Right & Wrong on a Desert Isle
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28-10-2013, 04:57 PM
RE: Right & Wrong on a Desert Isle
I thought I would wait until several responses were given before replying.

I think the person who mentioned "circular discussions/arguments" had it correct. Interestingly, nobody objected to it. To actually support that, I will pull out some significant keywords from other responses and make my comments...

"human customs" - who says it is bad to violate human customs or that we must keep them?

"Another "atheists have no morals" exercise? " - Sounds like this person actually doesn't like to be accused of having no morals. So, who in the first place says one must have morals?

"from reason", "good life" - Who says that we must heed reason? Who has defined what a "good" life is?

"The golden rule of course." - More than one responded with this, and I say to you, says who?

"...made against the rules because it isn't something you'd want someone to do to you" - Who says it is wrong to do to someone else what you don't want done to you?

"decent person" - Who defines what a decent person is?

"would you torture innocent infants if God ordered you to?" - the question implies there is something wrong with "torturing" infants, as well as suggest there is something wrong with doing it to "innocent" ones. Who says?

"all 'wrong' means is 'you should feel bad if you do X' " - Who says it is wrong to do something against your own feelings?
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28-10-2013, 05:12 PM
RE: Right & Wrong on a Desert Isle
Oh, u came back. Guess I was wrong.

Quote:"Another "atheists have no morals" exercise? " - Sounds like this person actually doesn't like to be accused of having no morals. So, who in the first place says one must have morals?

No, I really don't care about being accused that I don't have any morals, my comment was based on experience of many theist trying to prove some point by showing that atheists are immoral.


And to answer your question, Nobody says that one must have morals, humans just found it useful to determine some rules that they felt benefit the society in whole.

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28-10-2013, 05:24 PM
Right & Wrong on a Desert Isle
(28-10-2013 04:57 PM)Dearthair Wrote:  "would you torture innocent infants if God ordered you to?" - the question implies there is something wrong with "torturing" infants, as well as suggest there is something wrong with doing it to "innocent" ones. Who says?
I answered your question. It is your turn to answer my question, or are you afraid?
If the word "innocent" is confusing, take it out.
Would you torture infants if God ordered you to?
A simple yes or no will suffice.
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28-10-2013, 05:42 PM
RE: Right & Wrong on a Desert Isle
(27-10-2013 01:59 PM)Dearthair Wrote:  I am a thinking theist, and I was wondering if y'all think there is any right & wrong on an island not owned by any country, and no man-made laws yet applying to it.

Examples, and why?

You'd have to ask the trees Dodgy
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28-10-2013, 06:10 PM
RE: Right & Wrong on a Desert Isle
Morality and empathy evolved in the Great Apes, because it promoted life and survival in groups, (as anyone who took Anthropology 101 knows). Humans are not the only apes who have moral systems, nor even the only mammals that have moral systems.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_of_morality
Morality does not come from the gods. All religious laws are imported from culture into religions. There is no "absolute" moral law. Even Christians say it's ok to take life, under certain conditions. This moral argument is as old as he hills, and has been debunked countless times. The gods are not the origins of morality, and morality is no argument for the existence of a deity.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euthyphro_dilemma
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/nature/bonobo-all-us.html
http://www.livescience.com/24800-animals...ality.html



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Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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28-10-2013, 07:59 PM
RE: Right & Wrong on a Desert Isle
(28-10-2013 04:57 PM)Dearthair Wrote:  I thought I would wait until several responses were given before replying.

I think the person who mentioned "circular discussions/arguments" had it correct. Interestingly, nobody objected to it. To actually support that, I will pull out some significant keywords from other responses and make my comments...

"human customs" - who says it is bad to violate human customs or that we must keep them?

"Another "atheists have no morals" exercise? " - Sounds like this person actually doesn't like to be accused of having no morals. So, who in the first place says one must have morals?

"from reason", "good life" - Who says that we must heed reason? Who has defined what a "good" life is?

"The golden rule of course." - More than one responded with this, and I say to you, says who?

"...made against the rules because it isn't something you'd want someone to do to you" - Who says it is wrong to do to someone else what you don't want done to you?

"decent person" - Who defines what a decent person is?

"would you torture innocent infants if God ordered you to?" - the question implies there is something wrong with "torturing" infants, as well as suggest there is something wrong with doing it to "innocent" ones. Who says?

"all 'wrong' means is 'you should feel bad if you do X' " - Who says it is wrong to do something against your own feelings?

What are you, a fucking owl? Dodgy

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28-10-2013, 08:22 PM
RE: Right & Wrong on a Desert Isle
(27-10-2013 01:59 PM)Dearthair Wrote:  I am a thinking theist, and I was wondering if y'all think there is any right & wrong on an island not owned by any country, and no man-made laws yet applying to it.

Examples, and why?

Right and wrong?? I think morals are silly, probably invented by theists. As an atheist I don't believe in morals. The only reason I don't eat babies is because it is illegal. I am saving up money to buy a baby and travel to a remote island for a delicious meal asap.
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28-10-2013, 08:27 PM
RE: Right & Wrong on a Desert Isle
Ditto Bucky..

Theism is to believe what other people claim, Atheism is to ask "why should I".
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28-10-2013, 08:30 PM
RE: Right & Wrong on a Desert Isle
(28-10-2013 08:26 AM)lucradis Wrote:  
(28-10-2013 05:43 AM)Cathym112 Wrote:  Lucradis - your picture of pennywise scares the crap outta me!!!! *shudder* I hate that goddamn clown!

The clown has always been and will always be. The clown was before time and the cause of time. Do not fear the clown for we all float down here.

Seriously?? -_-
I have to walk upstairs to bed alone in the dark. I hate clowns. Especially penniwise ugh
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28-10-2013, 08:33 PM
RE: Right & Wrong on a Desert Isle
(28-10-2013 04:57 PM)Dearthair Wrote:  I thought I would wait until several responses were given before replying.

I think the person who mentioned "circular discussions/arguments" had it correct. Interestingly, nobody objected to it. To actually support that, I will pull out some significant keywords from other responses and make my comments...

"human customs" - who says it is bad to violate human customs or that we must keep them?

"Another "atheists have no morals" exercise? " - Sounds like this person actually doesn't like to be accused of having no morals. So, who in the first place says one must have morals?

"from reason", "good life" - Who says that we must heed reason? Who has defined what a "good" life is?

"The golden rule of course." - More than one responded with this, and I say to you, says who?

"...made against the rules because it isn't something you'd want someone to do to you" - Who says it is wrong to do to someone else what you don't want done to you?

"decent person" - Who defines what a decent person is?

"would you torture innocent infants if God ordered you to?" - the question implies there is something wrong with "torturing" infants, as well as suggest there is something wrong with doing it to "innocent" ones. Who says?

"all 'wrong' means is 'you should feel bad if you do X' " - Who says it is wrong to do something against your own feelings?

So, you only point out what you see are flaws in answers to a question you posed? How about you tell us what your answer is for comparison. Or just go ahead and tell us what answer you want us to give.

Or are you just going to fling more shit and hope something sticks?

I'm not anti-social. I'm pro-solitude. Sleepy
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