Poll: What is your preferred afterlife
This poll is closed.
Supernatural hell: Get tortured for a hundred years, but not actually and then be turned loose to temp people. 11.76% 2 11.76%
Supernatural heaven: Supposedly your idea of paradise, but from what I saw way too cramped to spend an eternity. 23.53% 4 23.53%
Catholic idea: Burn forever. 0% 0 0%
Seperation from god for eternity. 64.71% 11 64.71%
Total 17 votes 100%
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Poll: What version of the afterlife would you prefer?
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07-10-2017, 02:11 PM
RE: Poll: What version of the afterlife would you prefer?
If heaven is 72 virgins, can I get 36 experienced ladies, in hell?

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07-10-2017, 02:49 PM
RE: Poll: What version of the afterlife would you prefer?
(07-10-2017 01:50 PM)mordant Wrote:  If I found myself to be immortal after all and I managed to find that enjoyable indefinitely, of course I'd embrace it ... I just don't see how that is likely.

I wouldn't want to outlive planet Earth. I doubt I would even care to live through the probable climate changes of the next several centuries.

So there would have to be some stipulation that you, as an immortal being, could instantly transport yourself to other planets when you wanted to.
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07-10-2017, 04:10 PM
RE: Poll: What version of the afterlife would you prefer?
(07-10-2017 06:39 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  Still don't see proof for anybody smart writing in such way.

Are you saying that Plotinus, Augustine, Aquinas, and Dante weren't intelligent?

Are you ruling out the possibility of any Christian being intelligent?
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07-10-2017, 05:32 PM
RE: Poll: What version of the afterlife would you prefer?
(07-10-2017 04:10 PM)Belaqua Wrote:  
(07-10-2017 06:39 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  Still don't see proof for anybody smart writing in such way.

Are you saying that Plotinus, Augustine, Aquinas, and Dante weren't intelligent?

Are you ruling out the possibility of any Christian being intelligent?

I personally think they were all highly intelligent, if culture-bound. Intelligence is not all-or-nothing. Plus a God made more sense in the past, when less information was available.
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07-10-2017, 06:23 PM
RE: Poll: What version of the afterlife would you prefer?
(07-10-2017 02:49 PM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  
(07-10-2017 01:50 PM)mordant Wrote:  If I found myself to be immortal after all and I managed to find that enjoyable indefinitely, of course I'd embrace it ... I just don't see how that is likely.

I wouldn't want to outlive planet Earth. I doubt I would even care to live through the probable climate changes of the next several centuries.

So there would have to be some stipulation that you, as an immortal being, could instantly transport yourself to other planets when you wanted to.
Or to oblivion at least.

That is the big concern I would have about immortality -- if it were involuntarily imposed or more exactly if it wasn't escapable at will.

Maybe it would be possible to flex / adapt to changing circumstances (that is, after all, how what passes for a successful existence in this life involves) but maybe I wouldn't want to do that forever. I already feel that I've reinvented myself several times -- it gets tedious to keep on doing that.
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07-10-2017, 07:28 PM
RE: Poll: What version of the afterlife would you prefer?
(07-10-2017 05:32 PM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  ...I personally think they were all highly intelligent, if culture-bound....

It's discouraging to think that this is even in question. (If in fact Szuchow meant to question it.)

Surely everybody is aware that Galileo, Isaac Newton, and Francis Bacon were Christians who found no discrepancy between their religion and their science (whatever real or potential fights they had with church personnel).

In fact *because* those guys were intelligent, their classical theism was smarter than modern literalism, and for the most part remains compatible with modern scientific discoveries.
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07-10-2017, 08:03 PM
RE: Poll: What version of the afterlife would you prefer?
You can thrive intellectually and creatively despite a surrounding community and culture of closed-minded dogma. You're not really doing it because of the closed-minded dogma. We're lucky every creative light wasn't snuffed out, and a lot of brilliant lights that we'll never know of probably were snuffed out. If 2200 years or so ago Greek culture had taken hold and become dominant rather than Judeo-Christian monotheism, we'd be communicating by thought by now, and doing it from different planets.

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07-10-2017, 08:12 PM (This post was last modified: 07-10-2017 08:44 PM by Belaqua.)
RE: Poll: What version of the afterlife would you prefer?
(07-10-2017 08:03 PM)jerry mcmasters Wrote:  ...If 2200 years or so ago Greek culture had taken hold and become dominant rather than Judeo-Christian monotheism, we'd be communicating by thought by now, and doing it from different planets.

You mean like the Eleusinian and Bacchic Mysteries? The polytheistic temples? Reading cow's livers for information about the future?

cf: The Greeks and the Irrational, by E.R. Dodds
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07-10-2017, 08:26 PM
RE: Poll: What version of the afterlife would you prefer?
I'll take B, "polytheistic temples." You have your god and I have my god and he has his god and she has her god and...well, I suppose we can't really know whose is better or bigger or naughtier or whatever so let's just focus on stuff like: literature. Poetry. Law. Plumbing. Architecture. A grocery list. Anything but the minutia of how big exactly the Temple must be and what percent of the sacrificed goat the fucking priests of YWH get to skim. Of course to us today they (Greeks, Romans later) were brutal and nasty in a lot of ways (treatment of unwanted newborns, for example) but there's a trajectory there trending upward-ish. In my opinion. "What-if's" in history are always problematic.

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07-10-2017, 09:00 PM
RE: Poll: What version of the afterlife would you prefer?
(07-10-2017 08:26 PM)jerry mcmasters Wrote:  ...literature. Poetry. Law. Plumbing. Architecture. A grocery list. Anything but the minutia of how big exactly the Temple must be and what percent of the sacrificed goat the fucking priests of YWH get to skim....

You have to admit, that's a bit of a false dichotomy. Greek culture, as a whole, had its share of ridiculousness. And the Christians didn't focus entirely on trivia. Sometimes they studied the Trivium.

But, OK, I'm sorry to seem argumentative. Much of what is good in Christianity is derived directly from Greek thought: from Plato early on, and from Aristotle in the 13th century.

I completely agree with you that counterfactuals are tricky, though fascinating.

I guess I just don't want to oversimplify, and reduce our atheist discussions to slogans. But I'm new here, and I'm probably over-reacting.
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