Ron Wyatt Finds The Blood Of Christ,Won't Produce It
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11-10-2013, 11:12 AM
RE: Ron Wyatt Finds The Blood Of Christ,Won't Produce It
(10-10-2013 06:59 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(10-10-2013 02:32 PM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  You've succeeded only in dehumanizing humans, and in negating the creative, redemptive, exploratative, philosophical and (but of course Monsieur!) religious and spiritual aspects of man.

Note how you trimmed my communicate and perform Shakespeare to "communicate". Ants communicate. Bees communicate.

Certainly man finds himself special unless he's an apatheist, after all, you claim he invented a god concept where no god existed. Give him points for creativity--or negative points for being delusional--but there are points there--unless you'd like to admit the biblical worldview into play. Thanks!

Nope Poohbah. Humans are humans without the fake "special" status. It's actually you who dehumanize them by requiring them to be something they are not, and saying they are in need of "salvation". When can we expect the fishy pamphlet ?

You say we are not in need of individual or corporate salvation? I remind you that we have nuclear capability to end all life, not just human life, on Earth. You're being blindly optimistic. Not to mention omitting the actual human suffering we've been discussing in other threads...
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11-10-2013, 11:24 AM
RE: Ron Wyatt Finds The Blood Of Christ,Won't Produce It
(11-10-2013 11:12 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  
(10-10-2013 06:59 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Nope Poohbah. Humans are humans without the fake "special" status. It's actually you who dehumanize them by requiring them to be something they are not, and saying they are in need of "salvation". When can we expect the fishy pamphlet ?

You say we are not in need of individual or corporate salvation? I remind you that we have nuclear capability to end all life, not just human life, on Earth. You're being blindly optimistic. Not to mention omitting the actual human suffering we've been discussing in other threads...

My sister is a high school principal, but she teaches 1 class ... logic for high school sophomores. Thanks for the examples of non sequiturs to forward for the class.

So then, you admit, Dune Poohbah, in the absence of "salvation", (a non-Hebrew, thus non Christian concept), you actually have no explanation for suffering.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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11-10-2013, 02:51 PM
RE: Ron Wyatt Finds The Blood Of Christ,Won't Produce It
(11-10-2013 11:24 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(11-10-2013 11:12 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  You say we are not in need of individual or corporate salvation? I remind you that we have nuclear capability to end all life, not just human life, on Earth. You're being blindly optimistic. Not to mention omitting the actual human suffering we've been discussing in other threads...

My sister is a high school principal, but she teaches 1 class ... logic for high school sophomores. Thanks for the examples of non sequiturs to forward for the class.

So then, you admit, Dune Poohbah, in the absence of "salvation", (a non-Hebrew, thus non Christian concept), you actually have no explanation for suffering.

Is your sister a dyed-in-the-wool atheist who revels also in mocking people loved by god? Is that why you'd use me as a class example (and I have a lot of class!)?

Nice way to duck my comments about the proliferation of nuclear armaments and man's evolution to mutually assured destruction.

Are you sure the Hebrew concept of salvation is absent?

Zechariah 9: Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion!
Shout in triumph, O daughter of Jerusalem!
Behold, your king is coming to you;
He is just and endowed with salvation,
Humble, and mounted on a donkey,
Even on a colt, the foal of a donkey.

I wonder who that is, riding on a colt to Jerusalem and bearing justice and salvation?

Genesis 49: "[Jacob prays] For Your salvation I wait, O Lord."

Who could that be? Let's look at Gen 49 some more:

The scepter shall not depart from Judah,
Nor the ruler’s staff from between his feet,
Until Shiloh comes,
And to him shall be the obedience of the peoples.
11 “He ties his foal to the vine,
And his donkey’s colt to the choice vine;
He washes his garments in wine,
And his robes in the blood of grapes.
12 “His eyes are dull from wine,
And his teeth white from milk.


Let me know if you need me to copy the other 107 HB verses that use the word SALVATION in them... and remind our mainline scholar friends... they may have some kind of bias in this doctrine.
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11-10-2013, 04:54 PM (This post was last modified: 11-10-2013 05:00 PM by excubitor.)
RE: Ron Wyatt Finds The Blood Of Christ,Won't Produce It
(11-10-2013 06:42 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(11-10-2013 05:04 AM)excubitor Wrote:  The Coriolis effect affects the bullet identically whether it be made apparent by the rotation of the earth, or whether it is a real force from the rotation of the universe acting upon the motion of the bullet.
That is about the best understanding I can come to it with the time I have available to make the study.
However the quote here from a real live physicist on the subject might help to clarify and legitimise what I have stated.
http://www.ifi.unicamp.br/~assis/


“As we have seen, Leibniz and Mach emphasized that the Ptolemaic geocentric system and the Copernican heliocentric system are equally valid and correct….the Copernican world view, which is usually seen as being proved to be true by Galileo and Newton….the gravitational attraction between the sun and the planets, the earth and other planets do not fall into the sun because they have an acceleration relative to the fixed stars. The distant matter in the universe exerts a force on accelerated planets, keeping them in their annual orbits…In the Ptolemaic system, the earth is considered to be at rest and without rotation in the center of the universe, while the sun, other planets and fixed stars rotate around the earth. In relational mechanics this rotation of distant matter yields the force such that the equation of motion takes the form of equation (8.47). Now the gravitational attraction of the sun is balanced by a real gravitational centrifugal force due to the annual rotation of distant masses around the earth (with a component having a period of one year). In this way the earth can remain at rest and at an essentially constant distance from the sun. The diurnal rotation of distant masses around the earth (with a period of one day) yields a real gravitational centrifugal force flattening the earth at the poles. Foucault’s pendulum is explained by a real Coriolis force acting on moving masses over the earth’s ωUe, where vme is the velocity of the test body´surface in the form –2mgvme relative to the earth and ωUe is the angular rotation of the distant masses around the earth. The effect of this force will be to keep the plane of oscillation of the pendulum rotating together with the fixed stars” (Andre K. T. Assis, Relational Mechanics, pp. 190-191.)

Here are some more quotes from influential scientists.
“The struggle, so violent in the early days of science, between the views of Ptolemy and Copernicus would then be quite meaningless. Either CS [coordinate system] could be used with equal justification. The two sentences: “the sun is at rest and the Earth moves,” or “the sun moves and the Earth is at rest,” would simply mean two different conventions concerning two different CS.” (Albert Einstein, The Evolution of Physics: From Early Concepts to Relativity and Quanta, Albert Einstein and Leopold Infeld, 1938, 1966, p. 212).

“By means of a concrete example it has been shown that in an Einsteinian gravitational field, caused by distant rotating masses, forces appear which are analogous to the centrifugal and Coriolis forces.” (Hans Thirring, “Über die Wirkung rotierender ferner Massen in der Einsteinschen Gravitationstheorie,” Physikalische Zeitschrift 19, 33, 1918).

You seem not to understand the difference between a model and reality.

You see, we've actually been in space and witnessed the reality that the planets orbit the sun and that moons orbit planets. You have to deny the physical evidence to cling to geocentrism.

I hope you don't teach, vote, or reproduce. Please abstain from those activities.

This post indicates the typical and stupendous ignorance of the majority of people about the geocentrism. In coming to understand and learn about geocentrism and how the system works I have also learned a huge amount about conventional astronomy and cosmology. Far more than the average man in the street and far more than the people here on this forum.

Actually going into space tells you absolutely nothing about absolute motion of any object. According to modern science there is no absolute position in the universe because everything is moving. Therefore the only measure which makes sense is the relative positions between objects in space. To be absolutely certain that there is or is not a static unmoving object in the universe that could reference an absolute position is to be outside the moving reference frame of the universe. The only person who is outside the universe is God who made the universe and he says in the scriptures that the earth is not moving. If the earth is not moving then every object in the universe can be given an absolute geocentric position.

In the geocentric system of Tycho Brahe the moon orbits the earth once per month, the sun orbits the earth once per year, the planets orbit the sun, the moons orbit the planets. The relative positions of these objects is identical in both system. This was evident from the very beginning on the account of the fact that Keplar used all of the measurements of his master Tycho Brahe to derive his laws of planetary motion.

To illustrate, I can reframe your comment against you as follows:
You see, we've actually live here on earth and witness the reality that the planets orbit the sun and that moons orbit planets and that the sun follows a course through the sky as it orbits the earth every year, and that we see all of the heavens revolve around us daily. You have to deny the physical evidence given to billions of years over thousands of years of recorded human history to reject geocentrism.

And why? Because some relatively few astronauts have been able at great expense and risk to view the earth from a different perspective?

Watch this video and witness the physical evidence of the universe rotating about us.
God gives this witness to billions of the simple through all the ages, not to the educated and privileged few in the last few decades.
http://vimeo.com/22439234

Watch this video and tell me again there is no God if you are able.
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11-10-2013, 05:16 PM
RE: Ron Wyatt Finds The Blood Of Christ,Won't Produce It
(11-10-2013 04:54 PM)excubitor Wrote:  
(11-10-2013 06:42 AM)Chas Wrote:  You seem not to understand the difference between a model and reality.

You see, we've actually been in space and witnessed the reality that the planets orbit the sun and that moons orbit planets. You have to deny the physical evidence to cling to geocentrism.

I hope you don't teach, vote, or reproduce. Please abstain from those activities.

This post indicates the typical and stupendous ignorance of the majority of people about the geocentrism. In coming to understand and learn about geocentrism and how the system works I have also learned a huge amount about conventional astronomy and cosmology. Far more than the average man in the street and far more than the people here on this forum.

Actually going into space tells you absolutely nothing about absolute motion of any object. According to modern science there is no absolute position in the universe because everything is moving. Therefore the only measure which makes sense is the relative positions between objects in space. To be absolutely certain that there is or is not a static unmoving object in the universe that could reference an absolute position is to be outside the moving reference frame of the universe. The only person who is outside the universe is God who made the universe and he says in the scriptures that the earth is not moving. If the earth is not moving then every object in the universe can be given an absolute geocentric position.

In the geocentric system of Tycho Brahe the moon orbits the earth once per month, the sun orbits the earth once per year, the planets orbit the sun, the moons orbit the planets. The relative positions of these objects is identical in both system. This was evident from the very beginning on the account of the fact that Keplar used all of the measurements of his master Tycho Brahe to derive his laws of planetary motion.

To illustrate, I can reframe your comment against you as follows:
You see, we've actually live here on earth and witness the reality that the planets orbit the sun and that moons orbit planets and that the sun follows a course through the sky as it orbits the earth every year, and that we see all of the heavens revolve around us daily. You have to deny the physical evidence given to billions of years over thousands of years of recorded human history to reject geocentrism.

And why? Because some relatively few astronauts have been able at great expense and risk to view the earth from a different perspective?

Watch this video and witness the physical evidence of the universe rotating about us.
God gives this witness to billions of the simple through all the ages, not to the educated and privileged few in the last few decades.
http://vimeo.com/22439234

Watch this video and tell me again there is no God if you are able.

Parallax, you forgot parallax.

Measured stellar parallax disproves geocentrism.

You are simply ignorant and delusional.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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11-10-2013, 05:39 PM
RE: Ron Wyatt Finds The Blood Of Christ,Won't Produce It
(11-10-2013 04:54 PM)excubitor Wrote:  
(11-10-2013 06:42 AM)Chas Wrote:  You seem not to understand the difference between a model and reality.

You see, we've actually been in space and witnessed the reality that the planets orbit the sun and that moons orbit planets. You have to deny the physical evidence to cling to geocentrism.

I hope you don't teach, vote, or reproduce. Please abstain from those activities.

This post indicates the typical and stupendous ignorance of the majority of people about the geocentrism. In coming to understand and learn about geocentrism and how the system works I have also learned a huge amount about conventional astronomy and cosmology. Far more than the average man in the street and far more than the people here on this forum.

Actually going into space tells you absolutely nothing about absolute motion of any object. According to modern science there is no absolute position in the universe because everything is moving. Therefore the only measure which makes sense is the relative positions between objects in space. To be absolutely certain that there is or is not a static unmoving object in the universe that could reference an absolute position is to be outside the moving reference frame of the universe. The only person who is outside the universe is God who made the universe and he says in the scriptures that the earth is not moving. If the earth is not moving then every object in the universe can be given an absolute geocentric position.

In the geocentric system of Tycho Brahe the moon orbits the earth once per month, the sun orbits the earth once per year, the planets orbit the sun, the moons orbit the planets. The relative positions of these objects is identical in both system. This was evident from the very beginning on the account of the fact that Keplar used all of the measurements of his master Tycho Brahe to derive his laws of planetary motion.

To illustrate, I can reframe your comment against you as follows:
You see, we've actually live here on earth and witness the reality that the planets orbit the sun and that moons orbit planets and that the sun follows a course through the sky as it orbits the earth every year, and that we see all of the heavens revolve around us daily. You have to deny the physical evidence given to billions of years over thousands of years of recorded human history to reject geocentrism.

And why? Because some relatively few astronauts have been able at great expense and risk to view the earth from a different perspective?

Watch this video and witness the physical evidence of the universe rotating about us.
God gives this witness to billions of the simple through all the ages, not to the educated and privileged few in the last few decades.
http://vimeo.com/22439234

Watch this video and tell me again there is no God if you are able.

So... God knows how to shoot time-lapse video. Wow, I'm ready to convert right now. Drinking Beverage

With your geocentric beliefs, you must also, therefore, believe in Ptolamaic epicycles to explain retrograde. Exactly how does this align with any understanding of gravity?

If you're so certain of geocentrism, perhaps you should write a paper, get it peer-reviewed, and change the way astronomers and astrophysicists view the universe while grabbing a Nobel prize.

... Or just get laughed at.

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11-10-2013, 08:35 PM
RE: Ron Wyatt Finds The Blood Of Christ,Won't Produce It
(11-10-2013 04:54 PM)excubitor Wrote:  
(11-10-2013 06:42 AM)Chas Wrote:  You seem not to understand the difference between a model and reality.

You see, we've actually been in space and witnessed the reality that the planets orbit the sun and that moons orbit planets. You have to deny the physical evidence to cling to geocentrism.

I hope you don't teach, vote, or reproduce. Please abstain from those activities.

This post indicates the typical and stupendous ignorance of the majority of people about the geocentrism. In coming to understand and learn about geocentrism and how the system works I have also learned a huge amount about conventional astronomy and cosmology. Far more than the average man in the street and far more than the people here on this forum.

Actually going into space tells you absolutely nothing about absolute motion of any object. According to modern science there is no absolute position in the universe because everything is moving. Therefore the only measure which makes sense is the relative positions between objects in space. To be absolutely certain that there is or is not a static unmoving object in the universe that could reference an absolute position is to be outside the moving reference frame of the universe. The only person who is outside the universe is God who made the universe and he says in the scriptures that the earth is not moving. If the earth is not moving then every object in the universe can be given an absolute geocentric position.

In the geocentric system of Tycho Brahe the moon orbits the earth once per month, the sun orbits the earth once per year, the planets orbit the sun, the moons orbit the planets. The relative positions of these objects is identical in both system. This was evident from the very beginning on the account of the fact that Keplar used all of the measurements of his master Tycho Brahe to derive his laws of planetary motion.

To illustrate, I can reframe your comment against you as follows:
You see, we've actually live here on earth and witness the reality that the planets orbit the sun and that moons orbit planets and that the sun follows a course through the sky as it orbits the earth every year, and that we see all of the heavens revolve around us daily. You have to deny the physical evidence given to billions of years over thousands of years of recorded human history to reject geocentrism.

And why? Because some relatively few astronauts have been able at great expense and risk to view the earth from a different perspective?

Watch this video and witness the physical evidence of the universe rotating about us.
God gives this witness to billions of the simple through all the ages, not to the educated and privileged few in the last few decades.
http://vimeo.com/22439234

Watch this video and tell me again there is no God if you are able.

Watched video. I'm able to tell you again, there is no god.

Shakespeare Insult 13 – Henry IV Part 1
“That trunk of humours, that bolting-hutch of beastliness, that swollen parcel of dropsies, that huge bombard of sack, that stuffed cloak-bag of guts, that reverend vice, that grey Iniquity, that father ruffian, that vanity in years?”
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11-10-2013, 08:51 PM
RE: Ron Wyatt Finds The Blood Of Christ,Won't Produce It
(11-10-2013 04:54 PM)excubitor Wrote:  Far more than the average man in the street and far more than the people here on this forum.

This is cuz he's "holier than thou".
It's "man ON the street". Men IN the street don't last too long.
But, feel free, excubitor, to play in the traffic.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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11-10-2013, 09:27 PM
RE: Ron Wyatt Finds The Blood Of Christ,Won't Produce It
(11-10-2013 05:39 PM)Jeffasaurus Wrote:  
(11-10-2013 04:54 PM)excubitor Wrote:  This post indicates the typical and stupendous ignorance of the majority of people about the geocentrism. In coming to understand and learn about geocentrism and how the system works I have also learned a huge amount about conventional astronomy and cosmology. Far more than the average man in the street and far more than the people here on this forum.

Actually going into space tells you absolutely nothing about absolute motion of any object. According to modern science there is no absolute position in the universe because everything is moving. Therefore the only measure which makes sense is the relative positions between objects in space. To be absolutely certain that there is or is not a static unmoving object in the universe that could reference an absolute position is to be outside the moving reference frame of the universe. The only person who is outside the universe is God who made the universe and he says in the scriptures that the earth is not moving. If the earth is not moving then every object in the universe can be given an absolute geocentric position.

In the geocentric system of Tycho Brahe the moon orbits the earth once per month, the sun orbits the earth once per year, the planets orbit the sun, the moons orbit the planets. The relative positions of these objects is identical in both system. This was evident from the very beginning on the account of the fact that Keplar used all of the measurements of his master Tycho Brahe to derive his laws of planetary motion.

To illustrate, I can reframe your comment against you as follows:
You see, we've actually live here on earth and witness the reality that the planets orbit the sun and that moons orbit planets and that the sun follows a course through the sky as it orbits the earth every year, and that we see all of the heavens revolve around us daily. You have to deny the physical evidence given to billions of years over thousands of years of recorded human history to reject geocentrism.

And why? Because some relatively few astronauts have been able at great expense and risk to view the earth from a different perspective?

Watch this video and witness the physical evidence of the universe rotating about us.
God gives this witness to billions of the simple through all the ages, not to the educated and privileged few in the last few decades.
http://vimeo.com/22439234

Watch this video and tell me again there is no God if you are able.

So... God knows how to shoot time-lapse video. Wow, I'm ready to convert right now. Drinking Beverage
Obviously I am not showcasing time-lapse video. I am showcasing the wonder and beauty of nature in particular the majesty of the universe and its diurnal rotating motion around the earth.

(11-10-2013 05:39 PM)Jeffasaurus Wrote:  With your geocentric beliefs, you must also, therefore, believe in Ptolamaic epicycles to explain retrograde. Exactly how does this align with any understanding of gravity?
Again another example of astonishing ignorance. Of course it is not your fault. It is the school system which has ridiculed the geocentric system of Ptolemy as they laud the simplicity of the copernican system.

The deception however is that the school system does not teach the Tyconian geocentric system. Tycho Brahe was the most brilliant astronomer but has been neglected because of the integrity and beauty of his geocentric system. The schools do not teach about Tycho Brahe lest impressionable students might be seduced into believing that his geocentric system is not just a model, but also a reality.

I explained this system to you in my previous post but I doubt you read it. Here is a model that I put together and recorded the video and its now on youtube.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SiUkn3U6rhI

A geocentric system can be constructed using all the modern theories of science which is exactly equivalent to modern cosmology. In this model the earth is the barycentre of the entire universe. So even though the earth is orbitting the sun from the perspective of the solar system in isolation, when you add in the orbitting motions of the rest of all the objects in the universe the solar system is also orbitting the barycentre of the universe which in the geocentric system is earth. That is the traditional teaching of great astronomers like Tycho Brahe.

This is the way we confront the objections of the naysayers. This from Sungenis.
"Some object that, although it may be true that the Earth can serve as the barycenter of the universe, we do not see any cases in the rest of the cosmos of a larger object revolving around a smaller object. This is true, of course. The reason we do not see any such phenomena is that there is only one place where it could be true – at the center of the universe."

This is affirmed by Isaac Newton who states in Isaac Newton, Philosophiae Naturalis Principia Mathematica, Book 3: The System of the World, Proposition X, Hypothesis I. "“That the center of the system of the world is immovable. This is acknowledged by all, although some contend that the Earth, others that the sun, is fixed in that center.”"

In this sense by "world" he means the universe.

Much of modern science disagrees with Newton and are terrified that the universe might have what is called the preferred centre of the universe. They even say that the universe is expanding and that there was a big bang, but even that centre where the big bang was is not the preferred centre. In modern cosmology everything drifts aimlessly. Why are they so terrified to admit that there is a preferred centre of the universe , because they are terrified that they might discover that this preferred centre of the universe IS THE EARTH.

As all other observations seem to indicate given the ever increasing number of observations that make up the Anthropic principle or fine tuning of the universe theory. So irrefutable is this body of evidence that clever men like Dawkins are forced beyond embarrassment to invent utterly ridiculous theories of multiverses to explain away that the whole of the universe is ordered toward mankind. They admit to the astonishing centrality of mankind in the anthropic principle for virtually every element of the universe except it would seem, the centrality of position of mankind in the universe.

(11-10-2013 05:39 PM)Jeffasaurus Wrote:  If you're so certain of geocentrism, perhaps you should write a paper, get it peer-reviewed, and change the way astronomers and astrophysicists view the universe while grabbing a Nobel prize.

... Or just get laughed at.
Why should I go down that path when somebody has already done it. Robert Sungenis answered this challenge and approached every university to allow him to do his Thesis on Geocentrism to have it peer reviewed. They all turned him down.

However he has a masters degree and he wrote a large volume called "Galileo was wrong" with Robert J. Bennett, Ph.D., who holds a doctorate in Physics from Stevens Institute of Technology and has written the mathematics and physics sections of the book.

So there is no need for me to do what finer men are already doing.
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11-10-2013, 09:43 PM (This post was last modified: 12-10-2013 01:05 AM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Ron Wyatt Finds The Blood Of Christ,Won't Produce It
Geocentrism is refuted by Relativity. There is no ONE frame of reference.
Please, someone, tell him to join at least the 20th Century.
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badast...ljEvhAQM1I

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Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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