"Public" prayer
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20-06-2017, 07:47 PM
RE: "Public" prayer
(20-06-2017 07:00 PM)Jedi Rainbow Dash Wrote:  I really like full circle's response.

So do I. I think I'm going to use it word for word. It makes the point on so many levels.

Where are we going and why am I in this hand basket?
"Life is not all lovely thorns and singing vultures, you know." ~ Morticia Addams
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20-06-2017, 09:23 PM
RE: "Public" prayer
Wasn't Dionysus also big on orgies? Never hurts to include that in your prayers.

And next time, bring a colander.

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Flesh and blood of a dead star, slain in the apocalypse of supernova, resurrected by four billion years of continuous autocatalytic reaction and crowned with the emergent property of sentience in the dream that the universe might one day understand itself.
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20-06-2017, 09:35 PM
RE: "Public" prayer
(20-06-2017 09:23 PM)Paleophyte Wrote:  Wasn't Dionysus also big on orgies? Never hurts to include that in your prayers.

And next time, bring a colander.

[Image: Pastafarian_3259310b.jpg]

NARF! I'm gonna love this place!

Where are we going and why am I in this hand basket?
"Life is not all lovely thorns and singing vultures, you know." ~ Morticia Addams
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21-06-2017, 07:54 AM
RE: "Public" prayer
It was totally out of order for the director to suggest a prayer circle—especially just prior to going on stage. I wonder what motivated this; it was bizarre behaviour at best, and unacceptably confronting at worst.

Under the circumstances, I think you handled the scenario well. Thumbsup

And as you've known this director for some considerable time, I'd be asking him (assuming you work under him again) what the prayer "thing" was all about.

I'm a creationist... I believe that man created God.
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21-06-2017, 11:18 AM
RE: "Public" prayer
Sounds like my wife's family gatherings. Or at least Christmas and Thanksgiving. I always feel like a jackass when we hold hands and somebody says a prayer. If it's one of the women they get very emotional and start crying. But what can I do? I'm surrounded by catholics and christians in somebody else's house. I just roll with it, as I probably would have in your situation too.
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21-06-2017, 11:19 AM
RE: "Public" prayer
Actually, no. Fuck that. I would have just stepped back. I'll make an exception for my family's delusions (to a point), but not coworkers.
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21-06-2017, 09:11 PM
RE: "Public" prayer
(21-06-2017 07:54 AM)SYZ Wrote:  It was totally out of order for the director to suggest a prayer circle—especially just prior to going on stage. I wonder what motivated this; it was bizarre behaviour at best, and unacceptably confronting at worst.

Under the circumstances, I think you handled the scenario well. Thumbsup

And as you've known this director for some considerable time, I'd be asking him (assuming you work under him again) what the prayer "thing" was all about.

It wasn't the director who suggested it, just another cast member. The director did hesitate before allowing it. He was clearly at least a little uncomfortable with it and yes, he should have expected it even more than I should have. And sadly, here in the Bible belt (or Bible girdle as I call it) such suggestions are not at all out of the ordinary. In fact they are pretty much the norm whenever a group of people gathers together for pretty much any reason. Which is one of the reasons I'm irritated with myself for NOT having been prepared to address it. But it didn't happen until the last night of the production so it took me by surprise.

Let me sidetrack here to tell everyone some things about where I live, since I sorta skipped the whole introducing myself as a new member. I live in a small town---population just over 2,000 as of the latest census. We have one grocery store, one elementary school and one middle school. Our high school is outside of the town limits. One small library and more than 20 churches. Yep. More than 20 churches.

The play was in a bigger town (city?) about 20 miles from here.

Locally I try to choose my battles. It's been only a very few months since a rather large contentious town meeting (roughly 300 people if I remember correctly) where each speaker was "sworn in" before being allowed to voice their OPINION. Which irked me in and of itself. I want to share that experience with you all in greater detail too, but some other time. For now I'll just say that when it came my turn I tried to speak and was admonished not to start until I'd been sworn in. At which point I literally had a Bible shoved under my hand and was instructed to swear to tell the truth "so help me God." Though far from the first time I've ever spoken at a town meeting that was the first time that I have ever been put in that position at a town meeting and I took one step back from the microphone and quietly said to the person "I am a secular humanist. Do you have a law book or copy of the constitution because I'm not swearing on the Bible." Again, a story for another time, including how I KNOW that several people of other faiths who don't share/worship the same deity had reluctantly and uncomfortably complied with swearing an oath on the Christian Bible as each of them took their turn to speak before I did. I could visibly see some of them hesitate and consider whether or not to muddy the (non-religious) subject at hand by refusing, or whether to just DO IT, in order to be allowed to speak. Seriously, our leaders should know better. I suspect at least some of them do know better, but just aren't willing to express it.

One more thing about my little town. The town "crest" pictures six items. Of those six things, three are religious symbols. THIS is a battle I've been considering for a LONG time now. But let's remember, I live in a small town with over 20 churches. I honestly do live with the *concern* that even just coming out of the atheist closet may be enough to wake up to a burning cross in my yard someday. But having finally clawed my way out of it far enough to refuse "publicly" to swear on a Bible, (albeit quietly) I refuse to go back into that closet any more. My best friend was sitting beside me at that meeting and had a good enough idea of what I was about to do to whisper to me when my name was called to speak, "Don't do it. I'm afraid for you." [Image: no.gif]

But to return to the town crest... In my opinion, this violates the concept of separation of Church and State. And I've been loosely forming my 'script' for that objection for at least a couple of years now. By implication, at least, it favors one religion over all others (1. Bible and 2. Christian cross). Then it goes on to favor one denomination of that religion over all other denominations (Baptist). Then, by picturing a specific church, it implies favoring of one specific church over all other churches of said denomination of said religion.

And do NOT get me started on the invocations that start each town meeting. THAT is a whole other battle yet to be waged. And at the last public meeting I get a pretty good sense that the *word is out now* since I got the EXTREME beady eyed-one-eye-open staring me down glare by one of the commissioners as I sat quietly with my head NOT bowed, not praying "in Jesus' name" and NOT saying "amen" to another commissioner's opening invocation.

Oh, and by the way, the Constitution of the state in which I live specifically prohibits atheists from holding any elected office. The US Supreme ruled a few years ago that such a thing is not legal. Yet, it's still there.

"Disqualifications for office.
The following persons shall be disqualified for office:
First, any person who shall deny the being of Almighty God."


Believe it or not, our tiny town had an openly gay mayor for many years. Best qualified person for the job. Lifetime resident. Did a great job. I highly respect him both as a person in general and as an elected official. So in our favor, and perhaps somewhat surprisingly considering the stand of most churches on homosexuality, tiny town accepted him as mayor and re-elected him. But I seriously doubt he could have gotten elected at all if he had been openly atheist. Cause, well, the Bible-thumpers have gotta draw the line somewhere, ya' know?

Where are we going and why am I in this hand basket?
"Life is not all lovely thorns and singing vultures, you know." ~ Morticia Addams
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21-06-2017, 10:23 PM
RE: "Public" prayer
(20-06-2017 08:29 AM)Full Circle Wrote:  You: “Fine, but then I also want us to say a short prayer to Dionysus right after, OK?”

Or better yet when they finish say you want to add another. Wait till everyone quiets down, bows their head, continues holding hands and in an ever increasing voice pray...

“Oh Dionysus, patron of poetry, song and drama, we here beseech your mercy and pray you look down upon our humble cast and grant us that we may delight the audience tonight. Bestow on us your grace so that we might please you, oh great Dionysus!”

or some such drivel, make sure you say it real loud too. Angel

For bonus points and extra "Wait, what?" stares, work Melpomene in there too.

I'm sorry, but your beliefs are much too silly to take seriously. Got anything else we can discuss?
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22-06-2017, 01:24 AM
"Public" prayer
If you have the balls for it, ask to lead the prayer and say this.

Our brains, which art in our heads, treasured be thy names. Thy reasoning come. The best you can do be done on earth as it is. Give us this day new insight to resolve conflicts and ease pain. And lead us not into supernatural explanations, deliver us from denial of logic. For thine is the kingdom of reason, and even though thy powers are limited, and you’re not always glorious, you are the best evolutionary adaptation we have for helping this earth now and forever and ever. So be it.

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyath...ts-prayer/

I double dog dare you to do this.
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22-06-2017, 07:40 AM
RE: "Public" prayer
Double dog dare me? Damn. That's hard to resist. Among the battles I've been choosing for a while now is a request for a secular prayer at the Town Board meetings. In that event I half expect to be challenged to lead it. I'd come a lot closer to taking that dare and maybe using something similar to that THERE than at a play just before the curtain rises.

Where are we going and why am I in this hand basket?
"Life is not all lovely thorns and singing vultures, you know." ~ Morticia Addams
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