Pure Insanity! Simply hard to believe this is happening.
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30-03-2012, 03:36 PM
RE: Pure Insanity! Simply hard to believe this is happening.
(30-03-2012 12:53 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(30-03-2012 11:52 AM)Egor Wrote:  Yeah, but that’s just your arbitrary opinion. Just the supposed morals of one person. They mean nothing unless you have a lot of nuclear weapons to back them up.

That is, if atheism is true.
Morality is a plague on the earth. Just an excuse for people to control and oppress others.
Christian morality is the cause of witches and heritics being burned at the stake, it is the cause for oppression and persecution of homosexuals.
Many people have been killed in religious wars fueled by the desire to enforce a religious morality onto others.
We don't need it to live peacefully together, it doesn't allow us to live peacefully together. It is a tool of war, not love.
Ironically, your statement is a moral absolute.

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30-03-2012, 04:30 PM
RE: Pure Insanity! Simply hard to believe this is happening.
(29-03-2012 10:34 AM)Denicio Wrote:  Pure FUCKING Insanity! Yeah, this woman killed her FIVE kids because of superstition and now it’s a good idea to her out of crazyville to attend a church…the very thing that drove her to kill in the 1st place.
She drowned them ONE by one…so by the 3rd kid, she was holding her own kids head under water as the bubbles slowly stopped.. and possibly she paused and thought that this was ‘still a good idea’. YEP, cuz she went on to child 4 and then 5. This crazy nut should be put in a dark cell to never see light again.
We are DeEVOLVING folks! This is just Fucking Nuts! To think there are doctors and a judge that thinks THIS is actually a good and reasonable idea. Why not give Charlie Manson access to a new group of gullible followers too, while we are at it?
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Andrea Yates, the Houston mom who in 2001 drowned her five young children one-by-one in the bathtub, might soon be allowed to leave the state psychiatric hospital where she is being treated for mental illness to attend church.
"She's been approved by a certain church to attend Sunday services, and I anticipate that that recommendation will be forthcoming from her doctors," Yates' attorney George Parnham told ABCNews.com. He would not name the church.
Parnham said he expects doctors at Kerrville State Hospital to file a letter to the state district court within 10 days recommending that Yates be granted a two-hour pass to attend church on Sundays, the first step toward a permanent release.
"I hope that little by little she will adapt to the outside world by taking baby steps," he said.
Yates was convicted of capital murder in 2002, but acquitted in 2006 after jurors found her not guilty by reason of insanity. The stay-at-home mom had a history of mental illness and suicide attempts before drowning Noah, 7, John, 5, Paul, 3, Luke 2, and Mary, 6 months, after her husband, Rusty, left for work.
Yates confessed to the killings after calling police to her home. A police video showed a wet sock in the hallway and the body of one of Yates' children faced down in the bathtub. The other four bodies were laid on a bed and covered with a sheet.
In tapes released to ABC News' "Primetime" in 2006, Yates said she drowned her children because she didn't want them to go to hell. Yates' defense team argued she was influenced by Michael Woroniecki, a preacher from Oregon.
"The church she requested to attend is 180 degrees different from the ramblings of that hell, fire and brimstone preacher," said Parnham. "She would just like to get back into a stable church whereby God and Christianity become a role in her life. There's nothing nefarious about that."
Experts testified that postpartum psychosis prevented Yates from knowing right from wrong. With treatment, the delusions and hallucinations cleared and Yates realized what she had done.
"There were six victims that day, and Andrea was one of them," said Parnham, describing Yates' devastation. "But she understands that mental illness was the prime mover that caused various things to take place. She understands, she grieves, she mourns and she memorializes [her children]."
Parnham said Yates makes cards and other crafts and sells them in the hospital gift shop. She sends the proceeds to the Yates Memorial Children's Fund, a charity founded by Parnham to fund women's mental health education.
While Yates' doctors may deem her ready to reenter society, the public may feel differently.
"We tend to keep people with pyschosis hospitalized a lot longer than we need to, partly because society is spooked by these individuals and judges tend to reflect those views," said Dr. Phil Resnick, director of forensic psychiatry at UH Case Medical Center in Cleveland. Resnick testified in both of Yates' trials in her defense. "States tend to be quite conservative in releasing people."
Resnick said he recently examined two women who murdered their children based on religious delusions.
"One said she didn't want to go back to church because she didn't want to be put back in that situation. The other woman felt religion was a very important way for her to cope," he said.

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/MindMoodNew...d=16021269

Didn't Ms Yates originally drown her kids because God told her to?
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30-03-2012, 07:21 PM
RE: Pure Insanity! Simply hard to believe this is happening.
Our sense of justice depends on our sense of time. Justice is a phenomenon only of consciousness, because time spread out in a spatial succession is its very essence. And this is possible only in a spatial metaphor of time -Julian Jaynes
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30-03-2012, 07:41 PM
RE: Pure Insanity! Simply hard to believe this is happening.
(30-03-2012 01:46 PM)Egor Wrote:  I agree; that’s the way it works. The only problem is when society is obviously wrong. How is it that we judge them as wrong? And I’m not talking about the Bible, or using the Bible or the VGJC to make laws. I’m talking about the value of our moral sense to begin with. Doesn’t it have to be based on an intuition of perfection?
That's an interesting question. I think I am still formulating my opinion on the topic but I would say that I don't necessarily agree.

I think that if you looked at the evolution of morality over the last 2000 years it suggests that we have no set morality, if we did it wouldn't have changed so drastically.

I think our sense of morality comes from how we evolved. If you go back far enough (beyond humanity) we had no morals. At some point some of our species realised that we had a better chance of survival if we worked together. They realised that not helping others may not directly harm our chances of survival but it would sure as hell mean we were less likely to receive help if we needed it. This led to the members of our species with more social instincts having a better survival rate, hence they reproduced more, hence the next generation had a higher percentage of members with strong social instincts. Those without simply died out.

Egor Wrote:So, as Jesus taught us, love is the foundation of morality. But love is contrary to the laws of evolution. In fact, love sabotages evolution.

I disagree with this. I think evolution can explain love. Love leads to a man and woman forming a lifetime attachment that is never broken. Not only does it ensure continual opportunities to mate, for males it helps ensure that only you mate with a particular female.

This would mean that individuals who fell in love always had a better chance of successful reproduction.

Best and worst of Ferdinand .....
Best
Ferdinand: We don't really say 'theist' in Alabama. Here, you're either a Christian, or you're from Afghanistan and we fucking hate you.
Worst
Ferdinand: Everyone from British is so, like, fucking retarded.
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30-03-2012, 08:58 PM
RE: Pure Insanity! Simply hard to believe this is happening.
(30-03-2012 03:36 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(30-03-2012 12:53 PM)Stevil Wrote:  Morality is a plague on the earth. Just an excuse for people to control and oppress others.
Christian morality is the cause of witches and heritics being burned at the stake, it is the cause for oppression and persecution of homosexuals.
Many people have been killed in religious wars fueled by the desire to enforce a religious morality onto others.
We don't need it to live peacefully together, it doesn't allow us to live peacefully together. It is a tool of war, not love.
Ironically, your statement is a moral absolute.
No, I qualify my statements. Morality is about absolute right and wrong. I have no belief in absolute right and wrong.
I just want to survive. This is my selfish position. In order to increase my chances of survival I must fight against other people's belief in morality. It is survival and not morality that drives me. My statement reflects that.
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30-03-2012, 09:17 PM (This post was last modified: 30-03-2012 09:21 PM by justmetoo.)
RE: Pure Insanity! Simply hard to believe this is happening.
Man, religion is the original STD. Those people who are F%^cked to begin with,screw with other peoples minds and sooner or latter, there's a whole bunch of dripping ignorance and loving every minute of it. You know what a preacher should be wearing on his head is this.

   
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30-03-2012, 10:19 PM
RE: Pure Insanity! Simply hard to believe this is happening.
Denicio I'm sorry that your thread got derailed in such a nonsensical way, one quick question though, Wouldn't Andy Koffman be a better choice? He also did a wrestling stint and his entire career was based on pissing people off (except for taxi).
Cyndi does some wild stuff but she's actually pretty capable. I fact nowadays she helps the LGBT community not something I think your subject would be caught doing.

I'm not a non believer, I believe in the possibility of anything. I just don't let the actuality of something be determined by a 3rd party.
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31-03-2012, 01:13 AM (This post was last modified: 31-03-2012 01:18 AM by Antirepublican.)
RE: Pure Insanity! Simply hard to believe this is happening.
She had 5 kids, and that is 4 too many. If she killed off 4 and kept the smart one, maybe I could see it. But killing off all 5...why even waste resources of a cell, food, water, guards, etc.... Just kill her.

Then again, when I was watching that harry potter movie they mentioned that insanity was hereditary. So, maybe she did us a favor?
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31-03-2012, 09:02 AM
RE: Pure Insanity! Simply hard to believe this is happening.
(30-03-2012 08:58 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(30-03-2012 03:36 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  Ironically, your statement is a moral absolute.
No, I qualify my statements. Morality is about absolute right and wrong. I have no belief in absolute right and wrong.
I just want to survive. This is my selfish position. In order to increase my chances of survival I must fight against other people's belief in morality. It is survival and not morality that drives me. My statement reflects that.
That, in itself, is a moral conjecture.

And you may think that your will to survive is the only thing that drives you, but you are so very wrong.

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31-03-2012, 12:31 PM
RE: Pure Insanity! Simply hard to believe this is happening.
(30-03-2012 07:41 PM)Hughsie Wrote:  I disagree with this. I think evolution can explain love. Love leads to a man and woman forming a lifetime attachment that is never broken. Not only does it ensure continual opportunities to mate, for males it helps ensure that only you mate with a particular female.

This would mean that individuals who fell in love always had a better chance of successful reproduction.
The chemistry of love (Serotonin, Oxytocin, Vasopressin etc.) are needed for short or long-term bonding but not necessarily for a lifetime.
Evolution requires only that the guy hangs around long enough to provide security while the offspring are still vulnerable. Then his primary directive (passing on his DNA) takes over again so there is no drive to stay partnered after her breeding ability expires (clinical, or what?)


Back to the subject of the thread....
I too am shocked at this report but... how can I put this?... If all religious nutjobs were encouraged to drown their young... well... problem solved, no?

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