Protesters take to the streets
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17-11-2016, 07:11 AM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
The Iraq war protest march: how hope was lost

Contrary to what subsequent reports would have you believe, the march wasn't a complete failure.


Quote:In fact, the march did more than that: it had leading figures of the government seriously worried, right up to the prime minister. If Alastair Campbell’s Diaries are to be believed, Tony Blair confessed to having slept uneasily that night.

Quote:If the march fell a long way short of achieving what so many of us desperately wanted, it wasn’t a complete failure either. This was the day when the message finally got through to Blair and the Conservative opposition that their war was going to be profoundly unpopular.
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17-11-2016, 07:17 AM (This post was last modified: 17-11-2016 07:21 AM by Mathilda.)
RE: Protesters take to the streets
From Iraq war to anti-austerity marches: do mass demonstrations achieve anything?

Quote:We Are Many has a good stab at coming up with a positive answer. First it argues that 15 February 2003 was like a spark for the Egyptian revolution. Then it suggests that Parliament’s decision not to go to war in Syria in 2013 was a direct result of politicians knowing there had been “structural shift in public opinion away from war”.

Surprisingly, Tony Blair’s ally Lord Falconer says the anti-war march did change things: “If a million people come out on the streets in the future, then what government is going to say they are wrong now? When the last time the public expressed their opposition in that way, history said the people on the street were right and not the people in the government.” That’s quite an admission from a man who still believes going to war was the right thing to do.

Dr Eliza Filby, a lecturer in modern British history at King’s College London, says he is right but such an admission is rare. “Yes, protesting does have an effect, but politicians don’t admit it. They can’t.”

History tells us there are three main ways of making an impact with a protest, she says. “You can have huge numbers, as they did in 2003. You can have prominent people – that works.” The third option is to smash things.

“You’ve got to have lots of violence against property and destruction of property, because that breeds chaos. Governments don’t like chaos, it undermines their authority. They won’t admit this, but they will do anything to make sure it doesn’t happen again.”

One example is the race riots under Margaret Thatcher. “The riots all over in the summer of 1981 scared the hell out of a cabinet that was divided and weak. There was the Scarman report, the government did start putting money into the inner cities. Thatcherism was not stopped in its tracks but it did change,” says Dr Filby.

“The more chaotic a protest looks, the more a government will condemn it publicly and the more fearful it will be privately, and so liable to make changes.”

These can happen in secret over a period of time and are rarely exactly what the protesters want, she says: the protests in 2003 did not stop the invasion of Iraq but they did create a climate in which no prime minister can now go to war without the support of the Commons. “That is a direct consequence of the march.”

How many protests achieve anything at all? About a third is the answer, according a remarkable piece of work from the Initiative for Policy Dialogue at Columbia University. Researchers studied 843 protests in 84 countries between January 2006 and July 2013, from Occupy Wall Street to mining strikes in South Africa and rallies in Brazil.

Quote:Huge numbers really help. Be warned, though: even if you can draw a jaw-dropping, record-breaking crowd, be prepared for the politicians to ignore you. The only way to bring immediate change is to gather day after day after day in the same persistent massive show of force, as happened in Egypt and other countries during the Arab Spring.
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17-11-2016, 07:56 AM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
I don't think that standing in the street making noise is necessarily the best form of protest in this instance. It doesn't leave subconscious scars in the minds of those whom you're protesting anymore. You've gotta find creative new ways to protest every day.

Show up to the office dressed as a strawberry (or a banana. Or a hammer. Or optimus prime). When your boss confronts you about it kindly tell him to fuck off, because this banana suit is a crucial part of your new religion and you don't have to take his PC bullshit anymore.

Disrespect those older than you in public. When they balk about respecting elders, tell them to grow thicker skin and stop being such liberal pussies.

Juggling flaming chainsaws in public (this one's just for fun).

You get the idea. Fuck 'em, they asked for it.

Don't let those gnomes and their illusions get you down. They're just gnomes and illusions.

--Jake the Dog, Adventure Time

Alouette, je te plumerai.
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17-11-2016, 08:13 AM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
Reading books can be a form of protest.

Woman Silently Protests At Donald Trump Rally By Reading Book On Racism

[Image: johari-idusuyi.png]
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17-11-2016, 08:17 AM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(17-11-2016 07:56 AM)Old Man Marsh Wrote:  I don't think that standing in the street making noise is necessarily the best form of protest in this instance.

Au contraire mon ami.




#sigh
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17-11-2016, 08:22 AM (This post was last modified: 17-11-2016 08:26 AM by Grasshopper.)
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(16-11-2016 05:55 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  A message????

Yeah -- I suppose it does....


"We're Democrats -- and we'll vote for the least popular, crooked politician they tell us to vote for"....

...

Quite the message....

....

Oddly -- it's the same message the winning side used.....


Imagine that...

I guess you can hear whatever message you want, but the message we're sending is that roughly half the electorate does not approve of them or their agenda, and that their job is to govern the entire country, not just those who voted for them. I don't have any illusions that they will pay attention to this message, but it's still important to get it out there.

You, on the other hand, are telling them: "I don't care. Do whatever you like."
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17-11-2016, 09:01 AM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(17-11-2016 05:59 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  
Quote:Whether they work or not depends upon what they are trying to achieve.

Well if their goal is to fuck up traffic for a week or two, piss everyone off, make themselves look like retards and have a failed protest I'd say they're achieving their goal with stunning success.

Quote:because there's discontent now which will only increase if ignored

lol. LOL! LOL!!
Comon Mathilda, you're not an idiot. That's not how these things work.
Literally what happens is they get ignored and slowly fade away.

Quote:The protesters themselves would argue that they do have a moral high ground. It's all down to perception.

And WBBC would argue that they have the moral high ground. Doesn't mean they do.
Literally, ANY side of a protest will argue they have the moral high ground.

An open letter to Muffs.

Dear Muffs, history is replete with examples on how popular uprisings changed history. America was born of protest, the Puritans decided they would rather flee persecution than fight, the colonials said fuck it to taxation without representation, Northerners said no you can’t have slaves, unions insisted on safe work environments, child labor was protested against, women marched for the right to vote, blacks marched for proper integration, McCatharthyism was rebuked, people protested against the Vietnam war, LGBT marched for inclusion and on and on, and these are just a few American examples.

Sometimes the marches and protests were peaceful, sometimes they weren’t. In every case I list above change came about because of it. Imagine what would have happened if they had followed your suggestion of sitting on their hands and doing nothing because their marches and protests inconvenienced some people not to mention the government.

Many Americans are rightly concerned for what a Trump administration could mean for them. I won’t trot out the long list of reasons as they have been in the news everyday and we have already discussed many of them.

Democracy ain’t pretty and protests are part of it and in the end if you want to be heard you have to get off your butt and make some noise otherwise you truly will be ignored and fade away.

Sincerely,
FC

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“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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17-11-2016, 10:52 AM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(17-11-2016 08:22 AM)Grasshopper Wrote:  
(16-11-2016 05:55 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  A message????

Yeah -- I suppose it does....


"We're Democrats -- and we'll vote for the least popular, crooked politician they tell us to vote for"....

...

Quite the message....

....

Oddly -- it's the same message the winning side used.....


Imagine that...

I guess you can hear whatever message you want, but the message we're sending is that roughly half the electorate does not approve of them or their agenda, and that their job is to govern the entire country, not just those who voted for them. I don't have any illusions that they will pay attention to this message, but it's still important to get it out there.

You, on the other hand, are telling them: "I don't care. Do whatever you like."

I got one message ---- don't be fucking it up.

it is --

The ( D )s lost the election.

Come up with better candidates than Hillary Fucking Clinton -- and guess what????

You might not lose next time.........

Even I will vote for a ( D ) if they're worth a shit.

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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17-11-2016, 11:12 AM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(17-11-2016 10:52 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(17-11-2016 08:22 AM)Grasshopper Wrote:  I guess you can hear whatever message you want, but the message we're sending is that roughly half the electorate does not approve of them or their agenda, and that their job is to govern the entire country, not just those who voted for them. I don't have any illusions that they will pay attention to this message, but it's still important to get it out there.

You, on the other hand, are telling them: "I don't care. Do whatever you like."

I got one message ---- don't be fucking it up.

it is --

The ( D )s lost the election.

Come up with better candidates than Hillary Fucking Clinton -- and guess what????

You might not lose next time.........

Even I will vote for a ( D ) if they're worth a shit.

I said nothing in my post about Hillary Clinton, and I never said you had to vote for her. But there were other candidates out there. The only message you send to anyone by not voting at all is "I don't care." And I don't care about your opinions on this election if you couldn't be bothered to express them by voting.
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17-11-2016, 11:28 AM
RE: Protesters take to the streets
(17-11-2016 10:52 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(17-11-2016 08:22 AM)Grasshopper Wrote:  I guess you can hear whatever message you want, but the message we're sending is that roughly half the electorate does not approve of them or their agenda, and that their job is to govern the entire country, not just those who voted for them. I don't have any illusions that they will pay attention to this message, but it's still important to get it out there.

You, on the other hand, are telling them: "I don't care. Do whatever you like."

I got one message ---- don't be fucking it up.

it is --

The ( D )s lost the election.

Come up with better candidates than Hillary Fucking Clinton -- and guess what????

You might not lose next time.........

Even I will vote for a ( D ) if they're worth a shit.


Oh please, I get that.

But I will protest if there continues to be talk of putting muslims (who are here lawfully) into internment camps like we did to the Japanese citizens during WW2. I will protest if I believe the Supreme Court pick will terrible for our country. I will protest if the puppet president elect continues on the path of placing right wing crackpots who are racist in power positions that will affect all citizens.

This is my country too and I've got every right afforded by the constitution to let them know.

I don't see this as my side lost so now I'm all pissed off, I'm seeing this as trying to mitigate the damage. We can't wait until it happens, we have to stand up and try to stop it from happening to begin with.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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