretty clear that it was God. I have never experienced anything like that before. I don't have and never have had any mental health problems, so i can't blame it on that.
Well, whatever it was, my belief in Christ has been sealed for life, and there is no way i could believe otherwise anymore. Apparently God has some use for me, because the faith was brought so clearly to me.


I can remember how i was crying from all that absolute love that i felt when God was communicating."


But yeah, i havent felt any experience that powerful after that, couple of times i have felt being loved when praying, but havent experienced God's communication since.
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06-07-2015, 02:02 PM
RE: Personal experience argument
I never argue with a personal experience or revelation.

I simply explain why it might be why they believe it's never enough to convince me to believe on their word alone.

If they press I'll add that it's human nature to embellish facts or read more into things than there is.

Funny they always end up getting defensive. It's almost as though they are lying and desperate to convince me they're not.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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06-07-2015, 02:11 PM
RE: Personal experience argument
I would say nothing - I can't convince someone who thinks he is Napoleon that he is not, nor I can convince one who thinks god is real cause he feeling him that he is wrong. There is no point in wasting time with other's delusions.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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06-07-2015, 02:33 PM
RE: Personal experience argument
What i've noticed a lot of times when people tell about communicating with God, feeling the holy spirit etc,
they say that they were crying or in tears.

Crying triggers emotions and feelings, for example amazing feelings of joy and happiness, in many cases.
It also relieves stress and anxiety wich makes you feel relieved etc. Calms your body down in some sense.

Maybe that has something to do with the "Feeling loved" and "Feeling being blessed" etc.
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06-07-2015, 02:37 PM
RE: Personal experience argument
bottom line --- if it sounds like bullshit -- it probably is.


People lie - all the time.

They lie about sex.
They lie about money.
They lie about love.
And they even lie about being bestest buddies with the big cock-knocker who invented the universe.

Or do you think it's more likely that they really ARE???

If so - I've got a bridge I can let you have -- cheap....................

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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06-07-2015, 02:46 PM
RE: Personal experience argument
Hmmm...

"I had been an atheist my whole life and thought religous people were just kinda dumb. [SNIP] One day i was thinking all the contradictions in the bible and still tried to pray from the bottom of my heart. After that something amazing happened.

While i was praying..."

What an atheist. He/she was so atheist, she prayed "from the bottom of my heart."

The bastards can't even lie straight.
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06-07-2015, 02:55 PM
RE: Personal experience argument
(06-07-2015 02:46 PM)jockmcdock Wrote:  Hmmm...

"I had been an atheist my whole life and thought religous people were just kinda dumb. [SNIP] One day i was thinking all the contradictions in the bible and still tried to pray from the bottom of my heart. After that something amazing happened.

While i was praying..."

What an atheist. He/she was so atheist, she prayed "from the bottom of my heart."

The bastards can't even lie straight.

It may seem that he is lying (He might be, i don't know).
But what i think about the "I was thinking about the contradictions and still was praying." Maybe he prayed for a sign from god like "I know this all seems crazy but if you are real give me a sign" or something like that.

I believe that he is being honest of what he felt, but i'm not saying it was real what he felt. He could just be very delusional. I don't know.

Other factor why i don't think he is necessarily lying is because he is from a country that is very non-religous. (Let's just say that he's from Europe)
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06-07-2015, 03:09 PM
RE: Personal experience argument
Anecdotes are not evidence, they even admit it was a one-time event that was confined internally with no external witnesses. IOW- it was their imagination.

An example of someone coming up with stuff in their imagination is when they are patently wrong:

Quote:the calendar of jews start from the year 3761 eaa, that has been the year thought to be the first year of creation of the world

This is wrong, laughably wrong, so whatever his imagination was telling him, it was not the truth. This should set off all kinds of alarm bells, not acceptance of it's truth.

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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06-07-2015, 03:10 PM
RE: Personal experience argument
How old is the guy? Could be he never really thought that hard about this stuff, then decided to take it seriously. If not aware of critical thinking, can easily be misled. Christianity is designed as a mind trap.

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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06-07-2015, 03:22 PM
RE: Personal experience argument
(06-07-2015 01:53 PM)Talviomena Wrote:  Apparently God has some use for me, because the faith was brought so clearly to me.
Apparently the gods don't have a use for me because no faith has been brought to me.
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