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09-12-2012, 09:28 PM
RE: Post Election Thoughts
(09-12-2012 01:04 PM)FZUMedia Wrote:  
(09-12-2012 12:37 PM)Chas Wrote:  What has this to do with socialism?
You are advocating public education, or socialised education as some miraculous development in humankind- I am saying this state violence 'for the greater good' leads to millions of people getting killed every single time, without fail. When you people go around claiming that social programs are good, it makes my blood boil because violence always achieves more violence.

When my money is taken by force by the state to pay for public 'education', and you want more of it? so basically you want more money stolen from me to indoctrinate the young into communism.

lolwut?

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10-12-2012, 02:06 AM
RE: Post Election Thoughts
(09-12-2012 06:06 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(09-12-2012 01:52 PM)FZUMedia Wrote:  I advocate non violence, the state just happens to have a monopoly on violence.
You definition of violence appears to include taxation and education. Odd definition.
If I don't pay for services I do not like, I get thrown in jail, If I resist I get shot. If I try escaping from jail I get shot.

So I can kidnap you at the end of a gun if you don't pay me a percentage of your taxes and you wouldn't consider that violent?
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10-12-2012, 03:16 AM
RE: Post Election Thoughts
(10-12-2012 02:06 AM)FZUMedia Wrote:  
(09-12-2012 06:06 PM)Chas Wrote:  You definition of violence appears to include taxation and education. Odd definition.
If I don't pay for services I do not like, I get thrown in jail, If I resist I get shot. If I try escaping from jail I get shot.

So I can kidnap you at the end of a gun if you don't pay me a percentage of your taxes and you wouldn't consider that violent?
You might not use a certain aspect of what the government spends its money on, but you might use a certain feature someone else doesn't use etc..

And to say that you don't benefit from something such as state provided education is just ignorant.
You benefit because that state education educates the poor little kid who's parents are on shitty pay who can't afford private schools. That kid then gets educated, goes to college and becomes a doctor.
You then get sick and need the skills of a doctor.
See where this is going.

The same with roads. Say you walk everywhere and never own a car.
What if one day while you're out your house catches fire, the firemen (paid for by your taxes) then will use the public roads (paid for by your taxes) to get to your house and extinguish the fire.

It's just rather childish and ignorant to throw your hands up in the air stomping around going "I don't wanna!!".
In fact where's I&I? That guy makes more sense then you.

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10-12-2012, 03:59 AM (This post was last modified: 10-12-2012 04:05 AM by FZUMedia.)
RE: Post Election Thoughts
(10-12-2012 03:16 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  
(10-12-2012 02:06 AM)FZUMedia Wrote:  If I don't pay for services I do not like, I get thrown in jail, If I resist I get shot. If I try escaping from jail I get shot.

So I can kidnap you at the end of a gun if you don't pay me a percentage of your taxes and you wouldn't consider that violent?
You might not use a certain aspect of what the government spends its money on, but you might use a certain feature someone else doesn't use etc..

And to say that you don't benefit from something such as state provided education is just ignorant.
You benefit because that state education educates the poor little kid who's parents are on shitty pay who can't afford private schools. That kid then gets educated, goes to college and becomes a doctor.
You then get sick and need the skills of a doctor.
See where this is going.

The same with roads. Say you walk everywhere and never own a car.
What if one day while you're out your house catches fire, the firemen (paid for by your taxes) then will use the public roads (paid for by your taxes) to get to your house and extinguish the fire.

It's just rather childish and ignorant to throw your hands up in the air stomping around going "I don't wanna!!".
In fact where's I&I? That guy makes more sense then you.
That makes no sense, the public sector and the entitlements are what drives the costs up for these services. Look at Laser Eye Surgery, that is run almost entirely on private industry, the costs have gone down significantly due to the competition and strive to bring a higher quality/cheaper service whereas all the medical fields cornered by the public sector have drastically increased in cost. Telling me that 'I am against the poor' or 'Against roads' is a ridiculous argument, since the jobs are obviously useful, it would be be handled better in private industry.

I have no sympathy for the public sector, the public sector does a piss poor job at everything they attempt. When public schools were introduced, literacy rates decreased. When the Government announced 'The War on Drugs' drug use increased and the black market boomed. When the Government started 'The War on Poverty' The wealth gap of rich and poor increased exponentially. Government claims to be 'for the children' despite almost every newborn being put into half a million dollars in debt. Everything the government puts it's hands on turns to shit. Employing the government for any task is like putting a bull in a china shop.





£5 Billion and results worse than random.
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10-12-2012, 09:06 AM
RE: Post Election Thoughts
(10-12-2012 03:59 AM)FZUMedia Wrote:  I have no sympathy for the public sector, the public sector does a piss poor job at everything they attempt. When public schools were introduced, literacy rates decreased.


Please provide evidence of your assertion.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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10-12-2012, 09:14 AM
RE: Post Election Thoughts
(10-12-2012 03:59 AM)FZUMedia Wrote:  
(10-12-2012 03:16 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  You might not use a certain aspect of what the government spends its money on, but you might use a certain feature someone else doesn't use etc..

And to say that you don't benefit from something such as state provided education is just ignorant.
You benefit because that state education educates the poor little kid who's parents are on shitty pay who can't afford private schools. That kid then gets educated, goes to college and becomes a doctor.
You then get sick and need the skills of a doctor.
See where this is going.

The same with roads. Say you walk everywhere and never own a car.
What if one day while you're out your house catches fire, the firemen (paid for by your taxes) then will use the public roads (paid for by your taxes) to get to your house and extinguish the fire.

It's just rather childish and ignorant to throw your hands up in the air stomping around going "I don't wanna!!".
In fact where's I&I? That guy makes more sense then you.
That makes no sense, the public sector and the entitlements are what drives the costs up for these services. Look at Laser Eye Surgery, that is run almost entirely on private industry, the costs have gone down significantly due to the competition and strive to bring a higher quality/cheaper service whereas all the medical fields cornered by the public sector have drastically increased in cost. Telling me that 'I am against the poor' or 'Against roads' is a ridiculous argument, since the jobs are obviously useful, it would be be handled better in private industry.

I have no sympathy for the public sector, the public sector does a piss poor job at everything they attempt. When public schools were introduced, literacy rates decreased. When the Government announced 'The War on Drugs' drug use increased and the black market boomed. When the Government started 'The War on Poverty' The wealth gap of rich and poor increased exponentially. Government claims to be 'for the children' despite almost every newborn being put into half a million dollars in debt. Everything the government puts it's hands on turns to shit. Employing the government for any task is like putting a bull in a china shop.

£5 Billion and results worse than random.
No, really. You are I and I's doppelganger. I'd love to see you two fight each other. Drinking Beverage

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10-12-2012, 10:33 AM
RE: Post Election Thoughts
(10-12-2012 09:06 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(10-12-2012 03:59 AM)FZUMedia Wrote:  I have no sympathy for the public sector, the public sector does a piss poor job at everything they attempt. When public schools were introduced, literacy rates decreased.


Please provide evidence of your assertion.
I'm not a Googlebot, go research it yourself- you're the one that claims it's an advancement of humanity, not me.
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10-12-2012, 10:58 AM
RE: Post Election Thoughts
(10-12-2012 10:33 AM)FZUMedia Wrote:  
(10-12-2012 09:06 AM)Chas Wrote:  Please provide evidence of your assertion.
I'm not a Googlebot, go research it yourself- you're the one that claims it's an advancement of humanity, not me.
Your statement is absurd. You have made an assertion that is likely untrue.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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10-12-2012, 11:04 AM
RE: Post Election Thoughts
(10-12-2012 10:58 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(10-12-2012 10:33 AM)FZUMedia Wrote:  I'm not a Googlebot, go research it yourself- you're the one that claims it's an advancement of humanity, not me.
Your statement is absurd. You have made an assertion that is likely untrue.
Okay, let's take this from a different approach. You obviously see public education as a good thing and support the cause, I am fine with that, it's your virtues, I will extend my respect for you by not stopping you from acting and supporting what you deem good, and will not use violence to get you to do things my way. Would you extend the same respect to me for disagreeing with you? by not advocating me being thrown in jail for not supporting what you support?
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10-12-2012, 11:13 AM
RE: Post Election Thoughts
(10-12-2012 11:04 AM)FZUMedia Wrote:  
(10-12-2012 10:58 AM)Chas Wrote:  Your statement is absurd. You have made an assertion that is likely untrue.
Okay, let's take this from a different approach. You obviously see public education as a good thing and support the cause, I am fine with that, it's your virtues, I will extend my respect for you by not stopping you from acting and supporting what you deem good, and will not use violence to get you to do things my way. Would you extend the same respect to me for disagreeing with you? by not advocating me being thrown in jail for not supporting what you support?
We live in the society of others and have a representational democratic republic. We have laws that we agree to abide by. Taxes are the price of a civilized society.
I don't agree with how all of our tax dollars are spent, but I don't interpret that as 'the violence of the state'. We live in relationship to others and we all have to compromise to get the benefits of civilization.

There are mechanisms for changing those laws and the lawmakers. Vote, campaign, run for office, etc.

You can opt out, but you need to opt out entirely.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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