Racism on this forum
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10-09-2012, 10:35 AM
RE: Racism on this forum
(10-09-2012 08:58 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  It's interesting to see that three members have left due to the lack of moderation towards offensive posts. Either people are too sensitive, or we are too anarchistic.
It's the first option. I do not even know how people like that function in the real world, where you are faced with actual racism, insults, bigotry, etc. If they are offended by posts on the Internet, what the hell are they going to do if they face a racist in real life? Start breaking down and crying?

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10-09-2012, 10:41 AM
RE: Racism on this forum
I think I can understand where the mods are going with this. In essence, speech that one person may see as "normal" another may see as offensive. One thing that a person may see as "hateful" another may see as expressing themselves. While it's true that some of the stuff people say is adopted by society as "racist remarks" at the same time, if we start opening the door on things that are controversial or perhaps "on the fence" then we would realistically need to look at ALL the things we say on the forum that are controversial or perhaps on the fence.

I mean this is a free thinker forum. There's a ton of opinions on here. While I don't agree with the way some people are talking, and perhaps are flippantly expressing words that others may take serious offense to, they still have the freedom of speech, and there have been no personal threats or direct insults made specifically at members.

We often say things that religious people take serious offense to, but to us, they aren't offensive. Controversial and offensive to the religious. I still think it's important to treat everyone equally, and again, this is not to excuse some of the stuff people on here have said (I still don't agree with it) but I can understand and support where the mods are with this stuff, since they still have to protect and enforce their rules fairly for everyone, and none of us are an exception to that rule should we express something controversial that may be seen in a negative light.

Coming at the standpoint of moderating things, if I were in their shoes and had to start filtering stuff over controversial views and opinions and banning them solely based on that, I'd spend my entire day walking gray areas of other posts and topics and who to ban and what not to bad. It's hard to get banned here. You guys don't wanna turn this place into a place like those other forums which we won't speak of that have "worthy" people on them than ban at the touch of a button with any even slight controversial discussion... do you?

<devil's advocate>
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10-09-2012, 10:46 AM
RE: Racism on this forum
(08-09-2012 01:41 PM)N.E.OhioAtheist Wrote:  I've been questing the moderators about what needs to be done with people who use hate speech that is racism. They say it is free speech and will not ban anyone who uses it. I find this cowardice and reprehensible. If you can ban a spammer or someone who threatens anyone this is not a free speech site. You already set rules and guide lines to be on here. If you are a total racist and use that then you should have ramifications from your actions. I know we all get into a heated debate and say things we regret. A warning would be good and then if it continues out you go. I am sick of seeing people use words that are repulsive. I am Hispanic and am repulsed by the word spic. I cant see any reason for it on here. In the past I've been belittle and cursed at and have no problem handling it. I rather not have that happen but I can deal with it. BUT racism is in a whole new ball game. I consider that HATE speech and has no place on TTA. If you want to keep new and old people something must be done. I am really upset about this. If no one cares than this forum, This is not the place for me. This is one Hispanic who will wonder why. You cant run in a movie theater and scream FIRE. Free speech has it's price.

NEO,

I share your strong dislike of racial epithets. I wouldn't want you to be subjected to "spic" any more than I like the use of "wop" or "guinea" etc for my people. I also dislike the more common demonizations, insults (both blatant and implied) and emotional taunts that infest many threads. And I don't claim to be innocent of engaging in the insult language from time to time. However I believe the current policy of "free" speech is the best one in a forum environment. The case where I meet feel differently is if it is being directed at someone specifically, (eg "ForumName, you stupid "racial slur" ") which I have not seen here. That feels like a special case, rising to the level of "hate speech" equivalent to an assault in the physical world. I would support the mods using their banning powers in those situations (a specific racial slur directed at a specific individual).
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10-09-2012, 11:00 AM
RE: Racism on this forum
Guess it's time for me to chime in on this nonsense.

Dom, you seem to have convinced yourself that this forum should be what you want it to be. That is not the case. Truth is, I expect you'll be gone within the week, and I'm ok with that. You see, there's no such thing as a forum that is right for everyone. You need protection from the big bad world via silly things like scrambling words. And that's fine, but you won't find it here.

As far as Seth goes.....everyone needs to get over it. Seth does not participate in the forum. He doesn't make the rules. He has nothing to do with the forum at all. So if you want to blame someone for the forum being anarchy, stop blaming the guy who isn't part of the forum. It's stupid. Instead, blame me.

Look, this forum isn't right for everyone. Accept it. It's not the end of the world if you realize it's not for you. Just move on. There's other forums out there that could very well accommodate you. Stop wasting your time on this one, and go seek out one that is the right fit for your needs.

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10-09-2012, 11:15 AM
RE: Racism on this forum
(10-09-2012 10:35 AM)Vosur Wrote:  
(10-09-2012 08:58 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  It's interesting to see that three members have left due to the lack of moderation towards offensive posts. Either people are too sensitive, or we are too anarchistic.
It's the first option. I do not even know how people like that function in the real world, where you are faced with actual racism, insults, bigotry, etc. If they are offended by posts on the Internet, what the hell are they going to do if they face a racist in real life? Start breaking down and crying?

They'd probably just soil themselves.

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10-09-2012, 11:18 AM
RE: Racism on this forum
(10-09-2012 09:40 AM)Hughsie Wrote:  
(10-09-2012 09:23 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  It is common knowledge that those words' meanings possess racist connotations. There is no other reason to use that selection of words to express yourself than to be offensive or racist.

Why do they possess racist connotations? Originally most words we consider racist were simply general terms for specific ethnic groups. They just got misused by a minority of assholes and now for some reason they are tainted for everyone. There have been plenty of Englishmen who've used derogatory terms for Americans because they have serious prejudices against anyone who is American. Yet when I call Erxomai a yank no-one bats an eyelid. Why? Because people know that the context I'm using those words in is not one of prejudice. Why would any other words be different?

Why certain words are considered racist, derogatory, and abusive is a question for linguists, historians, and sociologists. That's not the point. The point is that these words are derogatory and abusive, and they hurt people. Words matter. And they don't exist in a vacuum--they have associations. Racist terminology is associated with hate, oppression, and often violence. Whether or not they have that association for you is also not the point. They have that association for many.

If you can't see the difference between calling an American a Yank and calling a black person the N-word . . . I don't know what to say.

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10-09-2012, 11:21 AM
RE: Racism on this forum
(10-09-2012 10:35 AM)Vosur Wrote:  
(10-09-2012 08:58 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  It's interesting to see that three members have left due to the lack of moderation towards offensive posts. Either people are too sensitive, or we are too anarchistic.
It's the first option. I do not even know how people like that function in the real world, where you are faced with actual racism, insults, bigotry, etc. If they are offended by posts on the Internet, what the hell are they going to do if they face a racist in real life? Start breaking down and crying?

In the real world, I have to deal with it. And I do and I am good at it.

Doesn't mean I have to do so when I want to spend my time off. I look for intellectual stimulation and fun on my time off.

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10-09-2012, 11:26 AM
RE: Racism on this forum
(10-09-2012 11:00 AM)Stark Raving Wrote:  Guess it's time for me to chime in on this nonsense.

Dom, you seem to have convinced yourself that this forum should be what you want it to be. That is not the case. Truth is, I expect you'll be gone within the week, and I'm ok with that. You see, there's no such thing as a forum that is right for everyone. You need protection from the big bad world via silly things like scrambling words. And that's fine, but you won't find it here.

I don't need any protection, I'm all growed up.

And I don't aim to make anything what I want it to be, I am vocal and I have view points and I voice them and people think about them. And that is what most forums are about anyways.

I just don't like seeing good people who contribute good stuff leaving because nutcases who contribute crap prevail. Makes no freaking sense to me.

So, is this an invitation for me to pack it up? My opinions bother you enough to invite me to leave?

Hmmmmm..... (bites tongue, avoids comparison to recent events and contradictions in ethics)

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10-09-2012, 11:27 AM
RE: Racism on this forum
Racism?
Yeah, I've never seen that here besides the Hitler thread.

Maybe some sexist pricks and ignorant bastards, but not any racists that I know of.

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10-09-2012, 11:31 AM
RE: Racism on this forum
(10-09-2012 11:18 AM)cufflink Wrote:  Why certain words are considered racist, derogatory, and abusive is a question for linguists, historians, and sociologists. That's not the point. The point is that these words are derogatory and abusive, and they hurt people. Words matter. And they don't exist in a vacuum--they have associations. Racist terminology is associated with hate, oppression, and often violence. Whether or not they have that association for you is also not the point. They have that association for many.

If you can't see the difference between calling an American a Yank and calling a black person the N-word . . . I don't know what to say.

I know that some people find some words offensive. Like I said, I avoid using terms that are widely considered racist because I don't want to hurt anyone, not because I think using them is wrong. Whether you wanna call that sensitivity or lack of conviction is up to you. I simply think the way words are used holds more meaning than the word itself. If words themselves hold meaning then me having a laugh with Erx and exchanging abusive terms would be exactly the same as some stranger yelling abuse at him in the street, where clearly it's not.

Also, who has the right to tell earmuffs he has to accept their understanding of words whilst refusing to even listen to his? I don't, and I don't think you do either.

As far as comparing the N-word to Yank goes, I understand that for a lot of people they give both words very different meanings, I personally don't. To me, one is a generic term for a specific group of people that a few idiots may misuse but I only use in a non-offensive way, and the other one .............

Best and worst of Ferdinand .....
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Ferdinand: We don't really say 'theist' in Alabama. Here, you're either a Christian, or you're from Afghanistan and we fucking hate you.
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Ferdinand: Everyone from British is so, like, fucking retarded.
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