Pretty cool how you attack... .
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20-07-2015, 12:57 PM
RE: Pretty cool how you attack... .
(20-07-2015 12:10 PM)Commonsensei Wrote:  This is the part where i think your confused.

He's confused about a lot more than just that part.
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20-07-2015, 01:19 PM
RE: Pretty cool how you attack... .
(20-07-2015 12:15 PM)Free Wrote:  
(20-07-2015 11:52 AM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  A concept isn't truth simply because it has facts in it that are truth.

It is a concept that demonstrates the truth of the concept.

Chas has stated that numbers have no physical existence. However, that does not indicate that numbers do not have any kind of existence at all.

They exist.

The word "existence" is not restricted to what is only physical. For example, does a concept exist? If not, how then can it be expressed?

If a thought does not exist, how then can you think?

Do the emotions of anger, happiness, laughter, sadness and jealousy exist? If not, how then do we experience them?

You see, there's more to existence than what is merely physical and observable.

Do you understand this?
Absolutely, completely. This is what I have been saying. Cool to see someone else gets it.
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20-07-2015, 01:29 PM
RE: Pretty cool how you attack... .
(20-07-2015 12:10 PM)Commonsensei Wrote:  
(19-07-2015 03:34 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Unfogged,
Entire galaxies live in order. Spiral, skeptical so forth, all order for sustained existence.
Hi, Commonsensei here. I know you've got a lot on your plate between Free, Whiskey, and unfogged. But I just can't help but step in.

Entire galaxies, live in Chaos. Gravaty pulling a ripping things every which way. Stars exploding, and imploding. Rocks and gasses being hurled threw the universe.

Some are spiral yes. but some are irregular, or elliptical.

[Image: Galaxies_types.jpg]

(19-07-2015 03:34 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  In my yard is a pear tree. This tree is close to a burn pile that I burn regularly. This little sappling used to shoot straight into the air in its intended path. It had no limbs, straight up. Well I burned my pile next to this tree quite a few times. I thought it was toast. So yeah the main part if the tree died a couple of years ago. But it's weird because instead of accepting its inevitable demise this fucking plant actually changed its course after realizing it was doomed without adjustment.

This is the part where i think your confused. You thinking that the plant has a form of reason. It's simply reacting to it's environment. It's doing what it's ancestors evolved into doing. It grows. Seeking light, or a clean carbon dioxide source. You said your self.

"So yeah the main part if the tree died a couple of years ago."

You killed the part of the tree that was being exposed to the soot.

(19-07-2015 03:34 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Tree now has one limb. This limb shoots out at 90° away from my burn pile. This one limb is my proof that plants not only obey there path, but actually have the ability to change it. They choose life in the one direction that is most beneficial. It isn't chance. It's experience.

Obey their path? What path? Again no reasoning skills it's just preforming it's nature. YOU KILL THE OTHER PART OF THE TREE! In your picture you can see a stem growing straight up. From the trunk. It's growing But if you continue to deprive that portion of clean carbon dioxide it will die off too.

Also you can control the growth pattern of any planet. It will do little to nothing to fight it. It's called Bonzai.

[Image: celtis-bonsai-tree-hackberries-isolated-...494604.jpg]

Again no reasoning skills. This is just a example of the result of planet evolution.
Wasn't the carbon dioxide it was the heat. If I killed the truck then the new section would have never grown. The tree could have given up and ended its pain. Instead it changed its path of growth in order to survive. It's the same tree it was. Not a different tree.
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20-07-2015, 01:31 PM
RE: Pretty cool how you attack... .
(20-07-2015 12:10 PM)Commonsensei Wrote:  
(19-07-2015 03:34 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Unfogged,
Entire galaxies live in order. Spiral, skeptical so forth, all order for sustained existence.
Hi, Commonsensei here. I know you've got a lot on your plate between Free, Whiskey, and unfogged. But I just can't help but step in.

Entire galaxies, live in Chaos. Gravaty pulling a ripping things every which way. Stars exploding, and imploding. Rocks and gasses being hurled threw the universe.

Some are spiral yes. but some are irregular, or elliptical.

[Image: Galaxies_types.jpg]

(19-07-2015 03:34 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  In my yard is a pear tree. This tree is close to a burn pile that I burn regularly. This little sappling used to shoot straight into the air in its intended path. It had no limbs, straight up. Well I burned my pile next to this tree quite a few times. I thought it was toast. So yeah the main part if the tree died a couple of years ago. But it's weird because instead of accepting its inevitable demise this fucking plant actually changed its course after realizing it was doomed without adjustment.

This is the part where i think your confused. You thinking that the plant has a form of reason. It's simply reacting to it's environment. It's doing what it's ancestors evolved into doing. It grows. Seeking light, or a clean carbon dioxide source. You said your self.

"So yeah the main part if the tree died a couple of years ago."

You killed the part of the tree that was being exposed to the soot.

(19-07-2015 03:34 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Tree now has one limb. This limb shoots out at 90° away from my burn pile. This one limb is my proof that plants not only obey there path, but actually have the ability to change it. They choose life in the one direction that is most beneficial. It isn't chance. It's experience.

Obey their path? What path? Again no reasoning skills it's just preforming it's nature. YOU KILL THE OTHER PART OF THE TREE! In your picture you can see a stem growing straight up. From the trunk. It's growing But if you continue to deprive that portion of clean carbon dioxide it will die off too.

Also you can control the growth pattern of any planet. It will do little to nothing to fight it. It's called Bonzai.

[Image: celtis-bonsai-tree-hackberries-isolated-...494604.jpg]

Again no reasoning skills. This is just a example of the result of planet evolution.
Never said anything about a plant having reasoning skilled as if it had a brain. It does have the will to live though, regardless of the level of pain or difficulty.
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20-07-2015, 01:37 PM
RE: Pretty cool how you attack... .
(20-07-2015 01:31 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  
(20-07-2015 12:10 PM)Commonsensei Wrote:  Hi, Commonsensei here. I know you've got a lot on your plate between Free, Whiskey, and unfogged. But I just can't help but step in.

Entire galaxies, live in Chaos. Gravaty pulling a ripping things every which way. Stars exploding, and imploding. Rocks and gasses being hurled threw the universe.

Some are spiral yes. but some are irregular, or elliptical.

[Image: Galaxies_types.jpg]


This is the part where i think your confused. You thinking that the plant has a form of reason. It's simply reacting to it's environment. It's doing what it's ancestors evolved into doing. It grows. Seeking light, or a clean carbon dioxide source. You said your self.

"So yeah the main part if the tree died a couple of years ago."

You killed the part of the tree that was being exposed to the soot.


Obey their path? What path? Again no reasoning skills it's just preforming it's nature. YOU KILL THE OTHER PART OF THE TREE! In your picture you can see a stem growing straight up. From the trunk. It's growing But if you continue to deprive that portion of clean carbon dioxide it will die off too.

Also you can control the growth pattern of any planet. It will do little to nothing to fight it. It's called Bonzai.

[Image: celtis-bonsai-tree-hackberries-isolated-...494604.jpg]

Again no reasoning skills. This is just a example of the result of planet evolution.
Never said anything about a plant having reasoning skilled as if it had a brain. It does have the will to live though, regardless of the level of pain or difficulty.

Ah, a Scientologist! Tomatoes scream, trees feel pain. Alrighty then. You should have said so up front.

We have enough youth. How about looking for the Fountain of Smart?
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20-07-2015, 01:44 PM
RE: Pretty cool how you attack... .
(20-07-2015 01:37 PM)Thinkerbelle Wrote:  
(20-07-2015 01:31 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Never said anything about a plant having reasoning skilled as if it had a brain. It does have the will to live though, regardless of the level of pain or difficulty.

Ah, a Scientologist! Tomatoes scream, trees feel pain. Alrighty then. You should have said so up front.
Have no clue what you are saying. Don't think you do either. Anything that is alive can feel some sort of pain.
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20-07-2015, 01:45 PM
RE: Pretty cool how you attack... .
(20-07-2015 01:19 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  
(20-07-2015 12:15 PM)Free Wrote:  It is a concept that demonstrates the truth of the concept.

Chas has stated that numbers have no physical existence. However, that does not indicate that numbers do not have any kind of existence at all.

They exist.

The word "existence" is not restricted to what is only physical. For example, does a concept exist? If not, how then can it be expressed?

If a thought does not exist, how then can you think?

Do the emotions of anger, happiness, laughter, sadness and jealousy exist? If not, how then do we experience them?

You see, there's more to existence than what is merely physical and observable.

Do you understand this?
Absolutely, completely. This is what I have been saying. Cool to see someone else gets it.

But you need to understand that the concepts you have in regards to intelligent are personal concepts that require belief, whereas the concept of counting numbers is not a matter of belief, but a reality in which all rational people can share and agree upon.

You see, no rational person will deny that counting numbers will result in an infinite amount of numbers capable of being counted. The reason for this is that each of us can envision the exact same process, and therefore each of us will conclude, as factual, that the concept is truthful.

However, in regards to the concept of intelligent design, it comes down to a position of belief with no means of demonstrating it as being factual. You will have adverse arguments, with those adversaries using actual evidence to contest your point of view.

Yes, the concept of intelligent design is very real to you, however it is not capable of being shared as a reality and verified with everyone else for the simple reason that it is inconclusive as well as has evidence stacked against it.

Counting numbers will always universally conclude that an infinite amount of numbers can be counted.

Intelligent design cannot make the same claim.

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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20-07-2015, 02:17 PM
RE: Pretty cool how you attack... .
(20-07-2015 01:44 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  
(20-07-2015 01:37 PM)Thinkerbelle Wrote:  Ah, a Scientologist! Tomatoes scream, trees feel pain. Alrighty then. You should have said so up front.
Have no clue what you are saying. Don't think you do either. Anything that is alive can feel some sort of pain.

Wow. YOU don't get it, therefore I don't get it? You continually project YOUR shortcomings onto others.

Google L Ron Hubbard. Enlighten yourself.

We have enough youth. How about looking for the Fountain of Smart?
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20-07-2015, 02:19 PM
RE: Pretty cool how you attack... .
(20-07-2015 11:40 AM)Free Wrote:  
(20-07-2015 08:29 AM)Chas Wrote:  Sorry, no. Your argument is invalid; the conclusion does not follow. Numbers have no physical existence.

Do you understand the CONCEPT?

Wink

It is a Platonic argument. There are no numbers except in our minds.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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20-07-2015, 02:20 PM
RE: Pretty cool how you attack... .
(20-07-2015 12:15 PM)Free Wrote:  
(20-07-2015 11:52 AM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  A concept isn't truth simply because it has facts in it that are truth.

It is a concept that demonstrates the truth of the concept.

Chas has stated that numbers have no physical existence. However, that does not indicate that numbers do not have any kind of existence at all.

They exist.

The word "existence" is not restricted to what is only physical. For example, does a concept exist? If not, how then can it be expressed?

If a thought does not exist, how then can you think?

Do the emotions of anger, happiness, laughter, sadness and jealousy exist? If not, how then do we experience them?

You see, there's more to existence than what is merely physical and observable.

Do you understand this?

They exist only in minds.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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