Raising Minimum Wage - or How to Keep the Poor, Poor.
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31-07-2015, 12:48 AM
RE: Raising Minimum Wage - or How to Keep the Poor, Poor.
(30-07-2015 07:44 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  Irony ---

Starting a thread, and being outposted by your detractors 3 to 1 --- and being declared a troll, by those who took over............

....


Is life fucking weird, or what????

get used to it especially if your views are in the minority.
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31-07-2015, 01:11 AM
RE: Raising Minimum Wage - or How to Keep the Poor, Poor.
(30-07-2015 11:18 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(30-07-2015 05:19 PM)Anjele Wrote:  I cannot even believe you said that...and I have low expectations when it comes to your posts.

I'm not saying you shouldn't hire blacks.....dummy. I am saying that if you are so inclined not hire blacks you can do it without any economic consequence thanks to the minimum wage.


Having known the people I work with (we're paid above minimum wage but it's a minimum wage job), I have absolutely zero faith in them to be able to negotiate their own wage rate and not be exploited.

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31-07-2015, 03:08 AM
RE: Raising Minimum Wage - or How to Keep the Poor, Poor.
(31-07-2015 01:11 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  
(30-07-2015 11:18 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  I'm not saying you shouldn't hire blacks.....dummy. I am saying that if you are so inclined not hire blacks you can do it without any economic consequence thanks to the minimum wage.


Having known the people I work with (we're paid above minimum wage but it's a minimum wage job), I have absolutely zero faith in them to be able to negotiate their own wage rate and not be exploited.

Minimum wage really doesn't matter. In the long run all those minimum wage jobs are going to be replaced by automation.
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31-07-2015, 06:45 AM
Raising Minimum Wage - or How to Keep the Poor, Poor.
(30-07-2015 07:48 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(30-07-2015 07:36 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  The point is to demonstrate that the generic rhetoric that a higher minimum wage is a job killer is false.
Well, I don't see how anyone can "believe" that banner.
How do you logically assess that raising minimum wage leads to less unemployment?

How does that work?
Is it because somehow there are more jobs available or is it because now with the higher wage more people are choosing to work rather than choosing to be unemployed?

Or is there something else at play?

It's the observation from Seattle that unemployment dropped. Perhaps directly related, perhaps not. Once again, the point is that it directly contradicts the argument that raising the minimum wage is a job killer.

Kansas has been cutting taxes left and right with no minimum wage adjustment and they have seen some of the slowest economic growth in the country.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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31-07-2015, 06:49 AM
Raising Minimum Wage - or How to Keep the Poor, Poor.
(30-07-2015 07:50 PM)BryanS Wrote:  
(30-07-2015 07:44 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  Irony ---

Starting a thread, and being outposted by your detractors 3 to 1 --- and being declared a troll, by those who took over............

....


Is life fucking weird, or what????

The answer to what happens when minimum wage is raised to those near the minimum wage is quite simply the other wage earners gradually adjust to make more as well. The adjustment happens simply due to market pressures. In order to attract better than minimum-wage employees and work product, one has to pay more than minimum wage. The increase may take some time, but it will happen.

I don't buy your original post's argument, though I'm no lefty by any means.

As Rev pointed out, it does work that way.

If you give lower or middle class $5000 dollars, what are they most likely to do with it? Maybe pay a bill, credit card, or buy a luxury they don't have.

If the rich get $5000 what are they likely to do? Put it in the bank or some long term investment, but they don't spend it (this too has been an observation for what the rich have done with the tax incentives over the last few decades).

So between the rich and the poor/middle class, it's the latter that spends its excess money on the economy.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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31-07-2015, 08:25 AM
RE: Raising Minimum Wage - or How to Keep the Poor, Poor.
(30-07-2015 01:36 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(30-07-2015 12:47 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  If corporations are people for the purposes of political donations, why aren't they people when it comes to the tax code?
Taxes are simply an expense, a huge expense. If hiring a decent accountant can help reduce or remove the tax expense then that is the smart thing to do. Why pay taxes if you don't have to? That would be silly.

I wasn't criticizing the corporation, I was criticizing the judgement handed down by SCOTUS.
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31-07-2015, 08:55 AM
RE: Raising Minimum Wage - or How to Keep the Poor, Poor.
(30-07-2015 11:12 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  To those who say discrimination is illegal that doesn't stop it from happening. A business owner can still favor whites over blacks. He will simply make up reasons not to hire the black applicants.

I doubt it happens anywhere near the level you seem to think it does, because companies do not want to incur legal expenses. Do you have some numbers to support this argument, which appears specious on its face?

(30-07-2015 11:12 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  Right now there are special ed people who could work but no one will hire them because their productivity is not worth the minimum wage.


I see disabled or mentally-handicapped people working as baggers in the three supermarkets I have nearby.

(30-07-2015 11:12 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  Minimum wage cuts the bottom rungs off the economic ladder. It is morally evil because it hurts the people who need the most help.

Move to a country without one, then. It's a necessity to make sure corporations don't take advantage of their position to squeeze their workers. I'm not really a fan of the working conditions extant in America's Gilded Age, are you?

(30-07-2015 11:12 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  I support no minimum wage and a universal basic income.

I was wondering when you'd bring that up.
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31-07-2015, 12:31 PM (This post was last modified: 31-07-2015 12:36 PM by Heywood Jahblome.)
RE: Raising Minimum Wage - or How to Keep the Poor, Poor.
(31-07-2015 06:45 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(30-07-2015 07:48 PM)Stevil Wrote:  Well, I don't see how anyone can "believe" that banner.
How do you logically assess that raising minimum wage leads to less unemployment?

How does that work?
Is it because somehow there are more jobs available or is it because now with the higher wage more people are choosing to work rather than choosing to be unemployed?

Or is there something else at play?

It's the observation from Seattle that unemployment dropped. Perhaps directly related, perhaps not. Once again, the point is that it directly contradicts the argument that raising the minimum wage is a job killer.

Kansas has been cutting taxes left and right with no minimum wage adjustment and they have seen some of the slowest economic growth in the country.

The minimum wage is just a small part of an economy. It is possible to grow an economy and raise the minimum wage. But there has a been a noticeable rise in restaurant closures in Seattle since they implemented their $15 dollar minimum wage. Last it is not all about jobs lost. It is also about jobs created. Less human labor will be employed at $15 than if the wage is lower than that.

Companies are turning to general purpose robots like Baxter. And people are also thinking about building restaurant menus around the capabilities of this robot.



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31-07-2015, 12:40 PM
RE: Raising Minimum Wage - or How to Keep the Poor, Poor.
(31-07-2015 12:31 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(31-07-2015 06:45 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  It's the observation from Seattle that unemployment dropped. Perhaps directly related, perhaps not. Once again, the point is that it directly contradicts the argument that raising the minimum wage is a job killer.

Kansas has been cutting taxes left and right with no minimum wage adjustment and they have seen some of the slowest economic growth in the country.

The minimum wage is just a small part of an economy. It is possible to grow an economy and raise the minimum wage. But there has a been a noticeable rise in restaurant closures in Seattle since they implemented their $15 dollar minimum wage. Last it is not all about jobs lost. It is also about jobs created. Less human labor will be employed at $15 than if the wage is lower than that.

Companies are turning to general purpose robots like Baxter. And people are also thinking about building restaurant menus around the capabilities of this robot.




Bullshit. I linked earlier to an article that showed that Seattle has the #2 restaurant market in the country, only behind San Francisco. So try again.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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31-07-2015, 12:44 PM
RE: Raising Minimum Wage - or How to Keep the Poor, Poor.
(31-07-2015 12:40 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(31-07-2015 12:31 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  The minimum wage is just a small part of an economy. It is possible to grow an economy and raise the minimum wage. But there has a been a noticeable rise in restaurant closures in Seattle since they implemented their $15 dollar minimum wage. Last it is not all about jobs lost. It is also about jobs created. Less human labor will be employed at $15 than if the wage is lower than that.

Companies are turning to general purpose robots like Baxter. And people are also thinking about building restaurant menus around the capabilities of this robot.




Bullshit. I linked earlier to an article that showed that Seattle has the #2 restaurant market in the country, only behind San Francisco. So try again.

http://www.seattlemag.com/article/why-ar...ing-lately
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