Protesters take to the streets
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13-11-2016, 03:47 PM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(13-11-2016 01:36 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  But nowhere do we have the definition of "unfit." We can look to the constitution, and by that measure Trump is fit to be president. He meets the requirements within the constitution by citizenship and age. He has no ties to foreign governments. Perhaps Federalist Paper #68 can give us a clue. It pretty much says that it is nearly impossible for an unqualified president to buck the system and become elected.

It is up to the electors to decide for themselves if the president-elect has the requisite qualifications, these electors should be
“Men (and hopefully women) most capable of analyzing the qualities adapted to the station and acting under circumstances favorable to deliberation, and to a judicious combination of all the reasons and inducements which were proper to govern their choice.”

And what they should be deliberating is as Alexander Hamilton writes in “The Federalist Papers,” the Constitution is designed to ensure “that the office of President will never fall to the lot of any man who is not in an eminent degree endowed with the requisite qualifications.”

It is left to their capabilities to determine if Trump is fit, a judgement call in the end.

(13-11-2016 01:36 PM)‘Lord Dark Helmet’ Wrote:  In other words, while someone who is “popular” could become president due to their popularity, their other virtues would have to be taken into consideration and weighed by the college, and the people.

Yes, exactly. The electoral college is now in the position of having to weigh his virtues as pertaining to the office. While I hold little hope that the electors in states that he won the popular vote in will vote against him this election provides us with a real time opportunity to see if the electoral college is “capable of analyzing the qualities adapted to the station”. Nothing in Trump’s history shows us that he has the qualities required by the office...truly nothing.

Think of all the things he isn’t:
Deliberately thoughtful
Even tempered and in control of his emotions
Scholarly or well read
Experienced holding public office
Judicious

Think of the things he has shown himself to be:
Vengeful
Petty
Insensitive
Thin-skinned
Narcissistic
Sexist
Racist

I would have never said any of these things about McCain or Romney nor questioned their ability and temperament to lead and hold the office. This isn’t a Republican/Democrat issue I have, it goes well beyond that, as a human being the man shows all the traits that would keep me from supporting him as a civil servant in a municipality with a population of 10 much less the president of the US.

(13-11-2016 01:36 PM)‘Lord Dark Helmet’ pid=‘1089151 Wrote:Most people have accepted the results of the election. That proves that Trump is "fit" to be President. And the electors will vote as such. Now, if all 60 million people that voted for Hillary Clinton take to the streets in protest, I would say ok, Trump shouldn't be president. But the fact is 90% of Clinton supporters have not signed the online petition to convince the college to not vote Trump. 99.9% of Clinton supporters are not rioting in the streets.

You’d be hard pressed to find anyone more anti-Trump than me but I’m not out protesting in the streets. I don’t find this line of reasoning to hold any water.

(13-11-2016 01:36 PM)‘Lord Dark Helmet’ pid=‘1089151 Wrote:Trump has in effect, won a "considerable a portion of it as would be necessary to make him a successful candidate for the distinguished office of President of the United States" as #68 said. People don’t have to accept his politics, but the vast majority have accepted his fitness, not with their direct vote, but by their acceptance of his victory.

I disagree, not taking to the streets is not a sign of acceptance, resignation maybe, but certainly not acceptance.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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13-11-2016, 04:04 PM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
If you honestly hope that the electorates will betray the voters to get your gal in office, I think you are inviting the circumstances that could actually lead to a civil war. The coast (minus the South) against the rest of America. It would not be pretty if that actually came to pass. Hoping for that is short-sighted, and irresponsible. The people who have always said, we need to keep and bear arms in the event of a tyrannical government aren't blowing smoke. They would perceive that as having unfair, undemocratic elections by the establishment. They wouldn't be wrong to think that either.

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13-11-2016, 04:12 PM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(13-11-2016 04:04 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  If you honestly hope that the electorates will betray the voters to get your gal in office, I think you are inviting the circumstances that could actually lead to a civil war. The coast (minus the South) against the rest of America. It would not be pretty if that actually came to pass. Hoping for that is short-sighted, and irresponsible. The people who have always said, we need to keep and bear arms in the event of a tyrannical government aren't blowing smoke. They would perceive that as having unfair, undemocratic elections by the establishment. They wouldn't be wrong to think that either.

I said that earlier in maybe this thread or another.

But even if that did happen, the republicans can send different people to cast different votes and then congress (house of reps) can choose which to accept.

The meeting of the 538 is a ceremony.

But to be fair, if Clinton had won the electoral votes and trump had won the popular, I'm willing to bet dollars to donuts he'd be calling for that to happen using civil war as a threat.

To my knowledge Clinton hasn't made such a proclamation.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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13-11-2016, 04:15 PM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
With Bannon now in the White House, it's likely going to be civil war anyway.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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13-11-2016, 04:16 PM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(13-11-2016 04:04 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  If you honestly hope that the electorates will betray the voters to get your gal in office, I think you are inviting the circumstances that could actually lead to a civil war. The coast (minus the South) against the rest of America. It would not be pretty if that actually came to pass. Hoping for that is short-sighted, and irresponsible. The people who have always said, we need to keep and bear arms in the event of a tyrannical government aren't blowing smoke. They would perceive that as having unfair, undemocratic elections by the establishment. They wouldn't be wrong to think that either.

Short-sighted and irresponsible is allowing him to assume the post. In my estimation we are about to see more rights trampled on over the next four years that large movements of civil unrest will be but a daily occurrence. I think we have jumped the political shark this time and we can’t take it back. Damned if we do and damned if we don’t, now we just have to pick our poison.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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13-11-2016, 04:51 PM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(13-11-2016 04:12 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(13-11-2016 04:04 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  If you honestly hope that the electorates will betray the voters to get your gal in office, I think you are inviting the circumstances that could actually lead to a civil war. The coast (minus the South) against the rest of America. It would not be pretty if that actually came to pass. Hoping for that is short-sighted, and irresponsible. The people who have always said, we need to keep and bear arms in the event of a tyrannical government aren't blowing smoke. They would perceive that as having unfair, undemocratic elections by the establishment. They wouldn't be wrong to think that either.

I said that earlier in maybe this thread or another.

But even if that did happen, the republicans can send different people to cast different votes and then congress (house of reps) can choose which to accept.

The meeting of the 538 is a ceremony.

But to be fair, if Clinton had won the electoral votes and trump had won the popular, I'm willing to bet dollars to donuts he'd be calling for that to happen using civil war as a threat.

To my knowledge Clinton hasn't made such a proclamation.

As for the the shoe on the other foot scenario, perhaps you are right, I don't know, but I'd hope that Trump would concede in light of a clear and evident defeat. Maybe he wouldn't have. I'm not certain. I am pretty sure that he wouldn't have called for a civil war though.

Either way, I feel like the country has swords pointed at one another, and I'm in the middle with a swordpoint at both sides of my neck. Democrats hate me. Republicans hate me. That's one sure side that I'm on the right side of history Tongue

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13-11-2016, 04:58 PM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(13-11-2016 04:51 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(13-11-2016 04:12 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  I said that earlier in maybe this thread or another.

But even if that did happen, the republicans can send different people to cast different votes and then congress (house of reps) can choose which to accept.

The meeting of the 538 is a ceremony.

But to be fair, if Clinton had won the electoral votes and trump had won the popular, I'm willing to bet dollars to donuts he'd be calling for that to happen using civil war as a threat.

To my knowledge Clinton hasn't made such a proclamation.

As for the the shoe on the other foot scenario, perhaps you are right, I don't know, but I'd hope that Trump would concede in light of a clear and evident defeat. Maybe he wouldn't have. I'm not certain. I am pretty sure that he wouldn't have called for a civil war though.

Either way, I feel like the country has swords pointed at one another, and I'm in the middle with a swordpoint at both sides of my neck. Democrats hate me. Republicans hate me. That's one sure side that I'm on the right side of history Tongue

He called for protests when obama won last election.

But whatever...I don't hate you.

I'm hoping things aren't as dire as people think they will be.

I'm not dismissing their fears, I acknowledge that. But fear clouds your thinking the way few things can.

I refuse to believe all republicans elected to congress are racists.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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13-11-2016, 05:10 PM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(13-11-2016 04:58 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(13-11-2016 04:51 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  As for the the shoe on the other foot scenario, perhaps you are right, I don't know, but I'd hope that Trump would concede in light of a clear and evident defeat. Maybe he wouldn't have. I'm not certain. I am pretty sure that he wouldn't have called for a civil war though.

Either way, I feel like the country has swords pointed at one another, and I'm in the middle with a swordpoint at both sides of my neck. Democrats hate me. Republicans hate me. That's one sure side that I'm on the right side of history Tongue

He called for protests when obama won last election.

But whatever...I don't hate you.

I'm hoping things aren't as dire as people think they will be.

I'm not dismissing their fears, I acknowledge that. But fear clouds your thinking the way few things can.

I refuse to believe all republicans elected to congress are racists.

Of course they are not. But Bannon, named as Trump's right hand man as of this afternoon, certainly is an outspoken white supremacist.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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13-11-2016, 05:12 PM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(13-11-2016 05:10 PM)Dom Wrote:  
(13-11-2016 04:58 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  He called for protests when obama won last election.

But whatever...I don't hate you.

I'm hoping things aren't as dire as people think they will be.

I'm not dismissing their fears, I acknowledge that. But fear clouds your thinking the way few things can.

I refuse to believe all republicans elected to congress are racists.

Of course they are not. But Bannon, named as Trump's right hand man as of this afternoon, certainly is an outspoken white supremacist.

Link.

"Evil will always triumph over good, because good is dumb." - Lord Dark Helmet
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13-11-2016, 05:12 PM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(13-11-2016 04:58 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  I refuse to believe all republicans elected to congress are racists.

The most rational and sober candidate in the field William Weld said, "I don't think many Trump supporters are racists but I do think many racists are Trump supporters."

#sigh
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