Question for anti-abortion atheists
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27-10-2011, 11:44 AM
RE: Question for anti-abortion atheists
(27-10-2011 09:57 AM)BnW Wrote:  
(27-10-2011 07:31 AM)mdak06 Wrote:  Any argument (regarding when it is acceptable to abort a human life) that bases its decision on technology is an incredibly weak argument, IMO. It should be a philosophical argument, not a technical one. Yes, the law can be "periodically changed to reflect advances in medical science," but that is irrelevant to the philosophical question of whether or not a particular human life should be protected by law.

Ok, this is a good point and it is what I was trying to get at. Currently, the US laws that allow for abortion are based off a 40 year old Supreme Court decision that breaks pregnancy into trimesters and deals with, to a certain extent, the viability of the fetus. The problem with that argument is that in a given period of time when a fetus can survive outside the womb will change as medical science advances. In 1971 a baby born before the 3rd trimester had absolutely zero chance of surviving. That is no longer the case. So, the fallacy the law is built upon fails. At some point, we will be able to take a fertilized egg out of the womb and grow it outside the mother's womb. At that point, how do you justify keeping abortion legal?
And as I said, that would be a flaw within the legal system, not the argument.
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03-11-2011, 04:23 PM
RE: Question for anti-abortion atheists
I think the answer OP, is an overwhelming sense of empathy. I don't personally know any other atheists so I can't say for sure but it seems to be the most logical answer. I'm pro-choice BTW.

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07-04-2014, 12:41 AM
RE: Question for anti-abortion atheists
(17-10-2011 03:37 AM)Hierophant Wrote:  I understand that there are some anti-abortion atheists on this forum. I already sent my question to the Atheist and Agnostic Pro-Life League, but I figured asking people directly on this forum wouldn't hurt either.

I am interested in hearing from anti-abortion atheists on the following question:

How do you reconcile being an atheist with the fact that the proposition "life/consciousness/personhood/beingness/etc begins at conception" can only be justified by an implicit or explicit belief in ensoulment at conception?

Furthermore, if you actually believe that the proposition "life/consciousness/personhood/beingness/etc begins at conception" can be justified by some other means than an implicit or explicit belief in ensoulment at conception, then what is this justification? (I do not believe that such a justification exists, but I am open to suggestions)

I don't even think that I have a "soul" exactly, but I know that I feel pain and it feels bad. I naturally assume that other people (including very small people) feel pain in the way I do. I could be wrong, but I would rather be on the safer side of wrongness.

I think that if something can grow and develop the way unborn babies do, then it must be alive. Even if someone only thinks of it as a "potential" life, I think it means something. I think it should be protected.

Aside from that, another reason I am opposed to abortion is because I hate the idea of how much money is being spent on abortion. I mostly fight religion because I think that it often promotes violence such as war and rape. I am against all types of violence and killing if there is any way to avoid it. Because of this, I also hate animal sacrifice.

My current project is explaining why many things in this world are irrelevant to me.
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07-04-2014, 08:37 AM
RE: Question for anti-abortion atheists
(07-04-2014 12:41 AM)chandlerklebs Wrote:  I don't even think that I have a "soul" exactly, but I know that I feel pain and it feels bad. I naturally assume that other people (including very small people) feel pain in the way I do. I could be wrong, but I would rather be on the safer side of wrongness.

Your assumption is incorrect. A fetus cannot feel pain until it has a nervous system and a brain. This does not happen until about six months.

Your sentiments may be kind, but your ignorance prevents you from having an intelligent position.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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07-04-2014, 11:00 AM
RE: Question for anti-abortion atheists
(07-04-2014 08:37 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(07-04-2014 12:41 AM)chandlerklebs Wrote:  I don't even think that I have a "soul" exactly, but I know that I feel pain and it feels bad. I naturally assume that other people (including very small people) feel pain in the way I do. I could be wrong, but I would rather be on the safer side of wrongness.

Your assumption is incorrect. A fetus cannot feel pain until it has a nervous system and a brain. This does not happen until about six months.

Your sentiments may be kind, but your ignorance prevents you from having an intelligent position.

I have given up the idea of having an "intelligent" position. When people lack intelligence, it certainly does not stop them from continuing to make a change in the world, but I will admit that intelligence can make a difference in whether the outcome is good or bad.

My current project is explaining why many things in this world are irrelevant to me.
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07-04-2014, 06:37 PM
RE: Question for anti-abortion atheists
This is why. Right here Is why the position that "all life must be preserved" is complete and utter bullshit.

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07-04-2014, 07:03 PM
RE: Question for anti-abortion atheists
Ensoulment? Dafuq?

We tend to not believe in the concept of souls, afterlife, heaven, hell, etc. So that's not even part of the equation.

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07-04-2014, 07:12 PM
RE: Question for anti-abortion atheists
Terminating unwanted pregnancies is beneficial to society, whether the potential offspring is killed by condoms, chemicals or abortion.
Human seasonal cycles are when we are financially secure and emotionaly prepared for child rearing.
As with our animal cousins humans abandon their young if conditions are not favorable.

However I'm open to debate on when the "potential" becomes a child, as termination would constitute euthanasia rather then abortion, but still less harmful then carrying a child to term and abandoning it.

All anti choice ppl I've talked to,consider various stages of a fetus as a living person with a right to life. And when you try and discuss their stance its emotional not reason you are dealing with.

Theism is to believe what other people claim, Atheism is to ask "why should I".
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07-04-2014, 07:24 PM
RE: Question for anti-abortion atheists
(07-04-2014 08:37 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(07-04-2014 12:41 AM)chandlerklebs Wrote:  I don't even think that I have a "soul" exactly, but I know that I feel pain and it feels bad. I naturally assume that other people (including very small people) feel pain in the way I do. I could be wrong, but I would rather be on the safer side of wrongness.

Your assumption is incorrect. A fetus cannot feel pain until it has a nervous system and a brain. This does not happen until about six months.

Your sentiments may be kind, but your ignorance prevents you from having an intelligent position.

He also appears to be ignorant of the fact that this thread was aborted three years ago!

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07-04-2014, 07:28 PM
RE: Question for anti-abortion atheists
(07-04-2014 07:24 PM)Crulax Wrote:  
(07-04-2014 08:37 AM)Chas Wrote:  Your assumption is incorrect. A fetus cannot feel pain until it has a nervous system and a brain. This does not happen until about six months.

Your sentiments may be kind, but your ignorance prevents you from having an intelligent position.

He also appears to be ignorant of the fact that this thread was aborted three years ago!
He already lost 2 debates on abortion. I guess he's just a glutton for punishment Tongue

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