Petition to ban Bishadi
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12-09-2012, 05:48 PM
RE: Petition to ban Bishadi
(12-09-2012 05:47 PM)Hughsie Wrote:  
(12-09-2012 05:44 PM)Stark Raving Wrote:  My intent isn't even to have me or Erx be able to ban. We would still approach it as a staff decision. The only deciding we would do is to decide if a ban represents what the forum team wants in general.

That's kinda what I meant. One of the reasons I think it's a good idea to essentially put all power in your hands is that you take that approach. You've never had to involve anyone else in decision making yet you do. It's part of what makes you such a good admin in my eyes.

Thanks man. That's nice to hear once in a while.

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12-09-2012, 06:08 PM
RE: Petition to ban Bishadi
(12-09-2012 05:31 PM)Stark Raving Wrote:  
Quote:(All rules subject to change without notice or reason.)

Copied from the rules.

Perhaps we should add something like, "the administration reserves the right to ban, delete, or edit memberships at their discretion."

It supplies that "out" when circumstances get foggy.

This rule disclaimer was what I thought of when I was reading Cuff's post and then thinking about the way Seth set things up here. It's not a democracy, he gave you the keys and left you in charge. In the early Wild West days of this forum, you were the gunslinging sheriff that was swinging the banhammer left and right to clear out the riff-raff. Eventually you gathered counselors around you in the form of mods and vets. And then you've even opened up debates and gathered opinions from all the forum members. And these are all good things. But at the end of the day, you're still the sheriff and you have the authority to enforce whatever rules you see fit, which can include cleaning house even when there might not be a specific rule violation. The check and balance to your power (and I guess mine since you've included me as your partner) is if we are unfair and become tyrranical jerks, pretty soon this place will empty out and we'll be ruling an empty empire. The key is to still listen to the voices of our forum team and the voices of the members and humble ourselves if need be, but also make the decisions on what we ultimately think is best for this community.

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
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12-09-2012, 07:38 PM
RE: Petition to ban Bishadi
can somebody point me to the rules? I can't find it anywhere Tongue

btw, don't we have a temporary ban sanction? maybe that could help to make those in the grey area to behave Smile

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12-09-2012, 07:50 PM
Petition to ban Bishadi
(12-09-2012 07:38 PM)nach_in Wrote:  can somebody point me to the rules? I can't find it anywhere Tongue

btw, don't we have a temporary ban sanction? maybe that could help to make those in the grey area to behave Smile

There's a sticky in the intro forum. You know about stickies don't you? Tongue

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
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12-09-2012, 07:52 PM
RE: Petition to ban Bishadi
(12-09-2012 07:50 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  
(12-09-2012 07:38 PM)nach_in Wrote:  can somebody point me to the rules? I can't find it anywhere Tongue

btw, don't we have a temporary ban sanction? maybe that could help to make those in the grey area to behave Smile

There's a sticky in the intro forum. You know about stickies don't you? Tongue

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12-09-2012, 08:31 PM
RE: Petition to ban Bishadi
(12-09-2012 07:52 PM)nach_in Wrote:  
(12-09-2012 07:50 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  There's a sticky in the intro forum. You know about stickies don't you? Tongue

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12-09-2012, 09:50 PM
RE: Petition to ban Bishadi
(12-09-2012 06:08 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  
(12-09-2012 05:31 PM)Stark Raving Wrote:  Copied from the rules.

Perhaps we should add something like, "the administration reserves the right to ban, delete, or edit memberships at their discretion."

It supplies that "out" when circumstances get foggy.

This rule disclaimer was what I thought of when I was reading Cuff's post and then thinking about the way Seth set things up here. It's not a democracy, he gave you the keys and left you in charge. In the early Wild West days of this forum, you were the gunslinging sheriff that was swinging the banhammer left and right to clear out the riff-raff. Eventually you gathered counselors around you in the form of mods and vets. And then you've even opened up debates and gathered opinions from all the forum members. And these are all good things. But at the end of the day, you're still the sheriff and you have the authority to enforce whatever rules you see fit, which can include cleaning house even when there might not be a specific rule violation. The check and balance to your power (and I guess mine since you've included me as your partner) is if we are unfair and become tyrranical jerks, pretty soon this place will empty out and we'll be ruling an empty empire. The key is to still listen to the voices of our forum team and the voices of the members and humble ourselves if need be, but also make the decisions on what we ultimately think is best for this community.

Well, that's a horse of a different colo(u)r--and I appreciate the clarification. I was under the impression that to get rid of someone, you had to find a way to shoehorn them into a Big Four violation. But if your hands aren't tied in that way and you can "clean house even when there might not be a specific rule violation," that's the "out" you need.

I do think it would be a good idea to put the "administration reserves the right to ban" wording in the Rules sticky.

BTW, Stark and Erx, I hope you didn't take my post as a slam. I have no problem whatsoever with any of the decisions you've made--you're doing a fine job. I was thinking about the future. But I see you've already got those bases covered. Cool

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12-09-2012, 10:20 PM (This post was last modified: 12-09-2012 11:02 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Petition to ban Bishadi
(12-09-2012 03:45 PM)cufflink Wrote:  The reason he was banned is spam: he was nailed for violating one of the Big Four No-no’s: Porn, Nudity, Threats, and Spam. According to our rules as I understand them, those are the things—and only the things—that will get you banned from TTA.

Was Bishadi a spammer? That depends on your definition of spam.

I trust Stark's call on what is spam. I can't say I know it when I see it.

(12-09-2012 03:45 PM)cufflink Wrote:  What Erx said in announcing Bishadi’s ban is significant:

Erxomai Wrote:In the end, we decided the health of this forum is more important to us than interpretations of specific rules. But, in keeping with the rules, we came to the decision that he had been warned not to flood the forum with threads of the same topic. As Logica so well summarized, he continued to do what he was asked not to. [Emphasis added.]

That, I think, hits the nail on the head: what trumps all other considerations should be the health of the forum. The thing that concerns me is that if we stick exclusively to the current mechanism for banning, we may not be able to protect the forum’s health down the road.

Stark is responsible for maintaining the health of the forum, always has been. He took it upon himself. I trust his instincts. I trust his instincts enough to be his Gunga Din. ... Can't say that for many.




As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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12-09-2012, 11:24 PM
RE: Petition to ban Bishadi
(12-09-2012 09:50 PM)cufflink Wrote:  
(12-09-2012 06:08 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  This rule disclaimer was what I thought of when I was reading Cuff's post and then thinking about the way Seth set things up here. It's not a democracy, he gave you the keys and left you in charge. In the early Wild West days of this forum, you were the gunslinging sheriff that was swinging the banhammer left and right to clear out the riff-raff. Eventually you gathered counselors around you in the form of mods and vets. And then you've even opened up debates and gathered opinions from all the forum members. And these are all good things. But at the end of the day, you're still the sheriff and you have the authority to enforce whatever rules you see fit, which can include cleaning house even when there might not be a specific rule violation. The check and balance to your power (and I guess mine since you've included me as your partner) is if we are unfair and become tyrranical jerks, pretty soon this place will empty out and we'll be ruling an empty empire. The key is to still listen to the voices of our forum team and the voices of the members and humble ourselves if need be, but also make the decisions on what we ultimately think is best for this community.

Well, that's a horse of a different colo(u)r--and I appreciate the clarification. I was under the impression that to get rid of someone, you had to find a way to shoehorn them into a Big Four violation. But if your hands aren't tied in that way and you can "clean house even when there might not be a specific rule violation," that's the "out" you need.

I do think it would be a good idea to put the "administration reserves the right to ban" wording in the Rules sticky.

BTW, Stark and Erx, I hope you didn't take my post as a slam. I have no problem whatsoever with any of the decisions you've made--you're doing a fine job. I was thinking about the future. But I see you've already got those bases covered. Cool

I need to backpedal and say that I was speaking to Stark not speaking for Stark that this is the particular policy that we will make official.

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
~Izel
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13-09-2012, 12:06 AM (This post was last modified: 13-09-2012 12:21 AM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Petition to ban Bishadi
(12-09-2012 11:24 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  
(12-09-2012 09:50 PM)cufflink Wrote:  Well, that's a horse of a different colo(u)r--and I appreciate the clarification. I was under the impression that to get rid of someone, you had to find a way to shoehorn them into a Big Four violation. But if your hands aren't tied in that way and you can "clean house even when there might not be a specific rule violation," that's the "out" you need.

I do think it would be a good idea to put the "administration reserves the right to ban" wording in the Rules sticky.

BTW, Stark and Erx, I hope you didn't take my post as a slam. I have no problem whatsoever with any of the decisions you've made--you're doing a fine job. I was thinking about the future. But I see you've already got those bases covered. Cool

I need to backpedal and say that I was speaking to Stark not speaking for Stark that this is the particular policy that we will make official.

Yeah whatever, you fucker's dance out the details.

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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