Possible or impossible? this is the question!
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
08-05-2016, 02:55 PM
RE: Possible or impossible? this is the question!
Alla, I believe you are a figment of my imagination.
Explain why this is impossible.

It all comes down to accepting reality vs believing in a fantasy.
A near infinite number of ideas are physically impossible, because they defy the laws of physics.
Our universe is very orderly and structured with laws that we have observed to be the defining factor in reality.

We cannot physically fly as the birds do. The physical structure of our bodies are not conducive to winged flight.
Why is this impossible ?
We don't have wings.

Why is it impossible that a god changed dirt into a human being ?
1. There are no gods.

In a different universe where thoughts can alter reality, it's unlikely that any creature would survive long enough to procreate and thus there still wouldn't be anyone in that universe who could do it.

That kind of power is self destructive.

A child is born with the Midas touch and the moment that child is able to enact that power, it turns itself into gold.

Lastly, creating a human being is like creating the roof to a house and expecting rest of the house to be there.
Humans didn't just appear on the earth. We are a billion years in the making. As placental mammals we gained the ability to attach the placenta to the wall of the womb from a virus that existed millions of years ago. Without that virus and our very early animal ancestors, we don't exist.

So, what does a human being look like if you take away all the DNA from it's ancient animal ancestors ?
A god made of nothing creates a being made of nothing.

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Rahn127's post
08-05-2016, 03:04 PM
RE: Possible or impossible? this is the question!
http://genetics.thetech.org/ask-a-geneti...t-biblical

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like Bucky Ball's post
08-05-2016, 03:04 PM
RE: Possible or impossible? this is the question!
(08-05-2016 02:21 PM)Reltzik Wrote:  
(08-05-2016 11:35 AM)Alla Wrote:  I was told that biblical Adam and Eve are impossible. As a believer that they were real people I want to know why they are impossible.
Thank you.

There are several claims made ABOUT this story (or in several of its variations) that, taken one by one, are impossible, improbable, or plausible. Taken together the story flies in the face of just about everything we understand about how a lot of things work. I'll go through a list of some troubling aspects of the story; this won't be all of them.

1) All the magical stuff. I'm going to address this quickly to get it out of the way, because while it's a big issue and it colors everything else, it's also going to be a point of dispute over whether it's impossible or highly possible. The creation from nothing (or dust) when that violates either our understanding of the conservation of energy and matter or basic chemical composition.... the creation of one person from another, with different genetic sequences, from a single rib... so on and so forth... all of this flies in the face of everything we understand, from looking at the world we live in, about what is and isn't possible. Of course the answer to this is to suppose a being able to magically do what would otherwise be impossible, and that will be the theistic response to most of these other objections -- an omnipotent God could make it possible, or resolve the contradictions in evidence or the laws of science that we see nowadays. So the best anyone can do, short of getting bogged down in an argument over whether such a god actually exists, is flag the stuff that would be impossible without some serious monkeying around with the basics of science.

2) Adam naming the animals in a single day and judging whether they are a fit help meet for him. Let's be extremely generous. Let's assume that Adam was super-fast, able to speak 11 words per second (about the rate of Guiness's world record for fast talking), spends absolutely no appreciable time actually trying to brainstorm a name, remember whether he used that name before, or agonizing whether any animal is good enough for a help-meet, can indicate their unsuitability without wasting any words on the subject (perhaps by shaking his head or some hand gesture), and can somehow produce a complete list of names without any of them being so long (into, say, the five-syllable range) such that the length of the names doesn't slow his 11 word per second rate of speech, that there aren't any significant physical obstacles such as Adam not being able to actually see a dust mite or water bear without magnification, and that the entire day is available for this process (despite the Bible saying other things happened on that day). He also doesn't need to stop talking to, say, take a drink of water, or breathe, or anything else. Under these absurdly generous assumptions, Adam would be able to name 950,400 species of animal. (That's 1 name / animal x 11 names / second x 60 seconds / minute x 60 minutes / hour * 24 hours / day = 950,400 names / day.) Unfortunately, that's not enough to even get through the insects. Presently, more than a million species of insect have been identified, and it is estimated that there are 6 to 10 million species of insect in total. Naming all the animals in a single day is impossible without some serious magic.

3) A talking snake. A snake's tongue and lips are even less capable of shaping words than, say, a dog's or a rat's. Impossible without magic.

4) A fruit that instills knowledge of moral precepts by eating it. That is so very, very, very much not how the digestive track OR the brain work, at least not without some really wacky magic. Bonus points for that moral knowledge including the idea that it is shameful to be naked with no one to see save one's spouse, a bunch of animals, and God.

5) Men don't actually rule over women in all societies. God's curse seems to be culturally dictated rather than anything that was actually enforced. It's not impossible, but it is apparently not true.

6) We've thoroughly explored the river Euphrates. There is no cherubim with a flaming sword barring access to any of its headwaters. Nor are there three other rivers spawning from the same place and going in three different directions. That's not how hydrology works. Except near estuaries (ie, deltas) rivers merge rather than go off in different directions, and even there they come back together pretty quickly.

7) This is probably getting into the territory that most skeptics object to: Incest. In addition to running into significant psychological taboos and, supposedly, flying in the face of what they learned from the fruit, incest has high odds of causing severe defects and deformations in the offspring. If practiced over several generations, the odds increase to certainty and the population dies out. That's why populations have a minimum number of members to be genetically viable. While estimates of how many people are required for a genetically viable population (that is, able to reproduce and not kill themselves off through inbred defects) is debatable and not well-tested, low estimates range in the hundreds or thousands. NOT TWO. So.... where did Caine's wife come from? Was that an unnamed offspring of Eve and Adam, ie, a sister (or perhaps niece or grand-niece or so on?) If so, incest and you've got those population issues. Was she created separately from Adam and Eve by God? Eve is described as the "mother of all who live", which seems to indicate that all humans (save Adam?) descend from her, so assuming a new woman created as Caine's wife would make the story false. Note that I'm describing a population of two people, rather than a large population CONTAINING two people (ie a genetic "Adam" and a genetic "Eve") whose genes came to eventually be found in most or all of the surviving descendants. Having the entirety of the human species descended entirely from a population of two individuals is impossible without some serious magic.

8) Genetics again. In addition to it being impossible for that descent to happen, examination of the genetic code shows that it DIDN'T. Without some serious magic, such a population bottleneck in our ancestry would be quite evident in our genes. It isn't.

(7 and 8 are also strong objections to the Noah story.)

9) Paleontology. Clear descent from common ancestry with modern ape species is mapped in the fossil record. There were never any "first human man and woman" -- there was just one branching population of apes that gradually changed over time until they adopted the characteristics we now regard as making them human, with no clearly-defined precise delineation for where the change from not-human to human occurred. While there are gaps, they are unsurprising, what we'd expect from a fossilization process that fails to capture most individuals, and most of those which ARE fossilized escape our notice. But more importantly, nothing we have found falsifies the hypothesis, and every relevant find FILLS IN A GAP. If this were a false hypothesis, it would be shown false by the finds made after it was formulated, rather than verified by finds that a false hypothesis would not be able to accurately predict.

10) Archeology. Adam and then Caine are described as tilling the Earth. Archeology shows that it took humans thousands or tens of thousands of years to develop agriculture after they started producing basic hunting tools, far longer than Adam is said to have lived.

An interesting feature of 8, 9 and 10 is that, while saying that God did some magic to produce the impossible genetic code, fossil record, and archeological record (or, at least, impossible if the Adam and Eve story is true) is a tempting answer (to people who like to believe such things), the idea that God DID do such magic implies some interesting things about God's nature. Why would God create false evidence, producing a clear picture of a history far more consistent than what it is in "His" book, that would lead people away from the true story? If Devil instead did it, why would God allow it, how did the Devil produce a more consistent work than God, and why hasn't the Devil abused such a great degree of power in more intelligent ways?

I feel like I gained IQ points by reading this. Thumbsup

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF

We're all mad here. The Cheshire Cat
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Anjele's post
08-05-2016, 03:19 PM
RE: Possible or impossible? this is the question!
I had lunch will Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, Vladimir Putin and Eddy Murphy today.


PROVE I DIDN'T!!!!

......

Asinine claims need a high burden of proof to prove them out.


Nobody's just going to take my word for it.

.....

Now -- about this "God" person you keep blathering on about....................................

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like onlinebiker's post
08-05-2016, 03:25 PM
RE: Possible or impossible? this is the question!
There's this interesting new scientific theory that came out just recently. They call it "The Theory of Evolution". Some say these scientists are just copying a guy called Darwin, but there's no merit to those claims. You should definitely check it out.

Angel

Laugh out load

[Image: 7oDSbD4.gif]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like Vosur's post
08-05-2016, 03:41 PM
RE: Possible or impossible? this is the question!
(08-05-2016 11:35 AM)Alla Wrote:  I was told that biblical Adam and Eve are impossible. As a believer that they were real people I want to know why they are impossible.
Thank you.

What do you care ?
Your delusions make you happy.
You've already said that's all you care about.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Bucky Ball's post
08-05-2016, 04:54 PM
RE: Possible or impossible? this is the question!
Thank you for the answers. I will read all of them.

English is my second language.
I AM DEPLORABLE AND IRREDEEMABLE
SHE PERSISTED WE RESISTED
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
08-05-2016, 05:14 PM (This post was last modified: 08-05-2016 05:40 PM by true scotsman.)
RE: Possible or impossible? this is the question!
(08-05-2016 11:35 AM)Alla Wrote:  I was told that biblical Adam and Eve are impossible. As a believer that they were real people I want to know why they are impossible.
Thank you.

Because it is claimed that they were created by an act of conscious will and that would violate the primacy of existence Alla. That's the short answer. Besides that there is the problem that the story of Adam and Eve is arbitrary. It does not rest on any objective evidence. We have no objective way to validate it. It requires faith to believe in it. Therefor it is outside the province of reason and should be rejected as a possibility.

To claim that the story of Adam and Eve is true would be to try to integrate two contradictory metaphysics, since truth rests exclusively on the primacy of existence but the contents of the claim affirm the primacy of consciousness.

If you aren't familiar with the issue of primacy, I'll be happy to explain.

Do not lose your knowledge that man's proper estate is an upright posture, an intransigent mind and a step that travels unlimited roads. - Ayn Rand.

Don't sacrifice for me, live for yourself! - Me

The only alternative to Objectivism is some form of Subjectivism. - Dawson Bethrick
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
08-05-2016, 05:30 PM
RE: Possible or impossible? this is the question!
(08-05-2016 04:54 PM)Alla Wrote:  Thank you for the answers. I will read all of them.

Alla you are a good sport. That why I rep you positively. But remember the key for all the existence answers is Chuck Norris.Yes

Religion is bullshit. The winner of the last person to post wins thread.Yes
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
08-05-2016, 05:37 PM
RE: Possible or impossible? this is the question!
(08-05-2016 05:30 PM)Leo Wrote:  
(08-05-2016 04:54 PM)Alla Wrote:  Thank you for the answers. I will read all of them.

Alla you are a good sport. That why I rep you positively. But remember the key for all the existence answers is Chuck Norris.Yes
I remember this. Smile
P.S. I like the way you troll me. I ask you good questions and you don't give me good answers. Big Grin

English is my second language.
I AM DEPLORABLE AND IRREDEEMABLE
SHE PERSISTED WE RESISTED
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Alla's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: