Question for atheists...
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22-03-2016, 01:08 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(22-03-2016 12:46 PM)Call_of_the_Wild Wrote:  
(22-03-2016 12:38 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  I don't think he/she/it understands what abiogenesis is or isn't. I think they think it's a cool word thrown around by the likes of ken ham and other incredibly ignorant ilk.

Awww crap. This is the typical "He doesn't understand what x is". How about I just give you the answer that was provided to me via Google, when you type in "abiogenesis".

the original evolution of life or living organisms from inorganic or inanimate substances

No, that is not the definition. Abiogenesis is the start of life from non-life - it is not evolution.

Quote:Basically, life from non-living materials...which is the same concept/definition I've been against since my first day on this wonderful forum.

Right.

Quote:So now since we know what abiogenesis is, how about you answering the same question that I asked them? If abiogenesis is false, then how can evolution be true?

The start of life could have been done by magic - it doesn't matter.

Quote:Oh crap, why am I asking you? You can't answer it either.

It's been answered several times.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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22-03-2016, 01:09 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(22-03-2016 12:29 PM)Call_of_the_Wild Wrote:  If abiogenesis is false, then how can evolution be true?

Simple: The organisms, regardless of how they originally came to be, possess a genetic structure that permits for subtle generation-by-generation changes.

You, COTW, are a rather convincing argument for your god being nonexistent, indifferent, or as sharp as a sack of wet mice. If it did exist and you were in its favour, it would hopefully have already provided you with the wisdom to understand what I managed to explain in a single sentence with less than a minute of typing. (Springy G shakes Her head in dismay and wanders off to refill Her coffeecup)
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22-03-2016, 01:16 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(22-03-2016 12:54 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  Explain how abiogenesis could be false. If you understand the definition, then explain why you would ask "if abiogenesis is false..." who here has ever claimed it was?

No human being has ever explained how life could have originated from non-living material. So therefore, we are at the stage of "abiogenesis: could be true, could be false".

Well, if abiogenesis COULD be false, the evolution also COULD be false. The problem is, you people are claiming that evolution is a 100% scientific fact (macroevolution). Evolution can't be a fact if what it is dependent upon (abiogenesis) also isn't a fact. Now, of course you can say "maybe God used evolution as a method of creation", but the problem with that is, I am talking to atheists that don't believe in God, therefore, the only way life could have originated is if it came from nonlife, but that is EXACTLY the problem, such a thing hasn't been scientifically confirmed yet.

It is kinda like your parents (or anyone's parents). If it is possible that your parents would have never existed, then it is also possible that YOU would of never existed...because your existence depends on their existence.

So when I ask the question of "If abiogenesis is false, how can evolution be true", that is like me asking..

"If your parent's existence is false (they never existed), then how can your existence be true?"

You can't have one without the other, contrary to THEM saying "Abiogenesis is independent of evolution". Well, if that is the case, answer the question.

Once you answer the question of "If abiogenesis is false, how can evolution be true"...once you adequately answer that question, we can move on, and I will look like a fool (or more like a fool Laugh out load ).

But of course, you can't.
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22-03-2016, 01:19 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(22-03-2016 12:38 PM)Call_of_the_Wild Wrote:  You have to prove that it is universally or absolutely non-existence before you can conclude that it is.
Nope. Non-existence just is. No proof needed. And if you're feeling really keen, you might like to prove to me that despite numerous, written eye-witness reports in Irish church records, Leprechauns do not exist.

—And as a matter of interest, if I were to hand you a bucket that I'd claimed contained a dozen apples, but on looking into it you discovered it to be empty (I lied) would you need some sort of formal proof that it was empty, IE that the apples didn't exist? Seriously? I can't believe that anyone could be so confused LOL.

Quote:Now ultimately, you don't know whether God exists or not...
Nope. I do know that your god doesn't exist, just as you know that Allah, Queztalcoatl, Vishnu, Apollo, Buddha, Breged, Waheguru, Krishna, Baiame etc etc etc do not exist.

Quote:Then of course, you can't provide an answer to that kind of question, so you then resort to the typical FALSE atheistic quips...
Can you please prove that my quips are false? Or is this merely your unsupported personal opinion? And remember, opinions are not regarded as proof.

Quote:The burden of proof is on the one making the claim, and this isn't just limited to positive claims, but negative claims also.
Agreed. Please post a brief proof that your Christian god exists. And you need to understand that strictly speaking, I've never once claimed that your god doesn't exist, per se; rather I've said that there is no evidence to support any belief in his existence. Different thing altogether.

Quote:So are you saying that you claiming that you can fly can't be disproven?
Actually, I can fly, and I've done so many times before—whilst totally unaided as well. Could you please post your proof that I (allegedly) cannot?

I'm a creationist... I believe that man created God.
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22-03-2016, 01:20 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(22-03-2016 01:08 PM)Chas Wrote:  No, that is not the definition. Abiogenesis is the start of life from non-life - it is not evolution. [/quote[

Ok, lets forget the definition I provided and use your's..."abiogenesis is the start of life from non-life".

Ok, we will go with your definition. Happy? The question remains; if abiogenesis is false, how can evolution be true?

[quote='Chas' pid='966430' dateline='1458673714']
The start of life could have been done by magic - it doesn't matter.

Ohhh, so God couldddd have done it??? Ahh, now we are getting somewhere Laugh out load

It is like pulling teeth. See, once you ask the right questions, the atheists will eventually have to fess up.
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22-03-2016, 01:22 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
Good sport


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Religion is bullshit. The winner of the last person to post wins thread.Yes
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22-03-2016, 01:23 PM (This post was last modified: 22-03-2016 01:58 PM by Momsurroundedbyboys.)
RE: Question for atheists...

Marburg virus, Ebola, Rabies, HIV, Smallpox, Hantavirus, Dengue Fever all brought to you by god - who cares for us and loves us all Censored
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22-03-2016, 01:23 PM
RE: Question for atheists...

Marburg virus, Ebola, Rabies, HIV, Smallpox, Hantavirus, Dengue Fever all brought to you by god - who cares for us and loves us all Censored
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22-03-2016, 01:24 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
(22-03-2016 12:29 PM)Call_of_the_Wild Wrote:  I said, as you pointed out numerous times, that evolution depends on abiogenesis. You said "No, it doesn't. Evolution is independent of abiogenesis".

And I asked "Well, if abiogenesis is false, then how can evolution be true"?

Because it is independent of abiogenesis.

Whether or not abiogenesis happened does not affect the theory of evolution at all. Neither depends on the other being true in order to be true itself. The truth or falsehood of abiogenesis does not, in any way, affect whether or not the theory of evolution is true or false, because the two theories deal with entirely different fields. The truth value of one has no bearing whatsoever on the truth value of the other.

This is not complicated.

Read.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
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22-03-2016, 01:24 PM
RE: Question for atheists...
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Religion is bullshit. The winner of the last person to post wins thread.Yes
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