Racist Conservative Gun Nuts Getting A Taste Of Their Own Medicine
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11-01-2015, 02:32 PM
RE: Racist Conservative Gun Nuts Getting A Taste Of Their Own Medicine
The assumptions this article are based on are inaccurate. I had this conversation already with other gun owners and the overwhelming consensus was that there is no problem with Black Panthers open carrying. If they break the law, on the other hand, that is a completely different thing.

You guys don't like guns. I get it, great. But the idea of this situation as some kind of smoking barrel against the hypocrisy of gun owners is based on the idea that we have a problem with it, which is a flawed assumption. To most of us, Black Panthers carrying guns is a non issue, slightly less interesting than a squirrel getting stuck in a tree. There may be some nutty conspiracy websites out there raising a fuss, but they do not represent the majority.

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11-01-2015, 03:02 PM
RE: Racist Conservative Gun Nuts Getting A Taste Of Their Own Medicine
(11-01-2015 02:32 PM)yakherder Wrote:  You guys don't like guns. I get it, great.
I don't think that people don't like guns.
It's that people want to be safe and they see guns as a threat to their own safety.

(11-01-2015 02:32 PM)yakherder Wrote:  But the idea of this situation as some kind of smoking barrel ...
Looking at both sides of the equation.
1. Some black people open carrying as protection against the police.
2. People that just want a safe society.

Addressing 1. I can understand how some black people can see the police as a threat to their own safety. Black kids being shot with toy guns. An unarmed black man being chocked to death and the police seem to get away with it.
Under USA law people can carry guns and use them to protect themselves. It makes sense that some black people see guns as a solution to the threat that police present to them. Regarding the "smoking gun", yeah it makes being a police officer much more dangerous a prospect. It means police will be more paranoid and may mean that there are more shootings of innocent black people. There may also be a case where some black people try to protect another black person from the police and then these black people will go to prison and then there may be riots for an unjust judicial system.

Addressing item 2. Lots of people see the police as a necessary component of society, to help protect people and make society safe. They would see people carrying guns for the specific purpose of confronting police as a major threat to public safety.

(11-01-2015 02:32 PM)yakherder Wrote:  ...against the hypocrisy of gun owners is based on the idea that we have a problem with it, which is a flawed assumption.
lot's of generalisations happening on both sides of the fence here.
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11-01-2015, 03:33 PM
RE: Racist Conservative Gun Nuts Getting A Taste Of Their Own Medicine
(11-01-2015 02:29 PM)Patriot10mm Wrote:  Tracking concealed carry permit holders crime stats is fairly easy, and they get revoked when they go to renew and the current background check finds criminal activity or after a criminal conviction of a disqualifying crime. By looking at how many get revoked compared to how many are issued, one can see how small of a % actually commit crimes. Its a fraction of the % of the national crime rate.
http://www.gunfacts.info/gun-control-myt...led-carry/
One could easily equate the low crime rate to the precondition of not having a prior criminal record rather than having an ownership of a concealed carry permit.

It seems that criminals are more likely to re-offend than the likelihood of non criminals to offend for the first time. Somewhat like saying that people who have had sex before are more likely to have sex in the immediate future than people who are virgins.

What would be more interesting would be a report comparing concealed carry permit holders vs people with out previous criminal records whom don't own or carry guns. I would bet my left nut that the carry permit holders are much more likely to commit gun crimes than the group that doesn't carry guns.

Women, gun violence and the home


Quote:A gun in the home is much more likely to be used to intimidate or physically injure a family member than to be used against an outside intruder. Women who live with a gun in their home are more likely to be shot and killed than those who do not live with guns. In the US, having a gun in the home increases the overall risk of someone in the household being murdered by 41%. For women, however, the risk of death is tripled.
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11-01-2015, 04:08 PM
RE: Racist Conservative Gun Nuts Getting A Taste Of Their Own Medicine
(11-01-2015 03:33 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(11-01-2015 02:29 PM)Patriot10mm Wrote:  Tracking concealed carry permit holders crime stats is fairly easy, and they get revoked when they go to renew and the current background check finds criminal activity or after a criminal conviction of a disqualifying crime. By looking at how many get revoked compared to how many are issued, one can see how small of a % actually commit crimes. Its a fraction of the % of the national crime rate.
http://www.gunfacts.info/gun-control-myt...led-carry/
One could easily equate the low crime rate to the precondition of not having a prior criminal record rather than having an ownership of a concealed carry permit.

It seems that criminals are more likely to re-offend than the likelihood of non criminals to offend for the first time. Somewhat like saying that people who have had sex before are more likely to have sex in the immediate future than people who are virgins.

What would be more interesting would be a report comparing concealed carry permit holders vs people with out previous criminal records whom don't own or carry guns. I would bet my left nut that the carry permit holders are much more likely to commit gun crimes than the group that doesn't carry guns.

Women, gun violence and the home


Quote:A gun in the home is much more likely to be used to intimidate or physically injure a family member than to be used against an outside intruder. Women who live with a gun in their home are more likely to be shot and killed than those who do not live with guns. In the US, having a gun in the home increases the overall risk of someone in the household being murdered by 41%. For women, however, the risk of death is tripled.

I think the point is still made though, that the type of person that obtains a concealed carry permit are not by nature criminally minded, and a significantly smaller threat than someone who obtains a firearm illegally or carries illegally. When I'm around town, out at a restaurant, sitting in a movie theater, I'm not worried about someone with a concealed permit pulling out his gun and shooting random people. In fact, I carry a gun to protect myself from people that don't have concealed permits. I'm not talking about the people that don't own guns, I mean specifically criminals that don't have permits, or illegally possessing guns or the loon that decides to steal his parents gun and go on a shooting rampage. People that go through the trouble of obtaining a permit are probably on the straight path in life.

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11-01-2015, 04:14 PM
RE: Racist Conservative Gun Nuts Getting A Taste Of Their Own Medicine
So conservatives are racist, yet the NBBP is not?

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11-01-2015, 04:27 PM
RE: Racist Conservative Gun Nuts Getting A Taste Of Their Own Medicine
(11-01-2015 04:08 PM)Patriot10mm Wrote:  People that go through the trouble of obtaining a permit are probably on the straight path in life.
Except for when emotions take over and they get angry with their wife, girlfriend or kids.
Probably less of a risk to general public, but more of a risk to immediate family.
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11-01-2015, 04:39 PM (This post was last modified: 11-01-2015 04:58 PM by Patriot10mm.)
RE: Racist Conservative Gun Nuts Getting A Taste Of Their Own Medicine
(11-01-2015 04:27 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(11-01-2015 04:08 PM)Patriot10mm Wrote:  People that go through the trouble of obtaining a permit are probably on the straight path in life.
Except for when emotions take over and they get angry with their wife, girlfriend or kids.
Probably less of a risk to general public, but more of a risk to immediate family.
(11-01-2015 04:27 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(11-01-2015 04:08 PM)Patriot10mm Wrote:  People that go through the trouble of obtaining a permit are probably on the straight path in life.
Except for when emotions take over and they get angry with their wife, girlfriend or kids.
Probably less of a risk to general public, but more of a risk to immediate family.

While I know the stats on guns used in domestic violence situations, and you are correct in that regard, I disagree that concealed carry permit holders are any kind of statistic there, due to the relatively small number of permits that have been revoked upon criminal conviction. I mean the number is so small compared to the actual number of concealed permits out there.

I would bet both of my nuts that gun crimes in domestic violence are carried out by three groups:

1. Illegal gun owners.
2. Gun owners without concealed carry permits.
3. Gun owners that became gun owners through gifts, family death and handed down to them, so they lack training and haven't gone through a proper vetting process of purchasing a firearm. These types have a gun but never use it. It sits in the closet until they snap one day. Usually find these types in trailer parks and have a mullet.

And I can tell you from years of working in law enforcement, a large portion of gun crime related criminal violence was perpetrated by people that were not permitted to have a gun in the first place.

Not saying it doesn't happen. http://www.kitsapsun.com/news/local-news...e-for-wife

That guy was my boss in the Navy military police in Washington. Gun owner. Killed his wife and stepson.

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11-01-2015, 08:44 PM
RE: Racist Conservative Gun Nuts Getting A Taste Of Their Own Medicine
I stopped reading at "penis extensions."

Get back to me when you're ready to have an adult conversation about firearms. Drinking Beverage

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12-01-2015, 08:27 AM
RE: Racist Conservative Gun Nuts Getting A Taste Of Their Own Medicine
(11-01-2015 12:52 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(10-01-2015 01:40 PM)goodwithoutgod Wrote:  For example, the other day I was in a restaurant called chipolte, its a tex mex kind of place. Anyway this young man walked in with a group of friends, he was wearing camo pants, combat boots, a black tshirt and strapped to his side was a large holstered pistol. He came swaggering in like he was Wyatt Earp. I saw the nervous looks passed between several older couples, who quickly got up and gathered their things and left.

...


This is why I have a concealed carry licence. You don't know I have a gun on me,

I'd far rather people have to show that they are carrying than people be allowed to conceal.
Those people that saw the danger and intelligently chose to remove themselves from a potentially deadly situation, at least they had that option.

With a person concealing the weapon, other people are unaware of the present danger. If they knew you were concealing then they could have the choice to avoid you and avoid places that you are at.

Perhaps the conceal people ought to by law wear a shirt with big words on it. "I'm carrying a loaded gun in a public place". That way I could see the danger and I could take my family far away.

As 10mm implied, your thinking on this seems the reverse of sensible. Those who are legally carrying a concealed firearm are vastly more likely to be your ally, not a threat.

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12-01-2015, 08:32 AM
RE: Racist Conservative Gun Nuts Getting A Taste Of Their Own Medicine
(11-01-2015 01:39 PM)Metazoa Zeke Wrote:  
(11-01-2015 01:08 PM)Patriot10mm Wrote:  I disagree, because concealed firearm permits are issued under fairly strict background checks, training requirements etc. Rarely do people with permits commit crime. I've seen stats before, and if correct, carry permit holders are probably the least likely group to commit gun violence. I applied for mine in Florida in November. They are very thorough, and go in depth into criminal history, even military UCMJ violations. It's been two months and I'm still waiting for it to be issued.

I would actually like to see the source for this.

A source for what?

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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