Ranting corner
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11-09-2012, 07:29 AM (This post was last modified: 11-09-2012 07:36 AM by bemore.)
RE: Ranting corner
(08-09-2012 08:51 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  
(08-09-2012 08:37 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  You should sell muffins too. That way you can call it Muffs and Nuts

Consider

The problem with selling muffins is then I'd be just another cafe when what I'm looking for is a donut specific cafe/fast food place.

Writing a list of shit I need to price.
Ovens, coffee machines, disposable cups, soft-serve machine, napkins, paper bags to put donuts in, perhaps hotdog things, frosting utensils, POS computer and eftpos (includes receipt paper), benches, tables/chairs, signage, menus, fridge/freezer, sink, coke fridges (though I think coke lends you those), staff, decor, computer business software, advertisement, donut dough, frosting ingredients, coffee beans, cream/milk, uniforms, cleaning stuff, food serving licenses, disposable gloves, perhaps boxes to put large amounts of donuts in, plastic bags, coffee cups and plates for instore eaters.
That's about what I got so far.
Need to email suppliers, design places, look around for decor and furniture, perhaps secondhand coffee machines/ovens/fridge/freezers. Then once I have all the money side of it sorted out, how much everything is gonna cost, I will have a clear picture of if it's even worth it. And then if it is I gotta some how convince the bank to give me money. OH and find a place to actually set-up.
Shit be cray cray yo.

I think the very first thing you should do bro is to go to the places where you are thinking of lending the money and asking them what it is they want off you.

Im sure a business plan is one thing (which it sounds like your in the process of doing) however in the current economy im sure they will ask for some collateral or that you invest some of your own money into it with them to show them how serious you are. Everything you are doing now could potentially be wasted time if you dont know how you are going to get the money to follow through with this.

You think $350,000 sounds a lot to start a franchise...... Im wondering how much you think it will cost to start your own business on your own..... after you have found suitable premises that get enough passing trade, signed the lease, paid the deposit, got in touch with suppliers who I will be very surprised if they will give you credit straight off without making a few purchases first.

Who would be your closest competition.... could you compete with their prices.... could you compete with their products (as im guessing you would probably be new to making doughnuts)..... do the people in your area want a doughnut shop/cafe (have you done any market research???)..... could the market allready be saturated with similar businesses???

What sort of advertising are you thinking of doing??? Because advertising can be like a black hole.... eating up all of your money with no guarantee of any returns.

The good thing about franchises is they will help you set up...... they allready know what it takes to succeed and what it takes to fail (in other words they have experience) and they have a product which is allready known and what people buy.... in the franchise price will be everything you need and im guessing it will cost a lot less then setting up solo.

Im hoping that your original thoughts towards this business wasnt.......

If I purchase A ingredient and B ingredient and cover it with C ingredient then it will cost me $0.50 per unit........ I can sell each unit at $1.50 minimum meaning that If I sell 1000 units then my turnover will be a minimum of $1500 p/w.

I have seen so many people think this way and they have all failed...... im not saying this will be the case with you.

I think if you really want to start your own business and have profit in your hand then you should consider window cleaning...... before you shrug this Idea off you can set yourself up for around $400 (double tier trade ladders, 1 bucket, 1 applicator, 1 blade to remove the water, 2 scrims/clothes and a Tshirt/cap with your business name on it) and then your only other outgoings after that will be washing up liquid/detergent which you can buy in bulk for about $20 for 6 months worth.

You need no business premises and you can run it off a mobile phone, if there are no window cleaners in your area then potentially you can make a killing..... Id start off with domestic properties first and then look at trying to get into trade properties.

Just an idea dude.

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11-09-2012, 11:05 PM
RE: Ranting corner
Quote:I think the very first thing you should do bro is to go to the places where you are thinking of lending the money and asking them what it is they want off you.

Im sure a business plan is one thing (which it sounds like your in the process of doing) however in the current economy im sure they will ask for some collateral or that you invest some of your own money into it with them to show them how serious you are. Everything you are doing now could potentially be wasted time if you dont know how you are going to get the money to follow through with this.

Yea I feel sort of stupid for not doing this already, I mean it's the clear smack in your face basics. The first thing you do before you do anything.
I seriously don't know why I haven't already. I mean I got information apparently in the mail ("3-4" working days my ass ANZ!), even got a free copy of Franchise magazine. But nothing has come yet, I'm in town tomorrow I think I'll just go in.

I'm seriously fucked if they want me to invest money as well or even put it against existing assets because seriously all I have off worth would be pushing to get over 10K, and 8-9K of that is my motorbike.

Quote:You think $350,000 sounds a lot to start a franchise...... Im wondering how much you think it will cost to start your own business on your own..... after you have found suitable premises that get enough passing trade, signed the lease, paid the deposit, got in touch with suppliers who I will be very surprised if they will give you credit straight off without making a few purchases first.

I do have a list of everything that I need to price. And when I say everything I mean things from coffee cups with logos printed on them, to insurance, to legal fees, to staff uniforms, to cleaning products, to lease initial bond, to initial renovations.
Without finding out the price of anything, my estimate would be around the 50k mark, just to get started. Which is still a hell of a lot cheaper then 350k.

Quote:Who would be your closest competition.... could you compete with their prices.... could you compete with their products (as im guessing you would probably be new to making doughnuts)..... do the people in your area want a doughnut shop/cafe (have you done any market research???)..... could the market allready be saturated with similar businesses???

This is the reason progress has halted currently for the time being (university and finding a job have taken priority for the time being). Because I've been thinking a lot about it and I'm still not 100% what kind of business. Like donuts sure but what kind? Like, is it a cafe' more coffee house feel, or is it more children fast food playful feel, or is it like a subway style pick your own topping.
There's really nothing like it in the market. Nothing sells donuts but the bakery in the super market. The problem with Wellington is it's exactly like back in my home town, it's full of cafe's and restaurants. So that's why I'm leaning more towards fast food style rather then 'coffee house'.

Quote:What sort of advertising are you thinking of doing??? Because advertising can be like a black hole.... eating up all of your money with no guarantee of any returns.

Newspaper really, perhaps radio. And initially flyers, like hand out on street 2 for 1 coupons or whatever. Something to get customers in the door on that first day.
This sort of thing is very much word of mouth and repeat customers.

Quote:The good thing about franchises is they will help you set up...... they allready know what it takes to succeed and what it takes to fail (in other words they have experience) and they have a product which is allready known and what people buy.... in the franchise price will be everything you need and im guessing it will cost a lot less then setting up solo.

That's the thing though, donut franchises (Dunkin Donuts, Donut King) aren't well known in NZ. There's 3 of each store and they're all the way up in Auckland (was looking at suppliers and I think I can see why they're all up in Auckland... which could be a future problem) and so that was sort of the appeal of it (I wouldn't do it if there was already established donut places), get in first.

Quote:If I purchase A ingredient and B ingredient and cover it with C ingredient then it will cost me $0.50 per unit........ I can sell each unit at $1.50 minimum meaning that If I sell 1000 units then my turnover will be a minimum of $1500 p/w.

My initial thought was, If I purchase A and B at $0.50 per unit and sell C for $1.50 per unit then I need to sell XXXX to cover costs and an additional XXX to make a worthwhile profit.

Quote:I think if you really want to start your own business and have profit in your hand then you should consider window cleaning...... before you shrug this Idea off you can set yourself up for around $400 (double tier trade ladders, 1 bucket, 1 applicator, 1 blade to remove the water, 2 scrims/clothes and a Tshirt/cap with your business name on it) and then your only other outgoings after that will be washing up liquid/detergent which you can buy in bulk for about $20 for 6 months worth.

Window cleaning? Consider

Ya know in a city like this where it's mostly busy business people, window cleaning is probably a very good idea. That can have potential commercial clients as well.

Consider

Perhaps a fortnightly service. The client automatically pays say $20-$30 a fortnight, then one of the cleaners automatically comes out to your house and cleans your windows. You wouldn't even need to be home. Same with commercial.
Maybe hire uni students. Pay minimum wage or a little above, $15. It should take them around an hour to complete the task. Or maybe pay them on a commission basis, per-house. So they're rewarded for doing a quick job, penalized for taking years. Paying them on a per-house basis would be good for finances too. Consider
I think you're on to something Bemore.
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11-09-2012, 11:13 PM
RE: Ranting corner
You wanna know how many window cleaning businesses there are in Wellington? (A city of 200,000 people I might add)
Fourteen.

edit: correction, there was a page 2. Nineteen.
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11-09-2012, 11:21 PM
RE: Ranting corner
(11-09-2012 11:13 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  You wanna know how many window cleaning businesses there are in Wellington? (A city of 200,000 people I might add)
Fourteen.

edit: correction, there was a page 2. Nineteen.

Glad to see your yeast infection cleared up. Wink Big Grin Thumbsup

#sigh
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12-09-2012, 04:16 AM
RE: Ranting corner
(11-09-2012 11:21 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(11-09-2012 11:13 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  You wanna know how many window cleaning businesses there are in Wellington? (A city of 200,000 people I might add)
Fourteen.

edit: correction, there was a page 2. Nineteen.

Glad to see your yeast infection cleared up. Wink Big Grin Thumbsup

Yeah that cream you suggested really did the trick.
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12-09-2012, 04:47 AM (This post was last modified: 12-09-2012 04:50 AM by bemore.)
RE: Ranting corner
Yes there are a lot of window cleaners in the UK as well.... I thought it might be different where you are Sad

If you do still wanna try it or for any other business Ideas you have I can write you a killer pitch with a almost guaranteed close that will get them everytime and advice on how to maximise on the areas you are hitting.

With regards to employees once you get enough work..... Id employ them on a sub-contract basis so they are responsible for their own taxes/insurances and then if you need to let them go you can do without having to worry about legalities.

EDIT: If there seems to be a gap in the market for doughnuts then go for it...... I imagine they do have a huge profit margin..... maybe apply for a license as a street vendor to begin with so you can hit a lot of passing trade.

I feel so much, and yet I feel nothing.
I am a rock, I am the sky, the birds and the trees and everything beyond.
I am the wind, in the fields in which I roar. I am the water, in which I drown.
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12-09-2012, 06:56 AM (This post was last modified: 12-09-2012 07:01 AM by earmuffs.)
RE: Ranting corner
(12-09-2012 04:47 AM)bemore Wrote:  Yes there are a lot of window cleaners in the UK as well.... I thought it might be different where you are Sad

If you do still wanna try it or for any other business Ideas you have I can write you a killer pitch with a almost guaranteed close that will get them everytime and advice on how to maximise on the areas you are hitting.

With regards to employees once you get enough work..... Id employ them on a sub-contract basis so they are responsible for their own taxes/insurances and then if you need to let them go you can do without having to worry about legalities.

EDIT: If there seems to be a gap in the market for doughnuts then go for it...... I imagine they do have a huge profit margin..... maybe apply for a license as a street vendor to begin with so you can hit a lot of passing trade.

Cheers man, might take you up on that in the future.

And yeah that was the plan. We did all this employment crap in one of my university papers. Employees v contractors. Total eye opener, why anyone would hire employees when they can hire "independent contractors" is beyond me.

edit: mini rant. So I'm currently watching Lord of The Rings movies again, because they're friggin awesome, and so decided to download a LotR Mod for one of the best games of all time, Rome Total War. Except it needs to have the expansion so I download that, 500mb nice and easy. Anyway, I actually own the original but I original put it on my laptop and so when I got my PC I just put the directory onto my external so I didn't have to install it on my PC. BUT that is causing problems when installing the expansion (which I need installed for this mod, I have another LotR mod for Medieval Total War II so I'm not fussed if this one doesn't work) because the expansion needs the original on the PC. So, simple solution, copy it from the external to the proper directory. Problem, it's over 4.5G. "Copying - Estimated time 9 hours"
FML.
Luckily as I'm writing this the time just came down to 15minutes, oh and as I'm writing this down to 3minutes and almost done. Crisis averted. Well, as long as I can install the expansion the crisis is adverted. Fingers crossed this works.
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12-09-2012, 07:05 AM
RE: Ranting corner
(12-09-2012 04:47 AM)bemore Wrote:  Yes there are a lot of window cleaners in the UK as well.... I thought it might be different where you are Sad

If you do still wanna try it or for any other business Ideas you have I can write you a killer pitch with a almost guaranteed close that will get them everytime and advice on how to maximise on the areas you are hitting.

With regards to employees once you get enough work..... Id employ them on a sub-contract basis so they are responsible for their own taxes/insurances and then if you need to let them go you can do without having to worry about legalities.

EDIT: If there seems to be a gap in the market for doughnuts then go for it...... I imagine they do have a huge profit margin..... maybe apply for a license as a street vendor to begin with so you can hit a lot of passing trade.

Or possibly a hole in the doughnut market.Consider

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12-09-2012, 07:12 AM
RE: Ranting corner
(12-09-2012 07:05 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(12-09-2012 04:47 AM)bemore Wrote:  Yes there are a lot of window cleaners in the UK as well.... I thought it might be different where you are Sad

If you do still wanna try it or for any other business Ideas you have I can write you a killer pitch with a almost guaranteed close that will get them everytime and advice on how to maximise on the areas you are hitting.

With regards to employees once you get enough work..... Id employ them on a sub-contract basis so they are responsible for their own taxes/insurances and then if you need to let them go you can do without having to worry about legalities.

EDIT: If there seems to be a gap in the market for doughnuts then go for it...... I imagine they do have a huge profit margin..... maybe apply for a license as a street vendor to begin with so you can hit a lot of passing trade.



Or possibly a hole in the doughnut market.Consider

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12-09-2012, 11:44 AM
RE: Ranting corner
WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON?!


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