Religion and the workplace
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03-11-2011, 11:22 AM
RE: Religion and the workplace
(02-11-2011 07:52 AM)jimmygun Wrote:  
(01-11-2011 01:08 PM)Ghost Wrote:  Hey, Jimmy.

Why did they lodge the complaint in the first place?

Peace and Love and Empathy,

Matt

It was one person and he approached me to ask about my atheism. I told him my background and about my not believing in a god or any god. He asked about my wife's religion and I told him she was a very devout RC. He asked me, "Do you thinks she is right?" I said no, I think she is dead wrong, that she thinks I am dead wrong. He asked if I thought he (RC) was wrong too and I said yes, that is the nature of my atheism. Next thing I know I am up in HR explaining myself.

As far as suing for wrongful dismissal, here in Canada the Human Rights Tribunal (appointed, not elected) can do almost anything they want and their decisions are usually final. We do not have the protections you in the States have. Our "Bill of Rights" can be set aside for any reason. We do not have freedom of speech (hate speech is punishable by law, freedom of religion, public tax money supports the RC school system, and on and on. We have a majority government now (with less than 50% of the popular vote) that is virtually an dictatorship until the next election (unless of course they decide to forgo the next election).

As an American who's always admired Canada, I find this very disturbing. Is it really possible you could lose your job because someone asked you whether you thought certain religious beliefs were correct and you answered honestly?

Perhaps some of the other Canadians on the board could weigh in on this.

Religious disputes are like arguments in a madhouse over which inmate really is Napoleon.
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03-11-2011, 03:26 PM
RE: Religion and the workplace
I'm Canadian and I've never heard of such foolishness as this. Perhaps the boss is special too.

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03-11-2011, 04:28 PM
RE: Religion and the workplace
(01-11-2011 01:30 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  From my experience, it is best to keep religious views separate from workplace. If another is seen to violate this principle, it is either fisticuffs or fink. Yeah, those options suck, but "believing life is fair" is religious nonsense.


Unless you are in the majority.

I work in an office full of fundie Christians and even a few YEC. I hear things like "God willing", "God has his reasons", etc all the time. It gets pretty annoying. I haven't lashed out at anyone yet but on the right/wrong day I just might.

“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect.”

-Mark Twain
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03-11-2011, 07:54 PM (This post was last modified: 05-11-2011 05:13 AM by ghostexorcist.)
RE: Religion and the workplace
I worked at a Sam's club where one of my coworkers was very religious. He thought it was funny to "witness" to people all of the time. I would say most of my coworkers were either atheist or just wanted to keep their religious views to themselves. Well, he kept on bringing his bible in and witnessing to people on their breaks. Some complained, so he was warned by the management to stop. He then felt it was necessary to blast church music on his stereo while we were working. Once again, the management warned him to stop and to turn it down. He must have felt particularly invincible one evening because he turned the church music up extra high. They fired him on the spot. He had no recourse either since he had been warned numerous times.

The opposite happened at a different Sam's club where I worked. The guy who worked in receiving (the area where all of the store product is unloaded from the trucks) liked to listen to metal. He did so at a moderate level. There was a person there at the time who liked to listen to church music, but at a more than moderate level. When the guy in receiving turned his stereo up so he could hear it, the person complained to a manager, who told him to turn it down. But when he complained about how loud the church music was, the manager told him that "this is a Christian company," meaning that they were playing favorites. I've luckily never run into such discrimination during my time with the company.

I was once asked by a coworker if I was a "Christian man." When I told them that I was an atheist, they said: "You are one of the nicest atheists that I have ever met." I had a feeling that they probably had never known that many atheists to begin with.

My younger brother works for a meat packing plant founded by a Christian family. He is always telling me horror stories about the stuff that he was to put up with.
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03-11-2011, 10:43 PM
RE: Religion and the workplace
I work in a private equity firm run by a very strong Christian - sings in the choir, believes in Young Earth Creationism, all 11 yards. I've overheard him talking with people via the phone exclaiming emphatically (not arguing, stating with the assumption that the other party was in agreement) that we have no oil/energy problem, Evolution is silly (paraphrasing here) and how "blessed" we are thanks to God.

Yep. I know I'd be fired if I came out as Atheist... He's asked a few times where I go to church, etc and I had to just say I was "looking" still. Of course, I was then introduced to someone to help me find one, but I just BSed with them and didn't follow through with it. Still, wish I could be honest.

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03-11-2011, 11:11 PM
RE: Religion and the workplace
(03-11-2011 10:43 PM)Azaraith Wrote:  I work in a private equity firm run by a very strong Christian - sings in the choir, believes in Young Earth Creationism, all 11 yards. I've overheard him talking with people via the phone exclaiming emphatically (not arguing, stating with the assumption that the other party was in agreement) that we have no oil/energy problem, Evolution is silly (paraphrasing here) and how "blessed" we are thanks to God.

Yep. I know I'd be fired if I came out as Atheist... He's asked a few times where I go to church, etc and I had to just say I was "looking" still. Of course, I was then introduced to someone to help me find one, but I just BSed with them and didn't follow through with it. Still, wish I could be honest.

That's sad that it even matters. But you know they'd probably think you were dishonest if he knew you weren't a Christian also. I doubt anyone would ask me at my work place. If they did I feel like I'd be able to be honest. But I work in a medium-sized company that wouldn't easily be able to get away with discrimination like that.
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04-11-2011, 10:51 AM
RE: Religion and the workplace
(03-11-2011 10:43 PM)Azaraith Wrote:  Yep. I know I'd be fired if I came out as Atheist... He's asked a few times where I go to church, etc and I had to just say I was "looking" still. Of course, I was then introduced to someone to help me find one, but I just BSed with them and didn't follow through with it. Still, wish I could be honest.

This is kind of the same thing with gays in the military. The have to lie when asked about personal life for fear of punishment. Not anymore of course but I wonder if this example would help the anti gay crowd understand.

“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect.”

-Mark Twain
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05-11-2011, 03:26 AM (This post was last modified: 05-11-2011 03:43 AM by houseofcantor.)
RE: Religion and the workplace
(03-11-2011 04:28 PM)germanyt Wrote:  
(01-11-2011 01:30 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  From my experience, it is best to keep religious views separate from workplace. If another is seen to violate this principle, it is either fisticuffs or fink. Yeah, those options suck, but "believing life is fair" is religious nonsense.


Unless you are in the majority.

I work in an office full of fundie Christians and even a few YEC. I hear things like "God willing", "God has his reasons", etc all the time. It gets pretty annoying. I haven't lashed out at anyone yet but on the right/wrong day I just might.

Workplace ain't a democracy, it's a dictatorship. Big Grin

If you're an American like me, got my kinda work ethic; pop 'em in the nose - if they give you any lip, sue 'em. Big Grin

They do that shit because of tolerance. Tolerance only has real meaning in engineering - I don't like that word - but that's my problem. What I'm saying, is the boss allows it; or company policy, or some such legal mumbo-jumbo... ya might wanna check with the corporate mouthpiece before you become all atheist like cantor...

America ain't "law," America "we the people;" and people tend to let shit slide... it's a value call. One is not "wrong" for valuing corporate community over atheism, one is "wrong" when one's morality says this shit ain't right.

I can tell you what my morality said to the SSD eligibility specialist: Since Gwyneth Paltrow is married, the only purpose to life is killing creationists. (I have been told it is "almost impossible" to collect disability for insanity - these two lines sent a check 4 days earlier then the law allows - then I heard I'm running a racket - Jeez. Tongue)

'Cause it is that kinda shit, that I don't work a regular job. Of course I can work, I'm working right now; gotta be damn careful on this jobsite lest Gwyneth Paltrow attain godhood... Tongue

The government of the United States seems to agree. Gotta love America. Big Grin
(03-11-2011 10:43 PM)Azaraith Wrote:  I work in a private equity firm run by a very strong Christian - sings in the choir, believes in Young Earth Creationism, all 11 yards. I've overheard him talking with people via the phone exclaiming emphatically (not arguing, stating with the assumption that the other party was in agreement) that we have no oil/energy problem, Evolution is silly (paraphrasing here) and how "blessed" we are thanks to God.

Yep. I know I'd be fired if I came out as Atheist... He's asked a few times where I go to church, etc and I had to just say I was "looking" still. Of course, I was then introduced to someone to help me find one, but I just BSed with them and didn't follow through with it. Still, wish I could be honest.

Could I work there? NFW. Even YHWH don't perform that kinda miracle... Tongue

But I ain't you, and you ain't me. As identity, I'm ellenjanuary - I can do any-fucking-thing - but ellenjanuary is an artist. An "elite.;" these days anyway (artist used to be another kind of elite Big Grin). And I got that kind of experience; I wanna go somewhere, I put my shoes on. Most people find Identity in family, location, place, occupation - and most people are not wrong - only limited. Most people love limits, like a house, a bank account, friends, family... I love my Gwynnies, that is my limit.

Thing we can agree on? Live and learn. If it is your life, and you have learned to live with it; then it is correct. I'm an atheist. Cool

(If you wanna be a "culturally christian atheist," I can hook you up. a PM prolly best for that kind of deal Big Grin)

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05-11-2011, 07:48 AM
RE: Religion and the workplace
One of the professors at our local university was called on to the carpet to answer charges from some students. I forget what the exact charges were but he stood to lose his professorship if the charges were upheld. He showed up at the tribunal with his lawyer in tow and the tribunal told him he was not allowed to have representation at their hearing.

He fought it to the supreme court of Ontario I think and won the right to have his lawyer present. How star-chamber is that, that in their eyes, you are not even allowed to defend yourself?
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10-11-2011, 05:10 PM
RE: Religion and the workplace
religion do not belong in the workplace
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