Questions for the Christian believer
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23-12-2011, 11:04 AM
RE: Questions for the Christian believer
(23-12-2011 10:51 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  Well...

First, I'll get back to posting like I normally do after the holidays.

Second, it is not my job to save people. That's God's job. I'm simply to act like Christ in all aspects of my life and let God use me the way He wants to. I love all people; no matter what they believe.

rofl, Erxomai... I'm an honorary black person. My black friends made me one.

Dude, the family down the street are Carl and Eva Black. That's their name, not their color.

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
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24-12-2011, 12:09 AM (This post was last modified: 24-12-2011 12:12 AM by kingschosen.)
RE: Questions for the Christian believer
(23-12-2011 06:09 AM)Malleus Wrote:  
(22-12-2011 02:58 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  Like I said, my theology (God chooses who to save and who to damn) should be irreconcilably offensive towards you; however, I felt that was accepted on most people's part that either A) I'm deluded or B) I'm crazy.

C) Interesting case study, interesting new threads and a decent contribution to making the forum more fun. Reasonable debate opponent.

Other than that, yes, your ideas are highly offensive and, in my opinion, it takes a special kind of guy, not only to happily accept that kind of theology but also to enjoy and indulge in the company of flies trapped in a spider net. After all, that's what we are to you, aren't we? Fun guys... too bad my pal god chose to make them all burn for all eternity on a whim... oh well. "I wonder how you guys feel about hand puppets"

Hey dude, thanks for the compliments! When we first met, I thought we weren't going to like each other very much. I'm glad we both let our cool heads prevail. As for your latter statement, I don't know if God chose you or not. Your regeneration could happen at any time and God could use me for that... in some way...

All of you are great people, and I'm saddened at the thought of anyone - any human - perishing for eternity. The hope that God may have chosen you gives me solace. I truly enjoy this place and you fine people.
(23-12-2011 07:05 AM)morondog Wrote:  Methinks KC is actually a special guy. We did ask him to answer these questions after all... credit for answering them KC. I know unless I felt like a bit of masochism I'd not be doing the same in any Christian forum. My guess is that he's here to save us. KC, there is actually a button for that on your internet browser Wink

Heh, I'm not here to save anyone. I'm just here because I like it here. I like the people here. However God wants to use me, that's up to Him. I enjoy this place because I like fraternizing with people with differing beliefs, and I like to prove to others that Christians aren't always complete jerks.
(23-12-2011 07:21 AM)Malleus Wrote:  No. That's the point. He can't save us. Nobody can because, according to his theology, his god has already made up his mind about our future.

Yep. You are right.

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24-12-2011, 12:14 AM
RE: Questions for the Christian believer
(24-12-2011 12:09 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  All of you are great people, and I'm saddened at the thought of anyone - any human - perishing for eternity. The hope that God may have chosen you gives me solace. I truly enjoy this place and you fine people.

LOL KC you poor bastard. It's gonna be lonely up in heaven.
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24-12-2011, 12:14 AM
RE: Questions for the Christian believer
(23-12-2011 07:27 AM)morondog Wrote:  Ah, but unless we've been very dumb and slagged off the Holy Spirit, then he can't *know* that we're doomed, he just has to spread the message so that the chosen ones can hear it... I guess it's not saving per se, but the lingo puts it that way.

I'm to live like Christ. However God wants to use me is up to Him. If He wants to use my example for a regeneration, then so be it. And, you're right. I don't know if any of you are going to hell... only God knows that.

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24-12-2011, 12:15 AM
RE: Questions for the Christian believer
(24-12-2011 12:09 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  I like to prove to others that Christians aren't always complete jerks.

Consider that point proven and then some Smile
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24-12-2011, 12:16 AM (This post was last modified: 24-12-2011 12:17 AM by kingschosen.)
RE: Questions for the Christian believer
(23-12-2011 07:35 AM)Malleus Wrote:  That's the main reason why he doesn't feel the need to try to convert anyone of us. But as long as we are doomed and he's fine, he is happy with that outcome and he might as well enjoy a ride with us. He is not in danger because god has already chosen him and he doesn't need to be a dick about it because whatever he does cannot change our outcome which can only be decided by his god and not by him and not even by us.
Nah, he's saved anyway, no matter if he preaches or not. His god doesn't need his assistance. He (god) just points a finger and the chosen ones follow

As I said, his theology is one of the most egocentric versions of Christianity. It's fascinating to watch it work in real life.

You have a pretty good understanding of my theology. In my opinion though, it's the most liberating and freeing form of Christianity.
(23-12-2011 07:47 AM)morondog Wrote:  OK by me Tongue As long as there ain't no proselytizing going on, I'm a happy guy.

Smile

Again, not up to me.

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24-12-2011, 12:18 AM
RE: Questions for the Christian believer
(24-12-2011 12:16 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  You have a pretty good understanding of my theology. In my opinion though, it's the most liberating and freeing form of Christianity.

But only from your side of the fence.

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
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24-12-2011, 12:18 AM (This post was last modified: 24-12-2011 01:15 AM by kingschosen.)
RE: Questions for the Christian believer
(23-12-2011 10:17 AM)Erxomai Wrote:  Yes, that is the point, just the wrong terminology. He's not here to save us, but if I may speak for Dear KC, I would conjecture that he is hopeful that he will help some of us along in our understanding of God's grace. Just because the majority of us are atheists or agnostics or whatever, doesn't mean someone here might not be elect in KC's worldview. He lived as an agnostic before having a conversion experience. In Calvinism, a person as no say in their conversion, but it doesn't mean that a conversion doesn't happen. So he can believe that it's all set in stone, but perhaps it will be his humble attitude and confident understanding of God's ways that sets someone else upon a path of understanding their own election. You finding this offensive is not his problem, actually, since he himself is not being offensive. I see KC acting out of love. It still remains that he doesn't have anything to do about our conversions or non-conversions, but he cares enough to be present in people's lives. Nothing wrong with that unless someone's a bigot and hates other people because of what they believe. I'm sure NO ONE here would ever do that. On the other hand, you have someone like Eyegore who comes in guns blazing to shoot us all and let God sort us out. Eyegore with his arrogant thinking that he has a mission to destroy all who would disagree with him would have made an excellent Crusader. KC would have made an excellent marcher with Martin Luther King, JR back in Montgomery, well, except that he's a damn Southerner and probably hates black people.

Very well said Erxomai. Very well said... heh, except that black part Tongue
(24-12-2011 12:14 AM)morondog Wrote:  LOL KC you poor bastard. It's gonna be lonely up in heaven.

Heh, no one knows that except for God Wink
(24-12-2011 12:15 AM)morondog Wrote:  Consider that point proven and then some Smile

Why thank you.
(24-12-2011 12:18 AM)Erxomai Wrote:  But only from your side of the fence.

No, I think in general. I put everything in the hands of an all powerful God while other belief systems try to help God out.
43. How loving is a god who commands the impaling of children and the raping of captured women?

I’m assuming you’re talking about Isaiah 13:16? This is, indeed, a horrifying and disturbing verse. But, like I said before, God is sovereign. If you read the entire chapter, it is about God’s wrath being evoked upon the unrighteous. He brings heavy justice to the unrighteous at this time, and just because something doesn’t seem fair to us, doesn’t mean it’s not justified to God.

44. Aren't a talking donkey, a flying axe and a motionless sun examples that should convince us of the Bible’s truth?

Confused at the question… is this sarcasm? They are examples or miracles, thus strengthening the believer’s faith.

45. Matthew 4:8 “Again, the devil taketh him [Jesus] up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;” As most people know, the world is round. To be able to see the kingdoms in, for example, South America, something more than a high mountain is needed. Must we give the lord a bad mark for geography?

This doesn’t mean Jesus was literally shown the entire world. You have to take this in context as well as the translation. Satan is speaking figuratively here.

46. Where did all the water for the Great Flood come from? And how did Noah assemble all those millions of animals? How did Noah get all their food together and how did he prevent them eating each other until they got back on land?

My belief:

1) Regional flood – so no issue with water
2) Regional animals – since it was a regional flood, only regional animals needed to be gathered. This greatly reduces the amount of animals that would be on the ark, so space is not an issue.
3) Noah had a VERY long time to get the food together, plus, it was only regional animals.
4) Just like when God shut the lions’ mouths with Daniel, it’s not a far stretch to say God prevented the animals from eating each other or starving.


47. When there are 1,500 creation myths, why should the story of one nomadic tribe from the Middle East be true?

No other reason than faith in your religion.

48. Is there proof available that a god exists outside the ideas and conceptions people have in their heads?

No. But, I believe that science alone if proof that God exists.

49. Why is there nothing about Herod's infanticide to be found in history books?

He was the king. He controlled history. Writing history as they saw fit was nothing new for a ruling body in a society.

50. There were dozens of scribes in Jesus’ lifetime in the area he inhabited. Why did no one write anything down?

Perhaps they did? Almost ALL religious writings were stored in the temple in Jerusalem. When it was destroyed in AD 70 only the few documents weren’t there survived. Most everything else was burned.

51. Jesus could read and write but an autobiography is lacking. Did he not have the time for this?

His ministry was being with others. Besides, His concern wasn’t on writing a biography, but it was on His sacrifice. He had others that served the purpose to document His life and His ministry.

52. Where was Jesus between the ages of 18 and 30?

The scriptures do not say.

53. In which year was Jesus born? There are disparate versions that indicate a difference of more than ten years.

Between 3-6 BC.

54. What is the use of letting billions of people suffer who are all forced to participate in a game of good and evil?

That is knowledge that only God can answer. But, I’ve touched on it a couple of time with my theological stance.

55. Why do Christians not kill any women in accordance with Deuteronomy 22:21 when they enter marriage as anything but virgins, but they oppose homosexual marriage?

More passages from which the believer has strayed: “And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.” (Leviticus 20:10; Deuteronomy 22:22)

Sex during menstruation: “And if a man shall lie with a woman having her sickness, and shall uncover her nakedness; he hath discovered her fountain, and she hath uncovered the fountain of her blood: and both of them shall be cut off from among their people.” (Leviticus 20:18)

Those were instructions for the Jews. Also, I do not oppose homosexual marriage, so I cannot speak for those people.

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24-12-2011, 03:12 AM (This post was last modified: 24-12-2011 03:23 AM by Jim.)
RE: Questions for the Christian believer
Thk's for the answers KC, we looking for the next set.
Quote:On the other hand, you have someone like Eyegore who comes in guns blazing to shoot us all and let God sort us out.
Its an old tradition in Christianity, in Béziers, the Pope said 'kill them all, god knows who he knows.'

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24-12-2011, 05:15 AM
RE: Questions for the Christian believer
GODAMMIT Jim I was going to say that quote.

Also when it comes to certain new testament contradictions we have to remember that the way history is recorded has changed a lot since modern times. for instance one of the gospels (cannot remember witch one) was written entirely in a form of Greek poetry. Also i was reading the life of St. Francis by Thomas of Celano who mentions that St. Francis in his youth engaged in many vices and was cruel and did many evils. There was an endnote that told me that is was a style of writing during the twelfth century where the hero is give a very different past from his present to create contrast and that St. Francis was probably kind as a youth as implied by another of his friends. It was that moment that I realized that history writing was much more of an art until at least the enlightenment if not later. So there is that. Also Job is also poetry

P.S. When jesus says some will see his coming it could also be in reference to John and revelation.

P.P.S. also the writings of the gospels apparently have several typos and other literary shortcomings.

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I'm. Also homophobic in the same way I'm arachnophobic. I'm scared of spiders but I'd still fuck'em.
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