Respecting The Truth
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01-01-2015, 02:04 PM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 01:52 PM)666wannabe Wrote:  From my studies, I understand that it is possible to isolate a part of the mind and to dissociate it from the "normal" functioning of reason. Oftentimes, theists are not stupid in other parts of their lives. They generally function as well as one who has not reserved a portion of their minds for belief in fantasies.

Think about when you are watching a movie. It is possible to completely dissociate yourself (temporarily) from reality--to become so engrossed in the story, that it "becomes" reality. Of course, you keep one foot in the real world, but for the duration of that movie, it is the only reality. I believe this is what happens to believers in gods and spirits, etc. The only difference being, that it has become a "permanent" vacation for them instead of a temporary escape from reality.

It is “called suspension of disbelief” of all things Dodgy

For this exercise it should be labled “suspension of belief” Thumbsup

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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01-01-2015, 02:07 PM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 02:01 PM)Free Wrote:  The_Thinking_Theist

One wishes to believe such a title wasn't an ironic contradiction.

"I don't mind being wrong...it's a time I get to learn something new..."
Me.
N.B: I routinely make edits to posts to correct grammar or spelling, or to restate a point more clearly. I only notify edits if they materially change meaning.
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01-01-2015, 02:11 PM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 02:07 PM)gofish! Wrote:  
(01-01-2015 02:01 PM)Free Wrote:  The_Thinking_Theist

One wishes to believe such a title wasn't an ironic contradiction.

He spent quite some time here once and was reasonably pleasant. Then it transpired that he was having lots of socks. Kingschosen, the admin at the time, was against socksism, so the socksy TTT was permabanned.

Since then the little idiot comes back around once a month with a new sock. He's got some stupid idea that he's a "legendary troll" or some such shit.

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If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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01-01-2015, 02:56 PM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 02:01 PM)gofish! Wrote:  @666wannabe: I like your thinking on this, but still think it's more to do with simply having your frame of reference for life set early in life. You see this difficulty in letting go of old ideas in other areas.

For example my father believed in corporal punishment and I'm old enough to remember it at grammar school. And to be brutally honest, it took all my willpower and conscious effort to rid myself of the thought that it may too be right for my son.

Thank goodness I did though, and I see the proof of this wisdom everyday.

But it felt like an exorcism.

I think we are in significant agreement.

What we "are" is the product of two factors: Our biological make-up (nature) and our conditioning (nurture). We do not interpret present experiences in a vacuum, but according to both our existing nature and the holistic collection of our prior experiences in life (our conditioning).

A great book that deals with acculturation and societal change, is Future Shock by Alvin Toffler. Although this book was written in 1972, it remains incredibly insightful in describing what is going on in our culture, today. Primarily, when it comes to the question of the resistance to letting go of religion, it suggests that many people fear the loss of "security" in believing that some celestial force is "in charge" and that changing mores in our society is a result of rejecting this celestial force.

If we believe absurdities, we shall commit atrocities.--Voltaire.

"To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." --Thomas Paine.
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01-01-2015, 03:04 PM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 01:16 AM)Gordon Wrote:  Only those who believe in God need to seek the truth.

Entire civilizations have evolved knowing nothing about your god. Many of them were arguably more sophisticated than anything the feudal Europeans managed to cobble together until relatively recently. They had their truths and their philosophers.

By contrast, many believers in your god have spent a mind-bogglingly large amount of time suppressing the truth, as you have stated elsewhere. To take just one infamous example, how much virtuous truth did Cortez bring to the Aztecs?

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01-01-2015, 05:36 PM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 01:00 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  Now, on to the charity tangent: I am so tired of people giving props to the Catholic Church for its charitable efforts.

Probably because you don't want facts to get in the way of your ideology.

Quote:First, it gives the institution all of the credit when in fact it's the people who are doing the giving.

Well, in my case, I gave no credit to the institution. But we should, because that's who organized this massive charity operation.

Quote:Second, if the RCC were truly charitable it wouldn't have BILLIONS in the bank (billions that came from those same believers, not the church).

I totally agree. The church is far too rich to really call itself Christian, and I've said this a great many times on Catholic and Christian sites. All of Christianity spends WAY TOO MUCH on buildings and such.

Quote:I am a charitable person. I started a food drive that is nationwide. I think charity is a great thing, but if you have an ulterior motive then it's not charity and it certainly doesn't deserve any adulation.

Here you offer the standard fantasy pose that is the foundation of atheist forums. Religion is bad, Bad, BAD, and we are SO VERY SUPERIOR blah, blah, blah...

Most of you guys really have almost no interest in the phenomena you wish to reject. All most of you are really interested in is inflating your egos with the fantasy superiority pose, over and over and over again, day after day after day. It's just a huge ego circle jerk.

That whole attitude, the worst qualities of religion flying under a different flag.
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01-01-2015, 06:05 PM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 05:36 PM)Baba Bozo Wrote:  Most of you guys really have almost no interest in the phenomena you wish to reject. All most of you are really interested in is inflating your egos with the fantasy superiority pose, over and over and over again, day after day after day. It's just a huge ego circle jerk.

That whole attitude, the worst qualities of religion flying under a different flag.

Says yet another Muslim masquerading as a non theist.

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01-01-2015, 06:08 PM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 05:36 PM)Baba Bozo Wrote:  Probably because you don't want facts to get in the way of your ideology.

You mean the facts I listed that you conveniently left out, like the typical cherry-picking theist bozo you are? Catholic charity efforts more times than not require sermons or ideologies to be heard before a sandwich is ever offered. If helping people goes against its sacred Catechism you can forget about the Catholics extending a hand, like with a condom in it. Plus, as I stated, the RCC isn't being charitable, the people are. If there were no RCC, would these people cease to be generous and caring? If so, then you're all a bunch of hypocritical pieces of shit. The billions of dollars this institution has is far more than it could ever need, yet it asks for other countries to be more charitable. And in one breath your praise these scumbags and in the next you say they aren't Christian. Hmm, a theist who contradicts himself? Shocking.

And when I offered what I do for charity it wasn't for accolades or a feeling of superiority (how ironic this accusation coming from a Christian), it was a pre-emptive strike against people like you who might ask, "Well, what do you do to help?"

The rest of your tripe was fallacious at best so I won't even bother addressing the incoherent ramblings of what I can only assume is a lunatic.

Check out my now-defunct atheism blog. It's just a blog, no ads, no revenue, no gods.
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01-01-2015, 06:19 PM
RE: Respecting The Truth
(01-01-2015 06:08 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  You mean the facts I listed that you conveniently left out, like the typical cherry-picking theist bozo you are?

If you should ever get around to reading my posts which you are so very eager to reject, you'll learn I'm not a theist, not a Christian, not a Catholic.

I'm merely pointing out that it is very poor reason indeed to try to slap a simplistic good/bad label on anything that involves a billion people.

As you've seen, I'm not at all reluctant to point the finger of shame at the Catholic Church where I feel it's warranted. Let's hang all the child rapers, I'm all for that. Seriously, hang the fucks.

But I'm not interested in being a blind dogma chanting fundie of any flavor, theist or atheist.

Well, ok, ok, so I am a Fundamentalist Agnostic. I'm fundie against fundie-ism! Death to all fanatics!!!!
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01-01-2015, 06:29 PM
RE: Respecting The Truth
Sorry about calling you a theist, old habit; I should have just stuck with calling you a bozo. But don't put words in my mouth, either. I'm not simply slapping any good/bad label on anything. I said the RCC shouldn't get the credit for what a billion people are doing because it shouldn't. The individual efforts of the churches themselves do make up the RCC, but don't for a minute think the RCC on high is responsible for the entire charity effort. And remember these efforts are not without ulterior motives. ... like missionaries with chocolate bars who will give you the sweets but only after spewing their good news. And even if you take out the conversion motive, these people also are doing it for an afterlife reward, not for the sake of doing good things for people. So don't defend these scumbags just because their numbers are huge, which would be just another fallacy on your part.

Check out my now-defunct atheism blog. It's just a blog, no ads, no revenue, no gods.
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