Personal heroes that have insane or annoying beliefs.
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22-12-2012, 05:57 PM
RE: Personal heroes that have insane or annoying beliefs.
Ok, so it's harder than I remember to find easy examples of what I described. All the videos I'm finding are too long. What happened to all of the short videos? I also have no idea how to link a specific time in a video, but it doesn't matter because I don't feel like rewatching a bunch of hour long plus videos to back up my personal opinion.

The best I'm willing to do is say watch the "debate" with Dawkins and that horridly stupid woman Wendy Wright. Dawkins obviously destroys her because well.. she's a moron. But there's this hint of toying with her and intense humor. The video is hard to watch because really that woman is infuriating but I found it also hard to watch because of Dawkins, personally.

Also, I think that even though Hitch is absolutely right, I think he was very good at removing the wall of pretenses and just diving straight to an issue regardless of circumstances. For that I sometimes got the dickish vibe off of his debates or discussions. A good example I think is in this video at around the 2 minute mark, when talking about the deceased Jerry Falwell. Again I don't at all disagree with him in any way, but it's not how I think most people would go about discussing the issue on television.

Disagree with me all you like.

"I think of myself as an intelligent, sensitive human being with the soul of a clown which always forces me to blow it at the most important moments." -Jim Morrison
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22-12-2012, 06:02 PM
RE: Personal heroes that have insane or annoying beliefs.
(22-12-2012 05:57 PM)lucradis Wrote:  Ok, so it's harder than I remember to find easy examples of what I described. All the videos I'm finding are too long. What happened to all of the short videos? I also have no idea how to link a specific time in a video, but it doesn't matter because I don't feel like rewatching a bunch of hour long plus videos to back up my personal opinion.

The best I'm willing to do is say watch the "debate" with Dawkins and that horridly stupid woman Wendy Wright. Dawkins obviously destroys her because well.. she's a moron. But there's this hint of toying with her and intense humor. The video is hard to watch because really that woman is infuriating but I found it also hard to watch because of Dawkins, personally.

Also, I think that even though Hitch is absolutely right, I think he was very good at removing the wall of pretenses and just diving straight to an issue regardless of circumstances. For that I sometimes got the dickish vibe off of his debates or discussions. A good example I think is in this video at around the 2 minute mark, when talking about the deceased Jerry Falwell. Again I don't at all disagree with him in any way, but it's not how I think most people would go about discussing the issue on television.

Disagree with me all you like.


Thanks, you provided an example and reasons - that's all I was asking.

Now we can disagree on it. Big Grin I thought he showed incredible patience with her.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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22-12-2012, 06:11 PM
RE: Personal heroes that have insane or annoying beliefs.
Oh I agree, personally I would have had a very hard time not taking a dump right there while she was talking just to show her I could spew shit just as hard. But I also think he let it go on just because he was sort of making fun of her.

"I think of myself as an intelligent, sensitive human being with the soul of a clown which always forces me to blow it at the most important moments." -Jim Morrison
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22-12-2012, 06:18 PM
RE: Personal heroes that have insane or annoying beliefs.
(22-12-2012 06:11 PM)lucradis Wrote:  Oh I agree, personally I would have had a very hard time not taking a dump right there while she was talking just to show her I could spew shit just as hard. But I also think he let it go on just because he was sort of making fun of her.
Maybe, but I saw him trying to get past the brick wall of ignorance.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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22-12-2012, 07:06 PM
RE: Personal heroes that have insane or annoying beliefs.
(22-12-2012 06:11 PM)lucradis Wrote:  Oh I agree, personally I would have had a very hard time not taking a dump right there while she was talking just to show her I could spew shit just as hard. But I also think he let it go on just because he was sort of making fun of her.
I saw the same reaction any other sane person would have had.

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22-12-2012, 10:19 PM
RE: Personal heroes that have insane or annoying beliefs.
These are the ones that come to mind at 4 in the morning. I'm sure there's more:

Terry Pratchett: Great writer, brilliant satirist, awesome sense of humour, wants to die rather than face Alzheimer's* Sad

Christopher Hitchens: Funny, charismatic, great speaker and writer. Had some really backwards opinions about women.

CS Lewis: I simply loved the Chronicles of Narnia as a child. Found out later he was a crazy Christian fundie with all the insanity that comes with it.

My Father: The man responsible for my critical thinking and me becoming an atheist: Has a tiny bit of a persecution complex (believes the world is unjustly racist against his people)*

*In both these cases, I can't really judge them because I have not experienced what they have, nor seen what they have seen.

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23-12-2012, 01:52 AM
RE: Personal heroes that have insane or annoying beliefs.
Some of the figures I'm able to comment on:

Drafters of the US constitution. I approach these people the same way I approach the people who wrote the good parts to the Ten Commandments, or the legal framers of ancient Greek democracies - they were all hypocrites. The vast majority of society was exempted from their legal frameworks- it only applied to a very few people, until much later.

Dawkins. I have not been presented with any material to show him as abusive, or ignorant when interacting with people.

Hitchens. Great silver tongue. Very well spoken- knew how to talk and debate. I haven't seen anything misogynist of his, but I am aware of his support for wars in the Middle East.

I don't have too many people I admire, or hold as role models. I just focus on a specific positive trait that should be acknowledged and emulated. If they have some sort of disastrous failing, I think I put them out of my mind completely. I think the last instance of this was with the author of Enders Game. I liked the book greatly, but it turned out the author was religious (mormon?), anti evolution, etc. Same with Michael Crichton and his anti-climate change beliefs. I can't enjoy their works any more, even if I tried.
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23-12-2012, 02:54 AM
RE: Personal heroes that have insane or annoying beliefs.
What if you're your own personal hero, and you're super awesome in every way?

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23-12-2012, 03:11 AM (This post was last modified: 23-12-2012 08:06 AM by Vera.)
RE: Personal heroes that have insane or annoying beliefs.
(22-12-2012 10:19 PM)Smooshmonster Wrote:  Terry Pratchett: Great writer, brilliant satirist, awesome sense of humour, wants to die rather than face Alzheimer's* Sad
I think that would make me, personally, admire him even more. I would also want to die if I had Alzheimer's or any other form of dementia. This is the most horrible thing I can imagine for my future. If you face it, it's not even a fair fight anyway - it wins every time and its victory is horrendous.

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23-12-2012, 05:57 AM
RE: Personal heroes that have insane or annoying beliefs.
I don't think I consider him a role model or hero. I see the characters in his books as such in certain ways. I am talking about Orson scott Card, who is of course a mormon. I like the way he writes though.
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