Persuade an atheist
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15-04-2015, 08:54 PM
RE: Persuade an atheist
(15-04-2015 08:43 PM)The Theist Wrote:  
(15-04-2015 08:37 PM)Russ Wrote:  I think you'll find that a large number of atheists are plenty knowledgeable about the bible.
As Isaac Asimov said, “Properly read, the Bible is the most potent force for atheism ever conceived.”

I think that most atheists tend to look at the Bible through the eyes of the majority of believers. A big mistake, that. Let me just ask you one quick question. Does the soul die? Hint: Ezekiel 18:4

Oh boy, I guess you know how to interpret the bible "correctly".

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Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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15-04-2015, 08:55 PM
RE: Persuade an atheist
(15-04-2015 08:53 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  Talking with your friend on the subject of God and faith just might expose you to questions you can’t find the answer to.

Big Grin

Imagine that
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Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
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15-04-2015, 09:17 PM
RE: Persuade an atheist
(15-04-2015 08:53 PM)Russ Wrote:  Since I've yet to be presented with convincing evidence for the existence of souls, I guess I'd say they don't die, since something that doesn't exist, technically can't die.

Then you do exactly what I suggested the average atheist does. According to the Bible the soul is the life, the blood of any breathing creature, and it dies. Are you saying these things don't exist?

You see, the Greek philosophy of Socrates and Plato began to influence Jewish religious thinking about the time of Alexander The Great's conquest in 332 B.C.E.

[Image: scriptureb.jpg]

Image: Alexander The Great In The Temple Of Jerusalem, by Sebastiano Conca: 1736

It was only then that Jewish religious thinking began to speculate that the soul was immortal, just as Socrates and Plato did. Contrary to the Bible.

"Nepes [nephesh] is a term of far greater extension than our ‘soul,’ signifying life (Exodus 21.23; Deuteronomy 19.21) and its various vital manifestations: breathing (Genesis 35.18; Job 41.13, 21), blood (Genesis 9.4; Deuteronomy 12.23; Psalm 140:8 or Psalm 141:8), desire (2 Samuel 3.21; Proverbs 23.2). The soul in the O T means not a part of man, but the whole man - man as a living being. Similarly, in the N T it signifies human life: the life of an individual, conscious subject (Matthew 2.20; 6.25 / Luke 12.22-23; 14.26 / John 10:11, 15, 17; 13.37)." - 1967, Volume XIII, page 467.

"The concept of immortality is a product of Greek thinking, whereas the hope of a resurrection belongs to Jewish thought. . . . Following Alexander’s conquests Judaism gradually absorbed Greek concepts." - Dictionnaire Encyclopédique de la Bible (Valence, France; 1935), edited by Alexandre Westphal, Volume 2, page 557.

Plato quoting Socrates: "The soul, . . . if it departs pure, dragging with it nothing of the body, . . . goes away into that which is like itself, into the invisible, divine, immortal, and wise, and when it arrives there it is happy, freed from error and folly and fear . . . and all the other human ills, and . . . lives in truth through all after time with the gods." - Phaedo, 80, D, E; 81, A.

"The belief that the soul continues its existence after the dissolution of the body is a matter of philosophical or theological speculation rather than of simple faith, and is accordingly nowhere expressly taught in Holy Scripture." The Jewish Encyclopedia (1910), Volume VI, page 564.
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15-04-2015, 09:26 PM
RE: Persuade an atheist
The "I know the real message" theist.

Next.
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15-04-2015, 09:32 PM
RE: Persuade an atheist
(15-04-2015 09:26 PM)Fodder_From_The_Truth Wrote:  The "I know the real message" theist.

Next.

Or, from my perspective, the "I know the real message" atheist being presented with the facts, and the atheist dismissing them due to their own beliefs.
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15-04-2015, 09:35 PM
RE: Persuade an atheist
(15-04-2015 08:53 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  The final paragraph is interesting (aside from all the misspellings).

It's one of those all too common examples of someone making a point utterly oblivious to their having actually made a very strong case against their point. It happens most frequently by those who like the sound of their own voice but have never bothered to listen.
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15-04-2015, 09:41 PM
RE: Persuade an atheist
(15-04-2015 09:32 PM)The Theist Wrote:  Or, from my perspective, the "I know the real message" atheist being presented with the facts, and the atheist dismissing them due to their own beliefs.

The only "fact" that I will accept as evidence for a god is a direct physical encounter with the god itself. As one of My hobbies is writing fiction, I know how trivially easy it is to cobble together the real and the imaginary; as a result, I am utterly unconvinced by scripture of any kind.
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15-04-2015, 09:49 PM (This post was last modified: 15-04-2015 09:54 PM by Russ.)
RE: Persuade an atheist
(15-04-2015 09:17 PM)The Theist Wrote:  Then you do exactly what I suggested the average atheist does. According to the Bible the soul is the life, the blood of any breathing creature, and it dies. Are you saying these things don't exist?
If you are using 'things' to refer to souls, than yes, I don't see any evidence that they exist. I would also like to say that
(15-04-2015 09:17 PM)The Theist Wrote:  ...the life, the blood of any breathing creature...
Is somewhat vague. Could you define 'soul' it with more precision than your previous definition?

(30-03-2015 08:47 PM)Colourcraze Wrote:  IT'S THE HOLY GHOST oooOOOOOOOOOOooooooo
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15-04-2015, 09:50 PM
RE: Persuade an atheist
(15-04-2015 09:41 PM)Astreja Wrote:  The only "fact" that I will accept as evidence for a god is a direct physical encounter with the god itself. As one of My hobbies is writing fiction, I know how trivially easy it is to cobble together the real and the imaginary; as a result, I am utterly unconvinced by scripture of any kind.

For a god? Define god. Moses? Jesus? Satan? Molech? Tammuz? The Judges of Israel? Eric Clapton? Zeus? Baal? There are billions of gods, some exist or existed and some didn't or don't. What a remarkably obtuse statement to say that there isn't evidence for a god simply because it doesn't exist.

Zeus didn't exist. I don't believe in Zeus. I don't worship Zeus. Zeus is a god.
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15-04-2015, 09:51 PM
RE: Persuade an atheist
[double post]

(30-03-2015 08:47 PM)Colourcraze Wrote:  IT'S THE HOLY GHOST oooOOOOOOOOOOooooooo
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