Questioning The Intangible Versus Questioning the Tangible
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14-01-2017, 08:16 PM
RE: Questioning The Intangible Versus Questioning the Tangible
(14-01-2017 06:10 PM)Banjo Wrote:  
(14-01-2017 04:58 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  Big Grin

No.

Well alright, its quite simple really, everyone has their own thing which they excel at. That is what I'm saying in the most basic terms. In less basic terms I am saying that atheists seem to be less inclined to question the government while theists are not.

This might be because theists answer to...................

I agree that each person has their own attributes.

What you say about atheists shows you do not know what an atheist is, nor what atheism is.

First, atheists do not form a group. Such as christians or the members of any other creed. There is no set social agenda for non believers.

You have been here for a little while now. Have you not noticed the constant questioning of government, debates regarding ethics and morality etc? It goes on here all the time.

How about this idea. You kick away the notions you had of atheists before you joined. Instead, get to know us.

Indeed, it was your superior attitude from the very beginning that first caught my attention. This is why I've lost patience with people such as Tomato. He's been here for years without ever getting to know us. Years!

You want to be like that?

Banjo in the beginning of your post you say that atheists have no set social agenda, this might be true, what defines a person as an atheist is merely a disbelief in a god.

Then later in your post you ask that I get to know atheists. I can not sir, because we are agreed that atheists only have one thing in common. Therefore it is not the atheist I should get to know but the people. In which I am trying to do by proposing a hypothesis about the very framework of human nature.

Quote:As for questioning the government or following an authority figure, I think that is more like a theist. As you say, they answer to a higher authority. Often the human spokesperson for said god.

I took this out of order from the rest of the text because I wish to respond to it last, giving it more attention if you will. All atheists did when they became atheists (or dropped their belief in a god) was just that, they stopped believing in a god. There is nothing to suggest that they lost anything else including basic human social traits of adhering to a hierarchy.

It is logical then for me to subsume that god became the government or perhaps the government triumphed over god. They are after all potentially two conflicting hierarchies.

Perhaps if you were to question the government, like you questioned god? Except there are some differences at least, unlike god, there are tangible and real world effects of governance.

So instead of questions like does god create earthquakes and if so why? the question may go more along the lines of why do governments create war, and who started it? if the government blames someone else for starting the war (always the case almost no government desires to be seen as the aggressor) then the matter becomes, which one is lying? are they both lying? who is really at fault?

I mean I suppose you could question if the government creates earthquakes, I mean there ARE conspiracy theories out there for that. But I've found them lacking in substance...

(14-01-2017 07:39 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  [Image: calm-down-i-got-this_o_169970.jpg]

Please scroll down for the answer.























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Lol kidding, keep scrolling



























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Seriously, almost there

























I'm not kidding this time

























Lol got you again























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And done.
Hope it was worth it.

[Image: 46d2efc05199c2d65ea89ca6ae3e40948398c9b1...7faa2b.jpg]

Worth it.
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14-01-2017, 08:46 PM
RE: Questioning The Intangible Versus Questioning the Tangible
(14-01-2017 08:16 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  Then later in your post you ask that I get to know atheists. I can not sir, because we are agreed that atheists only have one thing in common. Therefore it is not the atheist I should get to know but the people.

Are you playing dumb or seriously that stupid?

(14-01-2017 08:16 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  In which I am trying to do by proposing a hypothesis about the very framework of human nature.

Proposing a false hypothesis instead of interacting socially with the people you claim you want to get to know?

Guess that answers my question.

(14-01-2017 08:16 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  All atheists did when they became atheists (or dropped their belief in a god) was just that, they stopped believing in a god.

Or never believed in the first place. Or it was a gradual process that took years. Or it is a still ongoing process.

OR YOUR COULD FUCKING ASK...

(14-01-2017 08:16 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  There is nothing to suggest that they lost anything else including basic human social traits of adhering to a hierarchy.

You don't say. Drinking Beverage

(14-01-2017 08:16 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  It is logical then for me to subsume that god became the government or perhaps the government triumphed over god. They are after all potentially two conflicting hierarchies.

Or you could ask us how we feel. Maybe some of us adopted a skeptical attitude, considering multiple viewpoints and multiple sources of information before forming an opinion.

But that takes too much work, doesn't it? It's much easier just to generalize and assume and project.

(14-01-2017 08:16 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  Perhaps if you were to question the government, like you questioned god? Except there are some differences at least, unlike god, there are tangible and real world effects of governance.

Once again, you exhibit a total lack of understanding. Even a basic search, like the "View new posts" button, will reveal a variety of political and current events oriented threads.

Are you that lazy that you can't even do that?

(14-01-2017 08:16 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  So instead of questions like does god create earthquakes and if so why? the question may go more along the lines of why do governments create war, and who started it? if the government blames someone else for starting the war (always the case almost no government desires to be seen as the aggressor) then the matter becomes, which one is lying? are they both lying? who is really at fault?

Once again, with a little work the answers are there to be found. Different wars have different causes, some more complex than others. By consulting a variety of sources, the combatants, neutral parties, eyewitnesses, refugees, journalists, etc., it is possible to determine the causes of a conflict.

(14-01-2017 08:16 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  But I've found them lacking in substance...

I know that feeling. Drinking Beverage

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14-01-2017, 08:54 PM
RE: Questioning The Intangible Versus Questioning the Tangible
(14-01-2017 08:16 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  All atheists did when they became atheists (or dropped their belief in a god) was just that, they stopped believing in a god. There is nothing to suggest that they lost anything else including basic human social traits of adhering to a hierarchy.

And then there are those who have always been atheists; they wasted no time on theism but spent that time being human - all gain, no loss.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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14-01-2017, 09:08 PM
RE: Questioning The Intangible Versus Questioning the Tangible
(14-01-2017 08:54 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(14-01-2017 08:16 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  All atheists did when they became atheists (or dropped their belief in a god) was just that, they stopped believing in a god. There is nothing to suggest that they lost anything else including basic human social traits of adhering to a hierarchy.

And then there are those who have always been atheists; they wasted no time on theism but spent that time being human - all gain, no loss.

Not all gain, some loss. They'll never know that feeling, they'll never know what it was like to stop believing in a god.
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14-01-2017, 09:19 PM
RE: Questioning The Intangible Versus Questioning the Tangible
(14-01-2017 09:08 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  
(14-01-2017 08:54 PM)Chas Wrote:  And then there are those who have always been atheists; they wasted no time on theism but spent that time being human - all gain, no loss.

Not all gain, some loss. They'll never know that feeling, they'll never know what it was like to stop believing in a god.

How is that a loss? Never had it, never lost it.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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14-01-2017, 09:32 PM
RE: Questioning The Intangible Versus Questioning the Tangible
(14-01-2017 08:16 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  Perhaps if you were to question the government, like you questioned god?

On a whim I checked the Politics section of the forums.

Quote:Donald Trump Time Magazine Person of the Year
(2,388 posts)

Draining the Swamp LOL
(1,893 posts)

Obama orders full review of election hacking reports
(1,605 posts)

There is nothing Trump can say
(3,965 posts)

Trump's cabinet in the White House
(2,208 posts)

Worrying about a Trump Victory? Don't
(63,417 posts)

The Electoral College
(3,551 posts)

Trump Will be President
(28,683 posts)

Trump the Puppet - Russians with the strings
(1,986 posts)

Stupid Shit Trump says over Twitter
(5,954 posts)

Seems like quite a bit of questioning going on.

Help for the living. Hope for the dead. ~ R.G. Ingersoll

Freedom offers opportunity. Opportunity confers responsibility. Responsibility to use the freedom we enjoy wisely, honestly and humanely. ~ Noam Chomsky
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14-01-2017, 09:40 PM
RE: Questioning The Intangible Versus Questioning the Tangible
(14-01-2017 09:32 PM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  Seems like quite a bit of questioning going on.
To be fair he is just talking out his ass, to justify his cry baby OP. This is a guy who thinks not believing his conspiracy theories is the same as not questioning the government, and who thinks atheists don't question the government but accused me, an atheist, of "being all bent outta shape about authority" when we were talking about taxes and government.

He's dumb as a rock and can't keep his dishonesty organized. A common trait of stupid people trying to sound smart by making shit up as they go.

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14-01-2017, 09:46 PM
RE: Questioning The Intangible Versus Questioning the Tangible
(14-01-2017 04:58 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  Whatever helps you sleep at night.
[Image: nrn8x.jpg]

Sticking with no content posts eh? Probably the smart thing to do, wouldn't want you hurting your head trying to think up a an actual point.Drinking Beverage

It is held that valour is the chiefest virtue and most dignifies the haver.
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14-01-2017, 10:11 PM
RE: Questioning The Intangible Versus Questioning the Tangible
(14-01-2017 09:32 PM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  
(14-01-2017 08:16 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  Perhaps if you were to question the government, like you questioned god?

On a whim I checked the Politics section of the forums.

Quote:Donald Trump Time Magazine Person of the Year
(2,388 posts)

Draining the Swamp LOL
(1,893 posts)

Obama orders full review of election hacking reports
(1,605 posts)

There is nothing Trump can say
(3,965 posts)

Trump's cabinet in the White House
(2,208 posts)

Worrying about a Trump Victory? Don't
(63,417 posts)

The Electoral College
(3,551 posts)

Trump Will be President
(28,683 posts)

Trump the Puppet - Russians with the strings
(1,986 posts)

Stupid Shit Trump says over Twitter
(5,954 posts)

Seems like quite a bit of questioning going on.

Trump or Obama are only the pinhead of the vast network you call a government. Questioning that is like questioning the pope's (or a priest or a bishop whatever) actions when you should be questioning religion in its entirety.
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14-01-2017, 10:12 PM
RE: Questioning The Intangible Versus Questioning the Tangible
(14-01-2017 09:46 PM)WhiskeyDebates Wrote:  
(14-01-2017 04:58 PM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  Whatever helps you sleep at night.
[Image: nrn8x.jpg]

Sticking with no content posts eh? Probably the smart thing to do, wouldn't want you hurting your head trying to think up a an actual point.Drinking Beverage

Well no content posts is pretty much all you've been posting on this forum for years apparently.
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