Poverty is a criminal offense in America OP/ED.
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06-01-2014, 07:06 PM
RE: Poverty is a criminal offense in America OP/ED.
(10-12-2013 11:48 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  
(10-12-2013 10:35 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Yeah because vulture capitalism is not the cause of most of our problems these days. The wealth gap is approaching the point that the rich will have to either agree that 1000% the average workers salary is too much and start giving some back or face armed rebellion. There is already a rent crisis in this country and there is a food crisis not too far off. Both are ridiculous and caused by people who give little or nothing back to the system they and their families have exploited for generations. The system as it is right now is untenable and the only solutions are either a drastic change in how wealth flows or the people on the bottom go out and redistribute the wealth themselves. It has happened before and will do so again if the conditions reach a crisis point.

Agreed. To a point. I think its kinda funny how everyone bitches about something being unfair, except for when its unfair in their favor…then they shut up about it.

I'm not saying that there aren't instances where the rich got rich off the backs of the poor. But you cannot blame the crash of the economy on the greed of the rich. You just can't.

When the housing bubble burst, I shook my head at all the homeowners in foreclosure pointing their fingers at the bank because the bank wouldn't re-negotiate their loans and crying unfairness and that the bank was taking advantage of those poor poor people. You know what? The homeowner bears the responsibility for this as well. They signed on the dotted line. $500,000 for a house when you make $60,000. Thats reasonable. Somehow, someway, people got it into their heads that homeownership was their god-given right.

Yes. The bank should not have given the loan. They they weren't exactly forcing people to sign the terms either. Don't understand how a balloon mortgage works? Don't get one! Don't understand interest rate arms? Don't even read the contract? No problem. Just sign and here is the keys to the McMansion you have no way of affording. When you think to yourself, meh, I'll just default if I can't pay, that is fraud. And its not the bank committing that fraud. Its you, the poor homeowner.

I see people who got to live in $800,000 dollar houses while being employed as a school bus driver, completely complicit in defrauding the bank, and indirectly, society who now has to chip in to cover the default. You get upset because bankers and CEOs didn't do jail time? Yeah, neither did the homeowner for signing for a loan they couldn't afford.

There is no such thing as a free lunch, and there is no such thing as zero risk. It is not anyone's responsibility to save you from yourself. You should not buy what you cannot afford and then expect everyone else to pick up the tab when you default.

Here is how a bank works (very simplistically): You deposit money. The bank turns around and loans that money to Sally. Sally is charged an interest rate (say 5%) to have that loan. The bank pays you .5% and keeps the 4.5% as income to keep the lights on and the vaults locked. (Remember, people bitch when they have to pay ATM/Checking fees). Sally Defaults on her loan, but the bank must still give you your deposit back. Sally isn't out any money. You aren't out any money. The bank is out the money.

Like it or not, people protest walmart - but that doesn't stop them from creating a market for which Walmart can capitalize. No. Not even a little bit. The Small mom and pop electronic store pays their employees more than minimum. How do they get rewarded for doing the right thing? They go out of business. Why? Because you want the cheapest price…you don't want to pay the increase in prices it would take by taking your business elsewhere and make walmart change their tune. If everyone stopped shopping at walmart, they would get the message.

Its ironic that people want to blame the retailer or market for existing out of one side of their mouth, but the market/retailer wouldn't exist if it weren't for those same jackasses in the first place. Spend. Spend. Spend.

Each and every one of us is to blame for the housing bubble bursting, and the stock market crashing. Its not all the banks fault, the regulators fault, the bankers fault, or even the consumer's fault.

Economists warned that this was coming. Stop over leveraging yourself, they said. The market cannot continue to rise, it will come down, they said. But no one listened…they were too busy watching American Idol and reading their gossip magazines to give a shit about what was coming.

I know I sound unsympathetic. And downright bitchy. I'm just tired of everyone thinking that their situation is someone else's fault and someone else's responsibility to get them out of it.

Don't spend more than you make. There is no reason for you to expect to make minimum wage and still live in Beverly Hills. Move out of the city where the cost of living is far more in line with what you are making. And don't tell me that some people are stuck, that they have no choice. They always have a choice. If immigrants could leave their belongings and come over to the US with $10 in their pocket to make a better life for themselves, well, dammit, then you can too. No one ever said it would be easy, or that the choices you have to make won't be hard…but you do have them.
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08-01-2014, 09:24 AM
RE: Poverty is a criminal offense in America OP/ED.
(03-01-2014 08:34 PM)Cathym112 Wrote:  I have an advanced degree in economics

I knew it!!
I was going to say something when you said "there is no such thing as a free lunch!"
A phrase mostly used by economic majors

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08-01-2014, 10:50 AM
RE: Poverty is a criminal offense in America OP/ED.
(06-01-2014 06:58 PM)Cathym112 Wrote:  
(06-01-2014 09:24 AM)Chas Wrote:  I beg to differ. I will try to find the article(s), but bundled securities that the brokerage firm knew were going to shrink in value were misrepresented and sold.

And mortgage lenders willfully misrepresented financial information both to customers and about customers.

It's hard to talk about bundled securities as a whole, when some broker dealers might have misconduct while others did not.

I just hate blanket statements like "the securities were bundled and sold fraudulently." Ok, some where. But some weren't.

I am not making a blanket statement as I did not say 'all'.

There was rampant malfeasance in both the mortgage industry and the securities industry.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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