Reasons for creation
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27-11-2011, 08:27 PM
RE: Reasons for creation
More. Better. Different. It's all numbers to me. Numbers looking beyond themselves, a continual unfolding.

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27-11-2011, 08:41 PM
 
RE: Reasons for creation
(27-11-2011 08:08 PM)Kaos MD Wrote:  @Zatamon Hmm that does seem like it would be a logical discussion that an omnipotent being would have with itself. So the being was testing its limits by creating? That is very intriguing indeed and I haven't considered that thought.

Actually, god wanted to create something that even he couldn’t foresee and control. For a trillionth of a second he was tempted by the biblical version of creation but instantly rejected it as boring and predictable.

He wanted his creation to be his equal and a worthy mirror to look into, so he set the Big Bang into motion, to create a gigantic explosion, so complex that even he could not predict the outcome.

The really spooky part (for me) is the hint that it had happened before, maybe an infinite number of times, in Big Bang – Big Crunch cycles that gave his existence a meaning of birth, life, love and death that all living things need for meaning of existence.

In this sense god is as human as we are and we are reflections of each other, as the only interpretation of religion that makes any sense, at least symbolically.
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27-11-2011, 09:18 PM
RE: Reasons for creation
(27-11-2011 08:41 PM)Zatamon Wrote:  Actually, god wanted to create something that even he couldn’t foresee and control. For a trillionth of a second he was tempted by the biblical version of creation but instantly rejected it as boring and predictable.

He wanted his creation to be his equal and a worthy mirror to look into, so he set the Big Bang into motion, to create a gigantic explosion, so complex that even he could not predict the outcome.

The really spooky part (for me) is the hint that it had happened before, maybe an infinite number of times, in Big Bang – Big Crunch cycles that gave his existence a meaning of birth, life, love and death that all living things need for meaning of existence.

In this sense god is as human as we are and we are reflections of each other, as the only interpretation of religion that makes any sense, at least symbolically.

That is so deeply profound that it all seems to make sense. Perhaps that is why God works in "mysterious" ways and it becomes so difficult to interpret God. Could a god be omnipotent, but not omniscient? If so, it seems like that whole scenario is plausible in a manner that is mind blowingly elegant.
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27-11-2011, 09:31 PM
 
RE: Reasons for creation
(27-11-2011 09:18 PM)Kaos MD Wrote:  That is so deeply profound that it all seems to make sense. Perhaps that is why God works in "mysterious" ways and it becomes so difficult to interpret God. Could a god be omnipotent, but not omniscient? If so, it seems like that whole scenario is plausible in a manner that is mind blowingly elegant.

Kaos, before you take it too literally, conside the crucial word in my reply: "symbolically".

The story is mere poetry, suggesting how human-created the christian god is, only a symbol reflecting our relationship to the universe, our desire for meaning, our yearning for a mirror.

I have read it somewhere: "if triangles had a god, it would have 3 sides".
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27-11-2011, 09:36 PM
RE: Reasons for creation
You're probably right. I've been feeling a bit weird lately and got a little carried away Confused.
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28-11-2011, 12:49 AM
RE: Reasons for creation
(27-11-2011 09:18 PM)Kaos MD Wrote:  
(27-11-2011 08:41 PM)Zatamon Wrote:  Actually, god wanted to create something that even he couldn’t foresee and control. For a trillionth of a second he was tempted by the biblical version of creation but instantly rejected it as boring and predictable.

He wanted his creation to be his equal and a worthy mirror to look into, so he set the Big Bang into motion, to create a gigantic explosion, so complex that even he could not predict the outcome.

The really spooky part (for me) is the hint that it had happened before, maybe an infinite number of times, in Big Bang – Big Crunch cycles that gave his existence a meaning of birth, life, love and death that all living things need for meaning of existence.

In this sense god is as human as we are and we are reflections of each other, as the only interpretation of religion that makes any sense, at least symbolically.

That is so deeply profound that it all seems to make sense. Perhaps that is why God works in "mysterious" ways and it becomes so difficult to interpret God. Could a god be omnipotent, but not omniscient? If so, it seems like that whole scenario is plausible in a manner that is mind blowingly elegant.

If there were demi gods out there, pre big bang, playing around like mad scientists within the cosmos, to construct a game of sorts to satisfy unknown whims, we are back to the question of establishing their genesis.

If some gross experimentation was established beyond our cognitive abilities and with absolutely no moral criterion (just for fun) could it not transcend even physical death and hold future ramifications for the guinea pigs.?

As I do not look forward to more of the same, or worse, my preference is for eventual annihilation, at least until these possible demiurges got their acts together.
Even here , in terms of perpetual flux, can finite minds, collectively, envisage anything really worthwhile?
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28-11-2011, 01:47 AM
RE: Reasons for creation
(27-11-2011 01:24 PM)Kaos MD Wrote:  One concern I have for creationism is why did God bother making the universe and everything in it? If one is omnipotent, what is the point in creating something? The only response I have been given by christians is that he was bored or lonely. Can these feelings be attributed to an omnipotent God? It would seem to me that if one has already attained the highest position possible, that there would be nothing left to do and the being would cease to exist.

There's not much point (or fun) in being omnipotent if their is nothing to have power over.

How could a God be all-knowing if nothing exists? When I used to beleive in god I would think of it this way. In order for god to know who I am, I would have to have had experienced the life I have lead. I and everyone & eveything else would have to exist to be knowable.

i used to think of the universe as a book and god as the author, we are characters in the book, god knows everything in the book because he can read the whole thing, where as I can only know about the things on pages where I exist, and I exist in the book sequentially where as god could flip to any page in the book and even read it backwards if he wanted.
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28-11-2011, 07:33 AM (This post was last modified: 28-11-2011 08:05 AM by free2011.)
RE: Reasons for creation
(27-11-2011 01:40 PM)Spectre Wrote:  Why would he need pleasure from something that is created if he is omnipotent? We simply don't know. In fact, one has to question whether this particular verse was the product of divine revelation or if this was John's opinion on why the universe was created.

Shouldn't one then question the entire Bible as the opinions of many people on why things are the way they are.
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28-11-2011, 07:59 AM
RE: Reasons for creation
(27-11-2011 01:40 PM)Spectre Wrote:  In fact, one has to question whether this particular verse was the product of divine revelation or if this was John's opinion on why the universe was created.
Considering there are no gods, how could it be divine revelation?

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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28-11-2011, 08:47 AM
RE: Reasons for creation
The universe is big and old. We are young and small. We speculate - that`s all.
We`ll never understand genesis, and even if one of us guessed, he could not prove it. Speculating is fun: it makes good legends, movies, sacred texts and cosmological theories. But only a few people do all this speculating - for the far greater majority of conscious entities, none of this matters one iota: life goes on exactly the same.

It's not the mean god I have trouble with - it's the people who worship a mean god.
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