Russia tells citizens to ‘prepare for nuclear war with West’
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12-10-2016, 08:40 PM
RE: Russia tells citizens to ‘prepare for nuclear war with West’
That's scary! I don't want to blow up! >.<
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12-10-2016, 08:59 PM
RE: Russia tells citizens to ‘prepare for nuclear war with West’
Well, nuclear war is definitely a possibility. It makes sense to prepare for it.
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12-10-2016, 09:25 PM
RE: Russia tells citizens to ‘prepare for nuclear war with West’
(12-10-2016 08:59 PM)Lucipurr Wrote:  Well, nuclear war is definitely a possibility. It makes sense to prepare for it.
By what? Wrapping yourself in tinfoil, kinda like what we sometimes do with chicken before putting it in the oven?
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12-10-2016, 09:27 PM
RE: Russia tells citizens to ‘prepare for nuclear war with West’
(12-10-2016 08:35 PM)SYZ Wrote:  And remember, you're effectively looking at housing the population of Los Angeles for maybe 12 weeks.
What do you mean 12 weeks? The scorched earth will be radioactive for 20,000 years or so.
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12-10-2016, 09:34 PM
RE: Russia tells citizens to ‘prepare for nuclear war with West’
(12-10-2016 05:16 AM)Popeyes Pappy Wrote:  
(11-10-2016 11:42 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  40 ft² per person sounds like a good recipe for social breakdown.

It's actually 5x the US government's recommended 8 ft² per person for a two week stay in a public emergency shelter.

It still won't end well. Tongue

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12-10-2016, 09:36 PM
RE: Russia tells citizens to ‘prepare for nuclear war with West’
(12-10-2016 09:27 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(12-10-2016 08:35 PM)SYZ Wrote:  And remember, you're effectively looking at housing the population of Los Angeles for maybe 12 weeks.
What do you mean 12 weeks? The scorched earth will be radioactive for 20,000 years or so.

Depends on the weapons used.












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12-10-2016, 09:40 PM
RE: Russia tells citizens to ‘prepare for nuclear war with West’
(12-10-2016 09:25 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(12-10-2016 08:59 PM)Lucipurr Wrote:  Well, nuclear war is definitely a possibility. It makes sense to prepare for it.
By what? Wrapping yourself in tinfoil, kinda like what we sometimes do with chicken before putting it in the oven?

Beats me.

I guess some lucky people are bound to survive.
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13-10-2016, 02:09 PM (This post was last modified: 13-10-2016 02:51 PM by Popeye's Pappy.)
RE: Russia tells citizens to ‘prepare for nuclear war with West’
(12-10-2016 08:35 PM)SYZ Wrote:  
(11-10-2016 06:33 PM)Popeyes Pappy Wrote:  Unless your talking about building all the shelters in Moscow (and that isn't the way I read the OP) then no it isn't impossible. Expensive but not impossible.

12,000,000 people
8,000 people per shelter
1,500 shelters
40 sq/ft per person
320,000 sq/ft per shelter
480,000,000 total sq/ft
$200.00 per sq/ft
$96,000,000,000.00 total cost

You're forgetting the supportive infrastructure. Power generation how? Sanitation? Drinking water? Refrigeration? Waste disposal? Air conditioning? Disposal of dead people? Surgery/dentistry/medication/childbirth, recreation facilities etc? And remember, you're effectively looking at housing the population of Los Angeles for maybe 12 weeks. Half of them will be stir crazy in a week!

Could never be done.

Actually I think I've got that all that covered in my initial cost estimate, but let's double the square footage and price per foot for facilities. The new total would be $384 billion or $256 million each for the 1500 facilities. Add another $120 billion for food/supplies. Rice, beans and potato flakes are cheap so that would last a lot longer than 12 weeks. Maybe a couple of years.You'd be looking at a little over $50 billion a year over 10 years. A government like Russia could make that happen if they wanted to.

Power generation?

(per facility)

In 2013 your average UK resident used about 5500 KW hours of electricity a year. Let's cut that in half for our emergency facility. You could cover that with 3x Cummings QSKK78-3500 diesel generators. 1950 KW continuous rating. $250K each for a total of $750K. You only need to run 2 of them at a time at 75% load to generate enough power for the facility. That should take about 825 liters per hour of fuel x 12 weeks call it 4.5 million gallons at $2 a gallon or $9 million total for fuel. Your going to need 90 12' diameter 60' long fuel storage cylinders at $100K each for another $9 million.

Total cost for power generation $18.75 million or a little less than 7.5% of the facilities budget. You've also only used about 12.5% of your floor space. If you really want to get fancy facilities could be built near natural gas fields and you could use natural gas from wells inside the facilities instead of diesel. That might not save much in cost but it would sure save a lot of floor space.

Water?

Wells.

Sanitation/Waste Disposal?

This one actually pretty easy. You'd need a limited capacity septic system for day to day operations, but if you actually needed to put the facility to it's intended use just dump everything into a large open holding pond. I doubt if anyone is going to be that worried about environment impact at that point. BTW, this solution includes bodies.

Medical/Recreational?

Yep, it would need some medical facilities but they don't have to be that advanced. Some of the people inside are probably going to die...

Yep, people would need something to do too, but it ain't going be what they are used to. People got along just fine before bowling alleys and Xboxes. People can live with playing cards, a few books and some exercise equipment. Since our hypothetical facilities have 10x the area the US government thinks a facility like this needs there will be room for it.

Stir crazy?

It's Russia for crying out loud. That's what armed security is for.

ETA: In the 1950's US civil defense authorities put together a plan for enough fallout shelters to house 50 million Americans. It never happened, but they thought it was doable. If we thought 50 million was possible 60 years ago why do you think Russia can't do 12 million now?

Edited again: I just realized I fucked up liters to gallons in a big way. It isn't 4.5 million gallons of diesel it's 450,000. So instead of $18 million for fuel and storage it's $1.8 million (less than 1% of the facilities budget) and 7500 square feet instead of 75,000 so a little over 1% of the floor space to store the fuel.

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13-10-2016, 04:38 PM (This post was last modified: 13-10-2016 04:41 PM by Deltabravo.)
RE: Russia tells citizens to ‘prepare for nuclear war with West’
In some ways a nuclear holocaust would be a very good thing. Apparently, only a few decades after people left Chernobyl, more intelligent species who don't construct nuclear devices took over and are now living there peacefully. http://www.livescience.com/52458-wildlif...aster.html

I tnink that if the total eradication of the human species only sets back the lives of these more advanced species by thirty years it may be a price the planet needs to pay.
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