Perspective on quality of life and NASA.
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
05-08-2012, 03:59 AM (This post was last modified: 05-08-2012 04:04 AM by Vosur.)
RE: Perspective on quality of life and NASA.
"Although I agree with you for the most part, I don't see how we can change anything at the current situation. They own so much money that they do not need to care about anyone else. What are you going to do? Organize peaceful demonstrations? Recent history has shown how well that works out: violent opression by the police, ignoring the complaints of those demonstrating, etc."

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...#pid145039

Doesn't state that I think rich people are evil, awful, psychopaths or do not care about anyone else. The only point I made in the post you're referring to, is that they (millionaires/billionaires) are rich enough that it's not necessary for them to care about anyone else.

Better luck next time. Drinking Beverage

[Image: 7oDSbD4.gif]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-08-2012, 04:02 AM
RE: Perspective on quality of life and NASA.
(05-08-2012 03:44 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  Nitpicking again.
What is with people on this forum and constant nitpicking.
It was well implied that the goods (money) was not stolen.

Again. I was addressing a confined statement that didn't involve the acquisition of the wealth; it was restricted to the concept that ownership meant everything.

Nitpicking? It's called accuracy. If accuracy isn't your thing, and you'd sooner fly with whatever random thought passes through your brain... then don't get annoyed at people who don't fly budget class on Thought Airlines ™.

(05-08-2012 03:44 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  I'm talking mostly about the OP, but the economically left in general yes.
It isn't a bad conclusion. The economically left tend to be poorer people and they tend to have a sort of communist thinking that wealth should be evenly distributed.

So... your complaint about the left is that they tend to be... the left? Blink

(05-08-2012 03:44 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  One can add in personal experiences, pretty much any economical thread from this forum, media etc.. and you can safely come to the conclusion that economically left people are annoyed that someone has more then them and they feel that they should have more then what they currently do because of it.
Like Thatcher said, they would rather the poorer be poorer if it meant that the richer were less rich.

You actually quoted Thatcher. Consider

I'm very far left. I'm not even remotely Communistic... I'm all about liberalism and personal freedoms, not the authoritarian Marxist model.

I have no problem whatsoever about rich people being rich. It's the human condition. We're a power-cut away from reverting to the social structure of chimpanzees. Some people will always judge their value (compared to other people) based on how much money they possess. I have no interest in kicking that crutch away from such pathetically shallow people.

I do, however, care about how the poorest are treated. Not because I'm amongst them, but because every society should be judged on how it treats its most down-trodden.

Instead of trying to parrot Thatcher, try reading a bit of John Rawls.
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Red Celt's post
05-08-2012, 04:08 AM
RE: Perspective on quality of life and NASA.
(04-08-2012 09:33 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  Jeff, this is a simple case of "I'm poor he should be poor too" jealousy attitude.

Yes, that's how it sounds to me too
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Jeff's post
05-08-2012, 04:15 AM
RE: Perspective on quality of life and NASA.
(04-08-2012 10:46 PM)Red Celt Wrote:  "Hello, sir? Yes. This is the police. We're calling about the burglary you reported last week. Yes. We've traced it to a burglar that we're familiar with. Your TV, Xbox, iPhone, iPad and laptop... he still has them. What? No. I'm sorry, but you can't get them back. They're sitting in his apartment, if they belong to anyone, it's him. By rights of ownership, he can do whatever he wants with them."

If the money was stolen then of course I don't think that it's theirs to keep, but I didn't see that it was stolen. Again, I'd like to see a link to a source on this.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-08-2012, 04:39 AM
RE: Perspective on quality of life and NASA.
The OP was very poorly written, with not one piece of supporting documentation, and as Earmuffs has pointed out contains the most elementary economic fallacies.
On top of that, it is implied above, that if one disagrees with the OP, that one is somehow a troll or does not care about the planet, and that if one disagrees about somethings one is being a bully. Actually there is vast amount of unsupported assumptions in the OP. As was pointed out, money does not "sit" in banks. The banks have to provide some return at least, and just sitting there would do the bank no good. It's invested in something. Where are the studies that showed you how it was being used. Where are the studies that showed you their mental status was that of a psychopath ? The OP is just a 100 % prejudicial assertions without a shred of supporting evidence. How do you actually know these people came from wealthy families, and even if they did, is that a bad thing, and are you saying YOU should not pass on the wealth YOU have earned to YOUR children ? Most of the wealth in the world created in the last 25 years, was created by the geometric increase in value in technology stocks, which was begun, just as the Gates fortune with a small investment, and the geometric increase in value, takes NOTHING away from someone else. There is no "pie" that gets divided, with others getting less, because a wealthy person gets more. Furthermore, one could actually make a case for concentrated wealth, because, the average propensity to save is higher, in the wealthy individual, than the non, thus more money is invested in jobs. So the "the money is not doing anything for anybody" is totally false, as is the "psychopath" thing, unless proof is provided. Where does the information about the "military equipment" information come from exactly ? How do YOU know it doesn't work, and what percentage doesn't work ? How do you know that. More of the defense budget goes for salaries and benefits, than procurement, but then actually looking at details would not serve you over-generalizations, now would it ? Capitalism is hardly 6000 years old. Just more proof you never even took high school Econ.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_bu...ted_States

Is the sentence, "I hear lots of people complaining about social issues that is a matter of them prying into everyone else business", supposed to make sense ? The poor use of English makes anyone wonder if you ever went to school at all ? The OP is so full of over-generalized nonsequiturs, it's not even worth reading. What "a top oil company" makes in a day is totally irrelevant. Whether a return on investment is fair or not, depends on the capital invested. Did you check that ? Of course not. Getting your sermon ready did not include that. No one is forcing you to buy the slip cover for your phone.
How do you know what "politicians care about ? Did you ask any of them ? Do you actually know any ?

In fact YOU are doing the preaching here, and expecting the sheep to swallow your unsupported bullshit, which is a hell of a lot more like religion, than those who push back, and ask for evidence. How exactly have you determined the bullshit about the "mental disorders" ? Have you given them MMPI's ? How do you know the wealthy people you rant about are the SAME people who are "religious" ?

Push back is not "bullying", or "trolling". If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen.

BTW, I in no way support military waste, or not increasing taxes on the wealthy, but unsupported ranting with no facts is unacceptable.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Bucky Ball's post
05-08-2012, 04:39 AM (This post was last modified: 05-08-2012 04:44 AM by earmuffs.)
RE: Perspective on quality of life and NASA.
(05-08-2012 03:59 AM)Vosur Wrote:  "Although I agree with you for the most part, I don't see how we can change anything at the current situation. They own so much money that they do not need to care about anyone else. What are you going to do? Organize peaceful demonstrations? Recent history has shown how well that works out: violent opression by the police, ignoring the complaints of those demonstrating, etc."

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...#pid145039

Doesn't state that I think rich people are evil, awful, psychopaths or do not care about anyone else. The only point I made in the post you're referring to, is that they (millionaires/billionaires) are rich enough that it's not necessary for them to care about anyone else.

Better luck next time. Drinking Beverage

Bolded. Drinking Beverage

Quote:I have no problem whatsoever about rich people being rich.

It certainly doesn't come across as such.

Quote:I do, however, care about how the poorest are treated.

Then do something about it. Just don't expect people to do it for you.

Quote: but because every society should be judged on how it treats its most down-trodden

It's called welfare!
If you are unemployed you get free money. FREE MONEY.
Poor people get tax cuts, here it's something like 35K or 40K or something where if you are earning under it you effectively pay no tax (you pay tax, but you get more in financial aid, so it's like paying no tax).
This is what I mean by people feeling entitled to more. Because people don't understand that you are literally doing nothing for that money (unemployment, financial aid etc..). If you want to drop out of school and end up in some dead end shit job then that is your life choice, but don't expect people to hand you money you think you deserve.

It drives me up the fucking wall. People constantly bash the rich. Always. The rich pay the most taxes, the majority of the rich worked for their money and if it was inherited well lucky them (Them being born into a privileged family is NO DIFFERENT then you being born where you are in relation to some starving refugee in Africa). And when I say they worked for their money I mean they worked for it. They got their degree, they worked up the corporate ladder or they made the financial risk of starting their own business or whatever. They deserve what they get. Yet people who drop out of high school, get a safe 9-5 job at like $12 an hour or whatever and just work there forever CONSTANTLY bitch that those people are better off then them. WELL NO FUCKING SHIT!. All they do is bitch bitch bitch yet they do NOTHING to change it. Look at my mother for example. My parents were poor as shit, my mom had a really crap job and so when us kids got older rather then bitching about it complaining how poor they were she went back to university (at like 45years old) and now she's a primary school teacher and they're financially fine. In fact my dad who is a fucking machine when it comes to work but has recently been unable to work like he use to (basically, he's getting old) is able to do his job on an on-call basis starting next year (He's not one too retire). He never would have been able to do that if my mother never took the risk because she wanted to better herself and went and got her degree. They would be like everyone else, bitching about how life sucks, but now they're talking about how they want to do up the house.
Attitude, change it.

Edit: *applause for Bucky.* Amen good sir, a-fucking-men.

[Image: 3cdac7eec8f6b059070d9df56f50a7ae.jpg]
Now with 40% more awesome.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-08-2012, 04:44 AM
RE: Perspective on quality of life and NASA.
(05-08-2012 04:08 AM)Jeff Wrote:  
(04-08-2012 09:33 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  Jeff, this is a simple case of "I'm poor he should be poor too" jealousy attitude.

Yes, that's how it sounds to me too

Jeff, please don't fall into the same blinkered view that earmuffs has opted for. If you think that left-leaning views are all about jealousy, then you're totally failing to understand the left... which includes many who are economically comfortable. They just tend to care about people other than themselves. Radical idea (for some), I know.

(05-08-2012 04:15 AM)Jeff Wrote:  If the money was stolen then of course I don't think that it's theirs to keep, but I didn't see that it was stolen. Again, I'd like to see a link to a source on this.

You didn't mention the acquisition process, but tell me... how do you know that the money wasn't stolen? How do you know that the money was gathered in any ethical sense whatsoever? Greedy people let very few things get in the way of their greed.

If you can see a problem with a burglar keeping stolen property, you should also have a problem with a businessman who asset-stripped several businesses purely for the purpose of getting richer. In his wake, there will be others who have suffered bankruptcies, marriage breakdowns and suicides. This isn't airy-fairy leftist nonsense. Business deals don't involve ethics (unless the company PR sees a way of increasing market share by being publically charitable) if they get in the way of profits.
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-08-2012, 04:46 AM
RE: Perspective on quality of life and NASA.
(05-08-2012 04:39 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  Bolded. Drinking Beverage
I didn't see that coming. Drinking Beverage

The only one who is able to say which parts of his post I agree with is me. You don't even seem to realize that you're basing your accusations on your interpretation of which of his arguments I agree with, i.e. you have no rational basis.

[Image: 7oDSbD4.gif]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-08-2012, 04:54 AM
RE: Perspective on quality of life and NASA.
(05-08-2012 04:44 AM)Red Celt Wrote:  
(05-08-2012 04:08 AM)Jeff Wrote:  Yes, that's how it sounds to me too

Jeff, please don't fall into the same blinkered view that earmuffs has opted for. If you think that left-leaning views are all about jealousy, then you're totally failing to understand the left... which includes many who are economically comfortable. They just tend to care about people other than themselves. Radical idea (for some), I know.

(05-08-2012 04:15 AM)Jeff Wrote:  If the money was stolen then of course I don't think that it's theirs to keep, but I didn't see that it was stolen. Again, I'd like to see a link to a source on this.

You didn't mention the acquisition process, but tell me... how do you know that the money wasn't stolen? How do you know that the money was gathered in any ethical sense whatsoever? Greedy people let very few things get in the way of their greed.

If you can see a problem with a burglar keeping stolen property, you should also have a problem with a businessman who asset-stripped several businesses purely for the purpose of getting richer. In his wake, there will be others who have suffered bankruptcies, marriage breakdowns and suicides. This isn't airy-fairy leftist nonsense. Business deals don't involve ethics (unless the company PR sees a way of increasing market share by being publically charitable) if they get in the way of profits.

Hate to be nitpicky but I think you will find that Jeff was referring to this particular thread (the OP) and not left in general.

Well how do you know the money WAS stolen? Is it so hard to accept that the majority of rich people are rich through legit ways?
I mean seriously what planet are you living on? Do you think all rich people are criminals or something?

Quote:I didn't see that coming. Coffeedrinker

The only one who is able to say which parts of his post I agree with is me. You don't even seem to realize that you're basing your accusations on your interpretation of which of his arguments I agree with, i.e. you have no rational basis.

Then enlighten me because you're doing a Red Celt. That is, you come across as hating rich people yet when questioned on it you change your tone.

[Image: 3cdac7eec8f6b059070d9df56f50a7ae.jpg]
Now with 40% more awesome.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-08-2012, 05:02 AM
RE: Perspective on quality of life and NASA.
(05-08-2012 04:54 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  Then enlighten me because you're doing a Red Celt. That is, you come across as hating rich people yet when questioned on it you change your tone.

[Image: BeachMisanthropy_600.jpg]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: