Question for atheists...
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12-03-2017, 11:53 AM
RE: Question for atheists...
(12-03-2017 10:35 AM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  At work.

Hello JesseB! Big Grin

Call_of_the_Wild doesn't post about the place much any more.... probably on account of them being rather excentric in their veiws, along with not playing we with others.

There's little hope Call will respond, though best of luck interacting eith Agnostic Shane should you wish. Thumbsup

Just looking at his reputation alone it reminds me of a particular pseudoscience pusher I met back on A/N... I'm not quite ready for that, I'm still enjoying this place and would prefer not to have to pull the big book of facts out just yet. Maybe in a few days once I"m settled in a bit more.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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12-03-2017, 12:05 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(12-03-2017 11:53 AM)JesseB Wrote:  
(12-03-2017 10:35 AM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  At work.

Hello JesseB! Big Grin

Call_of_the_Wild doesn't post about the place much any more.... probably on account of them being rather excentric in their veiws, along with not playing we with others.

There's little hope Call will respond, though best of luck interacting eith Agnostic Shane should you wish. Thumbsup

Just looking at his reputation alone it reminds me of a particular pseudoscience pusher I met back on A/N... I'm not quite ready for that, I'm still enjoying this place and would prefer not to have to pull the big book of facts out just yet. Maybe in a few days once I"m settled in a bit more.
Why is my name always associated with "Proceed with Caution"?
I'm a very nice guy once you get to know me... Really I am.
Cool
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12-03-2017, 12:20 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
Might as well answer this question...

It's the same level of irrationality. Perhaps more. But it's understandable why it happens: indoctrination and popularity. So I don't think theists are crazy, on the whole. They've been programmed and/or conned.

I have a website here which discusses the issues and terminology surrounding religion and atheism. It's hopefully user friendly to all.
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12-03-2017, 01:10 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(12-03-2017 12:05 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  
(12-03-2017 11:53 AM)JesseB Wrote:  Just looking at his reputation alone it reminds me of a particular pseudoscience pusher I met back on A/N... I'm not quite ready for that, I'm still enjoying this place and would prefer not to have to pull the big book of facts out just yet. Maybe in a few days once I"m settled in a bit more.
Why is my name always associated with "Proceed with Caution"?
I'm a very nice guy once you get to know me... Really I am.
Cool

I think most people who buy into pseudoscience are likely very nice people, just like most religious folk are very nice. From what I gather so far the only real complaint people have made is a general problem with how you structure your arguments, and the veracity of the "evidence" you provide to support your positions. I haven't read the posts in questions but based on looking at your profile that's what people seem to think about you.

You can be a very nice person and not know how to tell fact from fiction, or make a well formed logically consistent argument.

I suggest if you haven't done so reading Carl Sagan's Demon Haunted World. It might at least help you see their perspective.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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12-03-2017, 01:32 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(12-03-2017 12:05 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  Why is my name always associated with "Proceed with Caution"?
I'm a very nice guy once you get to know me... Really I am.

Indeed you are quite civil, unlike Call Of, Celestial Wonder and others who've graced the forums. Thumbsup

(12-03-2017 12:05 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  ......... but I have a theory that a sentient observer is most likely the cause of what we perceive as reality. That sentient observer is us.

Our reality is only observed because we choose to observe it.
All realities exist but it is only when we attempt to observe it that it can present itself for observation.
Reality, therefore, is not created but simply observed.

Amazing facts:
Perfectly identical twins never share the exact same personality. The only thing physically different about them from birth is their brain wave frequency. Every brain caries it's own frequency & is unique to that brain.
E=mc2 therefore nothing can be created or destroyed within a closed system.
So what produced this frequency and what happens to it when we die?

Further speculation:
In this system 2 or more observers will only end up observing the same reality depending on which path they choose.
All cognitive life forms are examples of sentient observers
Observation begins and ends only when we die but it does not collapse anything

Even further speculation (really bordering on fairy tale here):
All observers are removed parts of a single bored sentient source (is one)
When we die our personality goes back to the source (alpha/omega)
All observers are unique (free will)
Specific observers can enter the system more than once if the source wills (dejavu/reincarnation)
Less observers = bored source (thou shall not kill/10 commandments/blah blah)
Source has no power over reality (global suffering)
Source can only interfere with the system via special observers (prophets) but cannot change reality
We are a product of the sources boredom
If the full source entered the system all observers would become one and the system would crash
Time (a series of events) does not exist outside of the system
The system is always being influenced for the source's entertainment

Questions:
Why does the source need worship?
Where does the devil fit into all of this?
Where does hell fit into all of this?
What does it matter where we come from and where we are going if nothing we do can change it?

However, that above is such an over blown bunch of woo as to be ludicrous teetering on the brink of lunacy. No
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12-03-2017, 02:15 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(12-03-2017 10:25 AM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  Reality, therefore, is not created but simply observed.

The act of observation is the act of creation. The act of realization, manifestation.

#sigh
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12-03-2017, 02:22 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(12-03-2017 01:32 PM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  
(12-03-2017 12:05 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  ......... but I have a theory that a sentient observer is most likely the cause of what we perceive as reality. That sentient observer is us. ...

However, that above is such an over blown bunch of woo as to be ludicrous teetering on the brink of lunacy. No

Sanity is overrated.

#sigh
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12-03-2017, 02:34 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(19-03-2016 09:51 AM)Call_of_the_Wild Wrote:  My question is; Do you really believe that the Christian's belief in God is synonymous to believing in Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy?? Because to me, if there was an adult that seriously and earnestly believed in Santa Claus/Tooth Fairy, I would probably think that something is wrong with him/her. I would think "I don't understand how rational human being (adult) could ever believe in such a thing".

Is that how you atheists view Christians? Do you really believe that our belief in God is similar to belief in Santa Claus..or is that just something you say to be facetious?

I don't say it to be facetious.
If you're still around I'd like to hear in what way the two beliefs are not similar.

(19-03-2016 09:51 AM)Call_of_the_Wild Wrote:  Is it to the extent where you pass by a Church on Sunday, and you see all of the Church attendees in the parking lot greeting each other...and you say to yourself "What a bunch of idiots..."

No, since I know a lot of people attend for a sense of community, habit or just to go through the motions.
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12-03-2017, 03:23 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(12-03-2017 01:32 PM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  
(12-03-2017 12:05 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  Why is my name always associated with "Proceed with Caution"?
I'm a very nice guy once you get to know me... Really I am.

Indeed you are quite civil, unlike Call Of, Celestial Wonder and others who've graced the forums. Thumbsup

(12-03-2017 12:05 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  ......... but I have a theory that a sentient observer is most likely the cause of what we perceive as reality. That sentient observer is us.

Our reality is only observed because we choose to observe it.
All realities exist but it is only when we attempt to observe it that it can present itself for observation.
Reality, therefore, is not created but simply observed.

Amazing facts:
Perfectly identical twins never share the exact same personality. The only thing physically different about them from birth is their brain wave frequency. Every brain caries it's own frequency & is unique to that brain.
E=mc2 therefore nothing can be created or destroyed within a closed system.
So what produced this frequency and what happens to it when we die?

Further speculation:
In this system 2 or more observers will only end up observing the same reality depending on which path they choose.
All cognitive life forms are examples of sentient observers
Observation begins and ends only when we die but it does not collapse anything

Even further speculation (really bordering on fairy tale here):
All observers are removed parts of a single bored sentient source (is one)
When we die our personality goes back to the source (alpha/omega)
All observers are unique (free will)
Specific observers can enter the system more than once if the source wills (dejavu/reincarnation)
Less observers = bored source (thou shall not kill/10 commandments/blah blah)
Source has no power over reality (global suffering)
Source can only interfere with the system via special observers (prophets) but cannot change reality
We are a product of the sources boredom
If the full source entered the system all observers would become one and the system would crash
Time (a series of events) does not exist outside of the system
The system is always being influenced for the source's entertainment

Questions:
Why does the source need worship?
Where does the devil fit into all of this?
Where does hell fit into all of this?
What does it matter where we come from and where we are going if nothing we do can change it?

However, that above is such an over blown bunch of woo as to be ludicrous teetering on the brink of lunacy. No
Bring something to the table my friend. You're just stating your opinion without justifying anything.

These concepts have been around since Descartes, Schrödinger & Einstein.
I'm just adding to it with a hint of religious salad dressing to make it more interesting.
The premises are sound. Have a go at them my friend.

If you dare to ask the question what existed before time existed you will get an infinite regress. The only plausible solution is a reality where all universes exist simultaneously & we are the observers choosing which path to view.

If you continue to BELIEVE the presupposition that time is a necessity for reality then you will never understand what Schroedinger understood.

In your world view only one reality exists & when we die it will continue to exist while you cease to exist.
Science tells us the opposite of this. Things don't cease to exist, they simply change state.
Identical twins never share the same personality & the frequency of the brain is not developed until many weeks after conception. Ultrasounds show specific behavioral patterns within the womb. Our nature isn't developed over time, instead we are born with it & we have to suppress it if we wish to change it.
Even in cases of total amneisure the victim reverts to their original childhood behavior.
Their is such a thing as individual consciousness.
Why would we even deny it.
Removal of the brain doesn't necessarily remove our true identity (philosophically speaking)

If we made 100 clones of ourselves they would all have a unique brain frequency just as identical twins do.

This frequency is what defines the true self.
Every individual has their unique frequency.
I'll post the research shortly if you don't believe me.

Come now. I welcome the criticism. I am 100% open to being corrected, but please don't just state your opinion as a counter argument.
Correct my logic, show me the fallacies & be something other than a troll. I dare ya.
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12-03-2017, 03:30 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(12-03-2017 03:23 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  If you dare to ask the question what existed before time existed you will get an infinite regress. The only plausible solution is a reality where all universes exist simultaneously & we are the observers choosing which path to view.

Nope. You get nothing at all when you ask a meaningless question ... which is "what existed BEFORE time ?" is. Infinite regress itself REQUIRES time. The notion of "before" is a temporal concept. Without time, it has no meaning and cannot be invoked without time a priori.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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