Reasons for a Bible full of holes?
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13-08-2014, 03:32 PM (This post was last modified: 14-08-2014 02:23 PM by fluffycat.)
Reasons for a Bible full of holes?
Why is the Bible full of Holes? Is it possible that we can only get a glimpse of what actually is truth? Possible that the Bible is full of fiction, myth and fantasy for a reason? Would it be great if we had cut and dried answers to all our questions. If we knew all that was true and if in fact (big If) and say there actually was such a thing as free choice in regards to selecting what is evil and what is good. Would we expect that the evil choices would be made for the most part. By doing evil things would we thus be considered all evil? Because we have all (?) made evil/sinful choices, does an eternal soul require an intervention to have peace if consciousness extends beyond what we experience from the pragmatic existence here on earth. Perhaps “Saved” if there is such a thing, might be achieved because we have these sincere doubts.

I would venture to say there are a lot of Atheists who do better from a moral standpoint in regard to how they interact with there fellow human-beings than the slick get rich-huckster preachers on TBN.

I go to a Lutheran church and am mostly German in my heritage. I have difficulty knowing that Luther toward the end of his life, was filled with hatred and ranted against the Jews. Might even say some of his viewpoints might have contributed to deaths during the Holocaust. I don’t find myself comfortable in attending church for the reason I consider myself of a scientific mind. This of course contradicts a lot of what is written in the Bible. The things that grab my attention and ring true are insights that come from some of the teachings of Jesus. Contemplating my own moral dilemma in regards to past and present actions keeps me from saying everything is all hogwash.

Just a short survey question? I am wondering how many have prayed in their life?
I have, but unsure of what it meant.
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13-08-2014, 03:37 PM
RE: Reasons for a Bible full of holes?
(13-08-2014 03:32 PM)fluffycat Wrote:  Why is the Bible full of Holes? Is it possible that we can only get a glimpse of what actually is truth? Possible that the Bible is full of fiction, myth and fantasy for a reason? Would it be great if we had cut and dried answers to all our questions. If we knew all that was true and if in fact (big If) and say there actually was such a thing as free choice in regards to selecting what is evil and what is good. Would we expect that the evil choices would be made for the most part. By doing evil things would we thus be considered all evil? Because we have all (?) made evil/sinful choices, does an eternal soul require an intervention to have peace if consciousness extends beyond what we experience from the pragmatic existence here on earth. Perhaps “Saved” if there is such a thing, might be achieved because we have these sincere doubts.

I would venture to say there are a lot of Atheists who do better from a moral standpoint in regard to how they interact with there fellow human-beings than the slick get rich-huckster preachers on TBN.

I go to a Lutheran church and am mostly German in my heritage. I have difficulty knowing that Luther toward the end of his life, was filled with hatred and ranted against the Jews. Might even say some of his viewpoints might have contributed to deaths during the Holocaust. I don’t find myself comfortable in attending church for the reason I consider myself of a scientific mind. This of course contradicts a lot of what is written in the Bible. The things that grab my attention and wring true are insights that come from some of the teachings of Jesus. Contemplating my own moral dilemma in regards to past and present actions keeps me from saying everything is all hogwash.

Just a short survey question? I am wondering how many have prayed in their life?
I have, but unsure of what it meant.

It is a document of convenience, that is why it is full of holes. It is mythology that was designed to increase the power of the priest (The Levites) peeling back the facade and seeing how the books came to be reveals much more truth about the human condition than any fairy tale stories ever could. I recommend the Bible Unearthed, it is a book and a tv series. Here is part 1.




(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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13-08-2014, 03:48 PM
RE: Reasons for a Bible full of holes?
(13-08-2014 03:32 PM)fluffycat Wrote:  Just a short survey question? I am wondering how many have prayed in their life?
I have, but unsure of what it meant.

Pray, v. To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf of a single petitioner, confessedly unworthy.
-- Ambrose Bierce

I've performed the ritual before Wink It made me temporarily feel better, but only 'cos back then I thought it might actually work. God-The-Father up there in the sky listening to some kid rambling about whatever daft stuff he thought was a problem in his life...

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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13-08-2014, 05:22 PM (This post was last modified: 14-08-2014 03:50 PM by fluffycat.)
RE: Reasons for a Bible full of holes?
(13-08-2014 03:48 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(13-08-2014 03:32 PM)fluffycat Wrote:  Just a short survey question? I am wondering how many have prayed in their life?
I have, but unsure of what it meant.

Pray, v. To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf of a single petitioner, confessedly unworthy.
-- Ambrose Bierce

I've performed the ritual before Wink It made me temporarily feel better, but only 'cos back then I thought it might actually work. God-The-Father up there in the sky listening to some kid rambling about whatever daft stuff he thought was a problem in his life...

Thanks for relaying your experience. I feel in my own life I really only did 5 times earnestly pray. First time as an adult was in 1967 age of 19 in Daytona Beach, Fl.. I was down there to partake in chasing girls and drinking beer during Easter Migration. Kind of my last hurrah I thought, as I was enlisted in the Marines and was to be in boot camp in a few weeks.

Real troubling for me as Campus Crusade for Christ somehow got a hold of me and my best friend and we both did the sinners prayer thing (neither have talked about it since). Was real embarrassing and awkward for me as these people (the leader was linebacker for U of Alabama) happened to visit us again on the beach the next day and all I really wanted to do was party in final free days. Which we did.

Just felt real peculiar about the whole thing but I kiddingly thought maybe had a guardian angel interfere as I never saw actual combat in my 4 years during the Vietnam War. Trouble is that is not really what I wanted and I made some other actions not really wanting to talk about. One of the things which might have saved me from going to the brig was the support of my Gunnery Sergeant who was a devout Christian. This man was the most inspiring individual I have ever met. Marine in look and action but humble and kind.

I did a prayer when I had a big concern for the welfare of my son not too long ago and the other time was a prayer at the hospital with my sister when she was being taken off life support when she had respiratory failure in conjunction with chronic emphysema. She managed to stay alive but was put on hospice. Miraculously after hearing different doctors tell of how imminent her death would be she is still living on her own after 3 years. I attribute it to how tough she is but the prayer helped her a lot mentally.

The Nurse who came into her room the day they scheduled taking her off the breathing tube (not to be resuscitated) was an African American Lady. She called in another black woman who sang a hymn for my sister after which the two ladies, my sister, her daughter and myself prayed. As my sister stayed in Intensive care I happened to hear this Nurse talk at the IC station. She was in conversation about Discovery channel and someone asked her if she had any problem (science holes) with things like this and her beliefs. She said she believed in scientific discoveries including evolution but had a firm belief in God.

Anyway experiences such as these give pause to discount that there is not something else involved with the human element. Not sure what brings someone to pray myself included. The other 2 times I prayed was when I was young. My cat was accidentally killed in front of me by my sister and I wanted it reincarnated. The other time was for someone who rode our school bus and was burned in an explosion and later died.
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13-08-2014, 05:39 PM
RE: Reasons for a Bible full of holes?
(13-08-2014 03:37 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  [

It is a document of convenience, that is why it is full of holes. It is mythology that was designed to increase the power of the priest (The Levites) peeling back the facade and seeing how the books came to be reveals much more truth about the human condition than any fairy tale stories ever could. I recommend the Bible Unearthed, it is a book and a tv series. Here is part 1.




Thanks for the link. Looks like an interesting video will have to view all of later. The New Testament is different, No? No doubt the priests got some choice food with the offerings made to the temple. Today we have TBN preachers living in luxury from the contributions of followers who send in their gifts.
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13-08-2014, 06:09 PM
RE: Reasons for a Bible full of holes?
The bible was written to serve the needs of the political and religious elite of a fifth-rate nation which was continually getting its butt kicked. Figure them out and you'll have all the "truth" you need to know about it.

Atheism is NOT a Religion. It's A Personal Relationship With Reality!
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13-08-2014, 08:56 PM (This post was last modified: 14-08-2014 02:28 PM by fluffycat.)
RE: Reasons for a Bible full of holes?
(13-08-2014 06:09 PM)Minimalist Wrote:  The bible was written to serve the needs of the political and religious elite of a fifth-rate nation which was continually getting its butt kicked. Figure them out and you'll have all the "truth" you need to know about it.

Not quite in agreement with your summation. Don’t even some of the books in the Old Testament contradict this? That is some of the Prophets were challenging those in Power. Isn’t the New Testament almost completely opposite in how you assess the situation? For what purpose was it written? Surely not to serve any established elite Political group or Priesthood.
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13-08-2014, 09:14 PM
RE: Reasons for a Bible full of holes?
I am sure many have viewed this Video with Lewis Black. It explains perhaps one version of reasons the Old Testament might have been written. Also the disparity of the New against the Old.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGrlWOhtj3g
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13-08-2014, 11:54 PM
RE: Reasons for a Bible full of holes?
(13-08-2014 05:22 PM)fluffycat Wrote:  Anyway experiences such as these give pause to discount that there is not something else involved with the human element. Not sure what brings someone to pray myself included. The other 2 times I prayed was when I was young. My cat was accidentally killed in front of me by my sister and I wanted it reincarnated. The other time was for someone who rode our school bus and was burned in an explosion and later died.

... This one - you realise that if God could save them post explosion he could have done it pre-explosion too?

I recognize that you've had some pretty amazing experiences in your life. I don't think there's anything supernatural about it though. Stuff like your sister's survival - modern medicine while very good doesn't know everything there is to know about the human body. I'm not advocating for alternative medicine, just sometimes these kind medical miracles do happen - it's a miracle due more to our imperfect knowledge (in my ever so humble opinion) than to supernatural intervention.

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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14-08-2014, 10:35 AM
RE: Reasons for a Bible full of holes?
The Bible is full of holes largely because it was bits and pieces written by a variety of people and then combined. That, almost literally, creates holes.

And as for the prayer question, I have not prayed since becoming an atheist.
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