Probable, or Not. The 1000 flavors is boring me...
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29-09-2016, 06:19 AM
RE: Probable, or Not. The 1000 flavors is boring me...
(29-09-2016 05:44 AM)Chas Wrote:  You have chosen your definitions by ignoring others. That's called cherry picking.

Says that guy who cherry picked a definition from a dictionary, and ignored the ones that defines the specific meaning of the term, the term as it is understood when it comes to the distinction between atheist/theist.

Do you ever look in the mirror?

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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29-09-2016, 06:22 AM
RE: Probable, or Not. The 1000 flavors is boring me...
(29-09-2016 06:01 AM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  Yes, as a matter of fact I did. Although, I must admit that breaking down the specifics to that extent holds little interest for me.

Then you could have saved Chas from falling into the embarrassing hole he dug himself into.

Quote:Any belief that involves the supernatural (theism, deism, anything) should be treated with extreme skepticism until it can be verified via science.

Judging that the discussion has nothing to do with validity of any form of theism, or the supernatural, your point is irrelevant. It's merely about the boundaries between being a theist or atheist.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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29-09-2016, 06:29 AM
RE: Probable, or Not. The 1000 flavors is boring me...
(29-09-2016 04:32 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Deism and pantheism are all less specific and more broadly defined than theism; so how in the hell are they a subset of it? You can clearly be a deist (belief in a supreme being) without being a theist (belief in a personal god that interacts with the world) . Facepalm

No, all deists are theists. Deism is a form of theism.

You should know this since you're an atheist, which doesn't mean a lack of belief in a personal monotheistic god, but lack of belief in the existence of any type of god/s.

Fatbaldhobbit already knows this, and I already cited two sources, a philosophy source and wikipedia that both indicate this as well. Perhaps FBH can help you out here, before you run the risk of embarrassing yourself like Chassy.

I'll excuse the level of ignorance here as a result of groupthink, than stupidity.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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29-09-2016, 06:32 AM
RE: Probable, or Not. The 1000 flavors is boring me...
(29-09-2016 04:52 AM)morondog Wrote:  Talk to me when you can provide evidence for your crap.

Talk to me when you can provide evidence for your crap.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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29-09-2016, 06:47 AM
RE: Probable, or Not. The 1000 flavors is boring me...
(29-09-2016 06:32 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(29-09-2016 04:52 AM)morondog Wrote:  Talk to me when you can provide evidence for your crap.

Talk to me when you can provide evidence for your crap.

Or when I can point out that you're the dickhead making the claim Smile Unless you want evidence for e.g. evolution, cosmology etc in which case I invite you to start with the relevant wikipedia article.

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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29-09-2016, 06:55 AM
RE: Probable, or Not. The 1000 flavors is boring me...
Or hey Tommy, we can even include shit like the total lack of evidence for a global flood a la Noah.

The fact that praying is ineffective. How much does the ineffectual fervent prayer of an idiotic twit avail? You should know.

We could look at the total lack of credible evidence for miracles.

How about the fact that the documentary evidence for your God is so shite?

Lets talk Tommy.

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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29-09-2016, 07:14 AM
RE: Probable, or Not. The 1000 flavors is boring me...
(29-09-2016 06:32 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(29-09-2016 04:52 AM)morondog Wrote:  Talk to me when you can provide evidence for your crap.

Talk to me when you can provide evidence for your crap.

This is a picture of any flavor of god

[Image: black.gif]

But some people argue that the pic above doesn’t represent their god, that this one below does.

[Image: blank-flag.gif]

Is yours the top or the bottom one?

“The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.”
― Delos McKown

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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29-09-2016, 07:26 AM
RE: Probable, or Not. The 1000 flavors is boring me...
(29-09-2016 04:32 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(29-09-2016 03:52 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  Perhaps you knew already that deism, and any other god/s beliefs are all forms of theism already here?

If you're stupid enough to be that misinformed, is it any surprise that you are once again the forum whipping boy?

Deism and pantheism are all less specific and more broadly defined than theism; so how in the hell are they a subset of it? You can clearly be a deist (belief in a supreme being) without being a theist (belief in a personal god that interacts with the world) . Facepalm

It really goes against the grain for me to defend Tomasia, but Chas himself posted a dictionary definition of theism that gave two separate definitions. The second of these specified a personal god that interacts with the world; the first did not. By the first definition, deism and pantheism could be considered forms of theism.

Note: I am not talking about any definition of theism that Tomasia may have cherry-picked. I am talking about the one given by Chas. Go back and look at it if you don't believe me.
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29-09-2016, 07:31 AM
Probable, or Not. The 1000 flavors is boring me...
(29-09-2016 06:55 AM)morondog Wrote:  Or hey Tommy, we can even include shit like the total lack of evidence for a global flood a la Noah.

The fact that praying is ineffective. How much does the ineffectual fervent prayer of an idiotic twit avail? You should know.

We could look at the total lack of credible evidence for miracles.

How about the fact that the documentary evidence for your God is so shite?

Lets talk Tommy.


Im still waiting on finding an atheist who seriously believes that we're a product of a cosmic accident, that our desire for meaning, truth, a sense of the sacred, where the unintentional results of a cosmic lottery. That matter having the properties to arrange itself into conscious creatures, with moral, and creative capacities, is to believed as it just coincidentally did. No one seems to actually believe this, at least not honestly.

I'm still looking for the sort of atheist willing to support a godless view of the world, as they expect theist to defend there's. Ones who hold a contrary set of brliefs, rather than declare their absence of them.

You don't find many of those, what you find is those that prefer to define themselves as lacking a belief. And suggesting that others do so too.




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"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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29-09-2016, 08:19 AM
RE: Probable, or Not. The 1000 flavors is boring me...
That's 'cause you use loaded, inaccurate phrases like "cosmic accident"...

(29-09-2016 07:31 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  Im still waiting on finding an atheist who seriously believes that we're a product of a cosmic accident,

I am convinced that the current understanding of science, in regards to the beginning of the Universe is correct.
This is not in any way a cosmic accident, but something that occurred according to natural laws that we may or may not someday understand.

To put it more simply: Naturally occurring not cosmic accident.

(29-09-2016 07:31 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  ...that our desire for meaning, truth,

Meaning? We have evolved into pattern seeking primates. It's a survival trait.

Define "truth". If you define truth as "That which is in concordance with reality." then science is the best way to discover truth.

(29-09-2016 07:31 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  a sense of the sacred,

Define "sacred".

(29-09-2016 07:31 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  where the unintentional results of a cosmic lottery.

More loaded terms. "unintentional" - definitely. Until evidence of intention is presented, our only honest choice is "unintentional".

The phrase "cosmic lottery" implies that our existence is unlikely or unusual. We cannot say whether we are unique or not. We also cannot say whether or not our universe is unique, since we have nothing to compare it to.

(29-09-2016 07:31 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  That matter having the properties to arrange itself into conscious creatures, with moral, and creative capacities, is to believed as it just coincidentally did. No one seems to actually believe this, at least not honestly.

Nobody believes that because you are phrasing it dishonestly.

Matter has properties that remain consistent. Mix hydrogen and oxygen and water forms. This is a consistent, natural process. When the chemical reactions become complex enough, organic matter forms. When the chemistry continues, the organic matter become sentient.

This did not happen overnight, but over billions of years. And everything we have ever discovered has indicated that it all happened in accordance with scientific principles not religious laws.

What "coincidence" is there? In addition to humanity, there are other intelligent species. We just have the right mind/body combination to exploit it the best. Both consciousness and moral capacity has been exhibited in other creatures. Problem solving, language, tool making, almost everything that we claim separates us from "lower" animals has been documented in them.

(29-09-2016 07:31 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  I'm still looking for the sort of atheist willing to support a godless view of the world, as they expect theist to defend there's. Ones who hold a contrary set of brliefs, rather than declare their absence of them.

More word games. Few atheists will try to prove a negative, i.e. disprove a god. But many of us have stated their beliefs on this site. Humanism, naturalism, etc.

Atheists on this site routinely defend aspects of science and philosophy against the lies and misconceptions of religion.

(29-09-2016 07:31 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  You don't find many of those, what you find is those that prefer to define themselves as lacking a belief. And suggesting that others do so too.

You are the one who has attempted to redefine the words. Atheists here have routinely cited the accepted definitions of words and there have been discussions about the validity of those definitions.

You started this discussion.
You started playing word games.
Don't blame the other posters if they played the word games you started.

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