Resistance to evolution
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26-10-2012, 03:23 PM (This post was last modified: 26-10-2012 03:29 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Resistance to evolution
(26-10-2012 08:38 AM)Chas Wrote:  One has to accept responsibility for creating purpose and meaning for a life that doesn't have an external meaning. This appears to be just too hard for most people; it creates fear.

You nihilist brother. All meaning is merely a local artifact. Big Grin

(26-10-2012 08:38 AM)Chas Wrote:  Edit: Am I just stating the obvious?

Yes, but it's worth restating. Thumbsup

I am us and we is me. ... bitches.
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26-10-2012, 03:53 PM
RE: Resistance to evolution
(26-10-2012 08:38 AM)Chas Wrote:  I don't think that the resistance to, and denial of, evolutionary theory is cognitive.

It appears to be primarily emotional.

Edit: Am I just stating the obvious?

I can't say.

I don't quite understand. I either don't understand what it is you are trying to say, as far as what you mean by denial being cognitive or (vs) emotional, or how those two things are separable.

The Paradox Of Fools And Wise Men:
“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser men so full of doubts.” ― Bertrand Russell
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26-10-2012, 07:26 PM
RE: Resistance to evolution
I like to use Homosexuality as an example of how evolution works.
No designer would design an animal to be homosexual if he wanted it to replicate.
Evolution is random chance followed by survival to pass on the genes.
Homosexuals will always exist in human society as heterosexuals will produce some percentage of homosexuals .
Mother Nature doesn't plan, she just throws out a range of possibilities.
What works, works. What does not does not.
So why don't homosexuals go extinct? Because sexual preference is random enough and homosexuality is closer to heterosexuality than most believe.
As most women are attracted to men, as men to women, naturally humans have crossover - women to women, men to men. It happens and will continue to happen as long as any human has a sex drive.

This is why the fundie will not admit homosexuals are born this way. The designer would never design such a person. Spoiler alert: There is no designer. Duh!

The old gods are dead, let's invent some new ones before something really bad happens.
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27-10-2012, 03:23 PM
RE: Resistance to evolution
(26-10-2012 03:53 PM)TrulyX Wrote:  
(26-10-2012 08:38 AM)Chas Wrote:  I don't think that the resistance to, and denial of, evolutionary theory is cognitive.

It appears to be primarily emotional.

Edit: Am I just stating the obvious?

I can't say.

I don't quite understand. I either don't understand what it is you are trying to say, as far as what you mean by denial being cognitive or (vs) emotional, or how those two things are separable.

If one looks at and understands the evidence for evolution, one sees that it is true - that evolution is a fact.

The only way to deny that evolution is true is by not looking at the evidence. Why not look at the evidence? Because, emotionally, one believes it can't be, mustn't be, true.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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27-10-2012, 05:39 PM
RE: Resistance to evolution
(27-10-2012 03:23 PM)Chas Wrote:  If one looks at and understands the evidence for evolution, one sees that it is true - that evolution is a fact.

The only way to deny that evolution is true is by not looking at the evidence. Why not look at the evidence? Because, emotionally, one believes it can't be, mustn't be, true.

Well, first of all, you can look at the evidence and then just deny the evidence.

I understood what you described here, but I wouldn't add in the 'emotional' and 'cognitive' parts. Some people just don't care to even consider the evidence, don't care to actually properly consider it, or look at all of the evidence and just continue to tell themselves it's all bullshit, regardless.

I wouldn't understand how it is that you would define 'emotion', in such a way, that it would apply to making a decision, in regards to the truth, about evolution, and even if you did that, I don't understand how you would then define 'cognition', along with 'emotion', in such a way, that those things would be separable.

I like to put it broadly. I like to say that people don't believe in evolution because they are fucking stupid.

The Paradox Of Fools And Wise Men:
“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser men so full of doubts.” ― Bertrand Russell
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27-10-2012, 06:17 PM
RE: Resistance to evolution
(27-10-2012 05:39 PM)TrulyX Wrote:  
(27-10-2012 03:23 PM)Chas Wrote:  If one looks at and understands the evidence for evolution, one sees that it is true - that evolution is a fact.

The only way to deny that evolution is true is by not looking at the evidence. Why not look at the evidence? Because, emotionally, one believes it can't be, mustn't be, true.

Well, first of all, you can look at the evidence and then just deny the evidence.

I understood what you described here, but I wouldn't add in the 'emotional' and 'cognitive' parts. Some people just don't care to even consider the evidence, don't care to actually properly consider it, or look at all of the evidence and just continue to tell themselves it's all bullshit, regardless.

I wouldn't understand how it is that you would define 'emotion', in such a way, that it would apply to making a decision, in regards to the truth, about evolution, and even if you did that, I don't understand how you would then define 'cognition', along with 'emotion', in such a way, that those things would be separable.

I like to put it broadly. I like to say that people don't believe in evolution because they are fucking stupid.

I don't understand with what you disagree or have an issue with.

My point is that I believe their emotional reaction to the very idea of evolution prevents the consideration of the evidence.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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27-10-2012, 06:38 PM
RE: Resistance to evolution
I agree.. but it works that way in many situations. I've seen studies and joke articles talking on the topic of how confrontation with facts, may result in a stronger emotional stance to the position argued.

I have one here that I saved on bookmarkies: http://youarenotsosmart.com/2011/06/10/t...#more-1218

"Love is hot, Truth is molten!"
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27-10-2012, 07:45 PM
RE: Resistance to evolution
The fundie thinks they are special. An exaulted entity seperate from nature and her ruler. Rather than her product.

Being born from nature, the impression of brutal, self serving, destruction, comes to their minds. They think animal behavior is some sort of murderous free for all.

If they knew anything about species and their behavior they'd understand nature is full of beautiful relationships between different species. Symbiotic relationships, compassion amongst troops of certain primates, silly mishaps of young species learning, etc.

Sure at times a lion ripping a zebra to shreds is hard to watch but the fact it feeds the pride is something they ignore. Even with their brutal eating habits they do not express the same violence amongst members of their pride.

To only look at this world as savage is to miss out on its beauty.

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The atheist is a man who destroys the imaginary things which afflict the human race, and so leads men back to nature, to experience and to reason.
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27-10-2012, 09:05 PM
RE: Resistance to evolution
I'm not going to go into much here, but I'll state my beliefs on evolution denialists right now.

Fuckers are arrogant; we are "self aware", we are "superior" to the other creatures, we were made specially. We tame creatures, we build weapons to kill them, we build shelters where the creatures cannot get to us. We are obviously better than them, right and what else could explain why we can do things that no other creature can do, we must be specially built and maintained, how else have we conquered the world which seems perfect for us to inhabit.

From interactions I have had, that is more or less what Evolution Denialists seem to hold, most of which maintained themselves to be theistic in belief. They seem to have held the belief that humans could not have come from the ranks of the dumber, inferior species that make up the animal kingdom, and use similar ideas to the one above to support their arrogant conclusion.

In their arrogance people want to feel special and Evolutionary ideas strip the self imposed importance and "meaning" away form them.

Whether you agree with me on my idea (arrogance) I have a question I like to ask people, that I'd like to ask here:
"Are humans special because we were given it? Or is it our job to make our selves special?" (The same question can be applied to birth rights)
It is, I feel, quite arrogant to assume that one deserves anything on merit of existence alone.

The people closely associated with the namesake of female canines are suffering from a nondescript form of lunacy.
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27-10-2012, 09:27 PM
RE: Resistance to evolution



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