Psychology of guns
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27-10-2015, 02:08 PM
RE: Psychology of guns
(27-10-2015 02:01 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  True -- it's possible to build up a tolerance to pepper spray...

I've yet to hear anyone claim to have a tolerance for high speed lead...........

....

Do you count armored vest Tongue. [/joke]

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27-10-2015, 02:08 PM (This post was last modified: 27-10-2015 02:15 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Psychology of guns
(27-10-2015 02:00 PM)yakherder Wrote:  
(27-10-2015 01:48 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  





Add a touch of adrenaline and the outcome can be quite different. There are plenty of videos of people completely ignoring spray. Next time we do riot control training I'll have them use bear spray on me and I'll record it Tongue. Yeah, it hurts like hell. But after one or two times, or again with some actual aggression flowing through your system, the effects can be tolerated.

I would like to see that. I can see how if you're jacked up on PCP or adrenaline a taser might not be effective but bear spray pretty much blinds you. I ain't saying you ain't right. When I was in boot camp and went through exposure to tear gas training most of us could only last less than 10 seconds. One guy however didn't even notice it. Could stay in the chamber as long as he wanted. When asked how in the fuck he could do that he said "In the joint almost every lunch period was interrupted by gas, you learned to ignore it or you didn't eat."

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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27-10-2015, 02:09 PM
RE: Psychology of guns
(27-10-2015 12:58 PM)jennybee Wrote:  I enjoy hiking on my own. I enjoy being independent. I could live in a bubble, but I would not be happy living life like that.
I'm not suggesting you live in a bubble. I certainly don't.
(27-10-2015 12:58 PM)jennybee Wrote:  I don't think hiding yourself away from life's experiences due to fear is a fair alternative.
Agreed, I'd never recommend that.
(27-10-2015 12:58 PM)jennybee Wrote:  If bringing a gun on hiking excursions allows me the freedom to feel comfortable hiking on my own--then I really don't see a problem with it.
If you feel the need to carry a gun then you seem to be putting yourself into dangerous situations. The gun may or may not save you.

It seems (to me) that having a gun may make you brave and may result in you excercising less caution than you would if you didn't have a gun. Which ultimately may mean that your life is at more risk than it would be had you not had a gun
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27-10-2015, 02:14 PM
RE: Psychology of guns
(27-10-2015 02:08 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(27-10-2015 02:00 PM)yakherder Wrote:  Add a touch of adrenaline and the outcome can be quite different. There are plenty of videos of people completely ignoring spray. Next time we do riot control training I'll have them use bear spray on me and I'll record it Tongue. Yeah, it hurts like hell. But after one or two times, or again with some actual aggression flowing through your system, the effects can be tolerated.

I would like to see that. I can see how if your jacked up on PCP or adrenaline a taser might not be effective but bear spray pretty much blinds you. I ain't saying you ain't right. When I was in boot camp and went through exposure to tear gas training most of us could only last less than 10 seconds. One guy however didn't even notice it. Could stay in the chamber as long as he wanted. When asked how in the fuck he could do that he said "In the joint almost every lunch period was interrupted by gas, you learned to ignore it or you didn't eat."

If you get somebody jacked up on drugs -- anything short of an RPG might not do anything....

I was related a story by a cop -- one of the guys on his department shot a guy with a 12 gauge -- and pretty much vaporized the guy's heart with the shot -- under 20 feet away.... The guy was jacked up on PCP -- and he continued attacking - even though technically he was already dead...... The cop who shot the 12 gauge required hospitalization -- nearly losing one eye..... He was able to return to duty after a while.... I don't think it would have been that good of an outcome if he'd tried using non-lethal force.....

.......................................

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27-10-2015, 02:19 PM
RE: Psychology of guns
(27-10-2015 02:09 PM)Stevil Wrote:  It seems (to me) that having a gun may make you brave and may result in you excercising less caution than you would if you didn't have a gun. Which ultimately may mean that your life is at more risk than it would be had you not had a gun

I've legally carried a gun, every day for 14 years. I find myself AVOIDING situations where I might have previously gone...

I just shudder to think how much paperwork might be involved if I have to shoot some asshole who needs being shot..............

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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27-10-2015, 02:23 PM
RE: Psychology of guns
(27-10-2015 02:14 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(27-10-2015 02:08 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  I would like to see that. I can see how if your jacked up on PCP or adrenaline a taser might not be effective but bear spray pretty much blinds you. I ain't saying you ain't right. When I was in boot camp and went through exposure to tear gas training most of us could only last less than 10 seconds. One guy however didn't even notice it. Could stay in the chamber as long as he wanted. When asked how in the fuck he could do that he said "In the joint almost every lunch period was interrupted by gas, you learned to ignore it or you didn't eat."

If you get somebody jacked up on drugs -- anything short of an RPG might not do anything....

I was related a story by a cop -- one of the guys on his department shot a guy with a 12 gauge -- and pretty much vaporized the guy's heart with the shot -- under 20 feet away.... The guy was jacked up on PCP -- and he continued attacking - even though technically he was already dead...... The cop who shot the 12 gauge required hospitalization -- nearly losing one eye..... He was able to return to duty after a while.... I don't think it would have been that good of an outcome if he'd tried using non-lethal force.....

According to a former martial art teacher of mine who also happenned to be a police and military instructor, the safest way to fight (without using several real bullets) a «crack head» completly jacked up is to sweap their feet while protecting yourself from grapple. Jacked up people tend to have poor balance due to their extatic mouvements. Once on the floor you can start to consider other options. It usually take them a few second to get back up or mount a counter attack. That's unless you are fighting a viscious, experimented street fighter who has combat experience while jacked up. In that case, a would recommand not being there...

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27-10-2015, 02:28 PM
RE: Psychology of guns
(27-10-2015 02:14 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(27-10-2015 02:08 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  I would like to see that. I can see how if your jacked up on PCP or adrenaline a taser might not be effective but bear spray pretty much blinds you. I ain't saying you ain't right. When I was in boot camp and went through exposure to tear gas training most of us could only last less than 10 seconds. One guy however didn't even notice it. Could stay in the chamber as long as he wanted. When asked how in the fuck he could do that he said "In the joint almost every lunch period was interrupted by gas, you learned to ignore it or you didn't eat."

If you get somebody jacked up on drugs -- anything short of an RPG might not do anything....

I was related a story by a cop -- one of the guys on his department shot a guy with a 12 gauge -- and pretty much vaporized the guy's heart with the shot -- under 20 feet away.... The guy was jacked up on PCP -- and he continued attacking - even though technically he was already dead...... The cop who shot the 12 gauge required hospitalization -- nearly losing one eye..... He was able to return to duty after a while.... I don't think it would have been that good of an outcome if he'd tried using non-lethal force.....

White punks on dope.




There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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27-10-2015, 02:32 PM
RE: Psychology of guns
(27-10-2015 02:19 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(27-10-2015 02:09 PM)Stevil Wrote:  It seems (to me) that having a gun may make you brave and may result in you excercising less caution than you would if you didn't have a gun. Which ultimately may mean that your life is at more risk than it would be had you not had a gun

I've legally carried a gun, every day for 14 years. I find myself AVOIDING situations where I might have previously gone...

I just shudder to think how much paperwork might be involved if I have to shoot some asshole who needs being shot..............
This doesn't make any logical sense. You were happy to take on the risk of being assaulted but not the risk of doing paper work.
And hence when carrying a gun you avoid certain places. Seems to me an easy solution to your problem would be to not take the gun then you have zero risk of doing the paperwork and by your logic this would then give you the freedom to go to those places.
Carrying everyday for 14 years, seems to me you don't do international travel then? Is that because it would seperate you from your needed gun? Does being dependant on a gun reduce your freedom?
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27-10-2015, 02:34 PM
RE: Psychology of guns
(27-10-2015 02:09 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(27-10-2015 12:58 PM)jennybee Wrote:  If bringing a gun on hiking excursions allows me the freedom to feel comfortable hiking on my own--then I really don't see a problem with it.
If you feel the need to carry a gun then you seem to be putting yourself into dangerous situations. The gun may or may not save you.

I don't know what it's like where you live, Stevil, but hiking out here in the Rockies can be dangerous no matter where you go. That is the nature of the Rocky Mountains and you have no control over the people you will meet on the back trails. There have been gangs that attack hikers and campers and you always hope you have picked a campsite where nobody will find you. Virtually everybody I know out here, with one or two exceptions, carries a handgun when hiking, camping, or fishing. The most common problems are the bears who come into your tent at 2:00 a.m. and you might get chewed up a little bit but you usually can get rid of them without shooting them. If you have a very young child with you, you may well need to kill the bear. There are also the robberies of campers. Hell, my son and I once got attacked by a couple of coyotes. We were archery hunting and my son put an arrow in each coyote before I could even react. They turned out to be rabid. By the way, there is a rabies epidemic in the southern Rockies right now. The stupid person is the one who goes out there unarmed.

A person with proper training is not going to be a threat to anybody but bad guys, bears, etc.
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27-10-2015, 02:52 PM
RE: Psychology of guns
(27-10-2015 02:34 PM)Black Eagle Wrote:  The most common problems are the bears
We don't have bears or coyotes, or wolves or lions or tigers or pumas or bobcats etc
We do have wild pigs and they can be dangerous, but you'd be hard pressed to find them, they don't stalk people, they tend to stay clear of noise.
Our goats aren't savage, and our possums are more destructive of the trees than the people.
It's horses for courses isn't it. I'm not sure that hiking is ever a safe lone venture, what happens if you twist an ankle?
And if you do have gangs and thieves that stalk the bush, perhaps hoping to rob a camper of their boots and packed lunch then maybe another reason to go camping with others rather than alone.
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