Respecting The Truth
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01-01-2015, 06:22 AM
RE: Respecting The Truth
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01-01-2015, 07:27 AM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 01:16 AM)Gordon Wrote:  
(31-12-2014 06:50 PM)Free Wrote:  Probably not, since most theists I have met don't have the courage to question what they believe.

You atheist idiot. [Image: angry-smiley.gif]

If you could only see the way I am tearing into my prior beliefs about salvation--beliefs I've held and taken for granted all my life.

Substituting the finer details within a delusion is not the same as questioning what you believe.

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
America July 4 1776 - November 8 2016 RIP
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01-01-2015, 07:39 AM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(31-12-2014 07:33 PM)Shadow Fox Wrote:  While it is true that most atheists who read books aimed towards us, partake in conversations with humanists and communicate with other atheist communities share a far deeper respect for other humans than most theists do these days.

Catholic Charities (in the U.S.) is the second leading provider of social services to the needy after the federal government.

While we're here sitting on our fannies blowharding about the glories of atheism, millions of Catholics are quietly serving the least fortunate among us by donating their time and money.

Want to debunk the Catholics? Set up a competing charity system, and out spend them.

But of course we don't want to bother with all that, because after all, we're going to be so busy filling up the next few pages with snarky Catholic put downs!
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01-01-2015, 07:53 AM
RE: Respecting The Truth
My t-shirt design

"I prefer the truth and that's why I'm an Atheist"

The truth about the world we live in allows us to advance as a society. Lies just hold us back.

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
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01-01-2015, 08:09 AM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(31-12-2014 06:24 PM)Free Wrote:  Therefore, I dare any theist who reads this to try atheism for 1 month. You will act and express yourself as an atheist here and in real life, and let's see if you have enough respect for the truth to walk on this side of the fence to see if there's any truth here.

I've tried unbelief for several years, I don't see how or why I would try it again.

I do have an issue with the sort of atheism proposed by folks like Dawkins, and those who find kinship with him, that's one I wouldn't be able to try, because it all seems rather bizarre and weird to me. An atheism that merely rejects God because they see no reason to believe in him, that makes sense, but one that sees itself as offering something superior to religion, that has the potential to save humanity, and lead us to better waters, to me that's all bizarre. And in my view stems from atheists who have a hard time letting go of the evangelical spirit of the religions they have abandoned.

Quote:The reason I pity them is because it is obvious to me- and most here- that they are defending something that we- the educated- know to be a lie. I mean let's face it, we are atheists not so much because we hate religion, but rather because we respect the truth.

Here's something I find a bit strange too. Religions, like Christianity raise truth to the level of God himself, and holds beliefs that the truth will set you free, which for me would be rubbish, and just another myth, if I were a reflective non-believer.

Why should truth have such an esteemed status, where it seems to be placed over values such as happiness, or contentment? When I was an unbeliever I'd be hard pressed to pity people who believed in untruth, such as religion, merely because what they believed was untrue. If it made them happy, endowed their lives with a sense of meaning and community, a hope in this life, and for the next, why would I hold a dogmatic belief that truth is superior to the lie? Or that I have something better to offer them. The pursuit of a truth makes sense in a world with the lingering scent of divinity, in which it is intrinsically tied to goodness and liberation, to the good life itself. But in the absence of this, I don't see why many atheists seem to esteem the truth with the fervency of religious belief.
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01-01-2015, 08:17 AM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 07:53 AM)Rahn127 Wrote:  My t-shirt design

"I prefer the truth and that's why I'm an Atheist"

The truth about the world we live in allows us to advance as a society. Lies just hold us back.


This doesn't seem to be true, in the sense you seem to be implying it.

Even from the perspective of evolution, our minds are crafted to be attracted to lies and delusions, and cognitive biases, exactly because they pushed us forward, and benefitted our survival and flourishing.

Are you suggesting that while this may have done so in the past, they are not capable of doing so now, that only truth can push society forward?
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01-01-2015, 08:21 AM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 07:39 AM)Baba Bozo Wrote:  Catholic Charities (in the U.S.) is the second leading provider of social services to the needy after the federal government.
While we're here sitting on our fannies blowharding about the glories of atheism, millions of Catholics are quietly serving the least fortunate among us by donating their time and money.
Want to debunk the Catholics? Set up a competing charity system, and out spend them.

We have one. It's called the Federal Government Wink

Give me your argument in the form of a published paper, and then we can start to talk.
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01-01-2015, 08:38 AM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 08:21 AM)Hafnof Wrote:  We have one. It's called the Federal Government Wink

Also funded primarily by theists.
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01-01-2015, 08:47 AM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 07:39 AM)Baba Bozo Wrote:  
(31-12-2014 07:33 PM)Shadow Fox Wrote:  While it is true that most atheists who read books aimed towards us, partake in conversations with humanists and communicate with other atheist communities share a far deeper respect for other humans than most theists do these days.

Catholic Charities (in the U.S.) is the second leading provider of social services to the needy after the federal government.

While we're here sitting on our fannies blowharding about the glories of atheism, millions of Catholics are quietly serving the least fortunate among us by donating their time and money.

Want to debunk the Catholics? Set up a competing charity system, and out spend them.

But of course we don't want to bother with all that, because after all, we're going to be so busy filling up the next few pages with snarky Catholic put downs!

Let’s see if I can start 2015 on a positive note.
Deep breath.

Your accusation is much too general to begin with, there are, after all, secular charities http://www.weareatheism.com/resources/se...charities/ and there is no way you can know what any of us do with regards to helping the least fortunate among us or our contributions of time and money to any other charities for that matter.

It is true that Catholic Charities are in the forefront to help reduce poverty and help the poor http://catholiccharitiesusa.org/our-solu...e-poverty/, my own parents are very involved in the organization and I often commend them for this.
On the flip side the Catholic Church has done great harm with its stance against contraception and promotion of large families and has helped create much of the problems it then tries to alleviate. I would have far more respect for their charity works if they weren’t part of the problem to begin with.

I have noticed that atheist groups focus more along the lines of keeping the separation of church and State and this makes all the sense in the world. Not believing in gods is generally not a strong amalgamator. Bringing theists together might not be much different than herding cats. This, however, does not mean that we as a group or as individuals do not look after our fellow man.

My own out reach revolves around providing financial support in the form of rent subsidies to poor families, I do this through my company. I have discounted tens of thousands of dollars over the years to help struggling families keep a roof over their heads. I don’t have a website where you can contribute, I don’t have weekly meetings where we can gather and sing Kumbaya and I don’t require that any of them deconvert from Catholicism as most of these families are from Latin America and are staunch Catholics; unmarried couples and sometimes single mothers with three and four young children with no one to turn to.

Your post prompted me to “out” myself as a caring human being, foiled again!

What do you personally do for the needy if I may ask?

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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01-01-2015, 08:56 AM
RE: Respecting The Truth
A few decades ago I received help from Catholic Charities. That help was needed and appreciated.

I help where I can. It's in small ways, certainly, as I don't have the means to help in big ways. But having been on the receiving end of help from caring people I know firsthand how much of a difference even small things can make.

Helping our fellow human beings has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with realizing that sometimes a hand from another person is what is needed to set some things right.

I don't bash any charitable organization that actually helps but I don't like it when it's not really charity and the help comes with a price - such as claiming allegiance to said organization.

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF

We're all mad here. The Cheshire Cat
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