SC Cop and the girl who recorded the video
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29-10-2015, 08:34 PM
RE: SC Cop and the girl who recorded the video
(29-10-2015 08:20 PM)skyking Wrote:  His job was to arrest her, not punish her. He was so far across the line with his actions.
How can you arrest someone without force if he/she resists?

English is my second language.
I AM DEPLORABLE AND IRREDEEMABLE
SHE PERSISTED WE RESISTED
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29-10-2015, 08:44 PM
RE: SC Cop and the girl who recorded the video
That's not force. You need to check your glasses. Anybody with training could have arrested her and had her in cuffs quickly and efficiently, no fuss no muss.
He deliberately slammed her down to inflict injury and pain. He knew what he was doing.
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29-10-2015, 08:45 PM
RE: SC Cop and the girl who recorded the video
(29-10-2015 08:34 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(29-10-2015 08:20 PM)skyking Wrote:  His job was to arrest her, not punish her. He was so far across the line with his actions.
How can you arrest someone without force if he/she resists?

If there is ever a reenactment I want you to play her part and then tell us it was ok, that's if your not in too much pain to use your computer.

"If you keep trying to better yourself that's enough for me. We don't decide which hand we are dealt in life, but we make the decision to play it or fold it" - Nishi Karano Kaze
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29-10-2015, 08:48 PM
RE: SC Cop and the girl who recorded the video
(29-10-2015 07:39 PM)Alla Wrote:  
Momsurroundedbyboys dateline'1446168387' Wrote:  =
This girl is a ward of the state. If her foster family mistreats her or abused her,
"If, if, if"
And what if her foster family does not mistreat or abuse her?
If you were that cop, what would you do if she was a destruction in class, you told her to leave room and she resisted?

She didn't destroy anything, she wasn't violent. I'm sure losing her parents becoming a ward of the state, having her whole life turned upside down, left her feeling just great.

I hope her foster family is good to her, but I know for every one that is, there are more than a few that are in it for a check and care less about the kids.

I already said how I would handle it.

I have dealt with this before. I'm the parent of a special needs kid so I know there are ways of dealing with kids without grabbing them and forcing them to comply.

I also, just in case you were wondering, did a very short stint in juvenile drug rehab, while I was in college -- as a counselor.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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29-10-2015, 10:20 PM
RE: SC Cop and the girl who recorded the video
When I worked in a detention centre, despite the fact that pretty much every inmate had me pegged as a psychopath myself, and despite the fact that I genuinely enjoy the opportunity to scrap when the need arises, I actually had a reputation for being very good at verbally diffusing difficult people. It doesn't exactly take a PhD. The only education I have on the subject is that every couple years I take a few hours to read some random book on the subject, whether it's an old self help classic like "How to Win Friends and Influence People" or a newer, more scientifically minded book on the workings of an angry mind, among other things, like "Thinking, Fast and Slow."

With even a rudimentary understanding of what's going on in the psyche of an uncooperative person, and how easy it usually is to bring them back to reality if you just sit back and view them as a puzzle in need of a solution and go about it rationally rather than just following your gut instinct to jump in and win the fight, I can't help but cringe when watching incidents like this.

Granted, that's not always possible if someone you are duty bound to confront is running, resisting, or presenting some type of perceived threat, in which case I almost always side with the police in the other various media shit storms that have happened over the past few years. But I just can't bring myself to side with him in this particular case based on what I've seen, which is admittedly only a small, one sided piece of the story as is always the case. I believe there were other choices and, though he didn't have the realistic option to simply walk away, given his responsibilities to those who called for his assistance (whether they ultimately should have or not), one thing he did have on his side was time. There was no dangerous crowd gathering. There was no hair dryer that might have been a weapon. There was no attempt to escape. If he actually had some half decent conversational skills, I believe he could have fixed this without the use of force or, at the very least, put on a good "nice cop" show for the camera.

And even if he did decide that it was ethical to escalate, it still wouldn't have been rational. The political context and your surroundings have to be considered just like any other factor. She's a minor, she's not visibly combative, and there were enough cameras on him to guarantee that whatever happened would be on YouTube in a matter of minutes, allowing for the probability of trial by media. Even if just to make a show for the cameras, other steps could have been taken.

Personally, so long as I had time on my side, my first step would have been to pull up a chair and start chatting about unrelated bullshit, tell a few stupid jokes, etc. Take the attention off the situation. Nobody is going to back down once they've taken a stand in front of their peers, so change the context to one in which you're not presenting yourself as someone who needs to be stood down from in order to move on. And if it did come to force, my first choice would have been to pull the whole damn desk out of the room with her in it. That way she's got two choices. Get up, or get pulled out of the room without me even initiating hands on. And if in that case she were to try and resist from the desk, it'd be much better for the cameras to see her putting hands on first.

Of course I don't know the whole, unbiased story. Nobody does. I will therefore abstain from making judgements regarding his firing and any potential charges, and simply say that it could have been handled better.

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30-10-2015, 12:38 AM
RE: SC Cop and the girl who recorded the video
(29-10-2015 10:20 PM)yakherder Wrote:  When I worked in a detention centre, despite the fact that pretty much every inmate had me pegged as a psychopath myself, and despite the fact that I genuinely enjoy the opportunity to scrap when the need arises, I actually had a reputation for being very good at verbally diffusing difficult people. It doesn't exactly take a PhD. The only education I have on the subject is that every couple years I take a few hours to read some random book on the subject, whether it's an old self help classic like "How to Win Friends and Influence People" or a newer, more scientifically minded book on the workings of an angry mind, among other things, like "Thinking, Fast and Slow."

With even a rudimentary understanding of what's going on in the psyche of an uncooperative person, and how easy it usually is to bring them back to reality if you just sit back and view them as a puzzle in need of a solution and go about it rationally rather than just following your gut instinct to jump in and win the fight, I can't help but cringe when watching incidents like this.

Granted, that's not always possible if someone you are duty bound to confront is running, resisting, or presenting some type of perceived threat, in which case I almost always side with the police in the other various media shit storms that have happened over the past few years. But I just can't bring myself to side with him in this particular case based on what I've seen, which is admittedly only a small, one sided piece of the story as is always the case. I believe there were other choices and, though he didn't have the realistic option to simply walk away, given his responsibilities to those who called for his assistance (whether they ultimately should have or not), one thing he did have on his side was time. There was no dangerous crowd gathering. There was no hair dryer that might have been a weapon. There was no attempt to escape. If he actually had some half decent conversational skills, I believe he could have fixed this without the use of force or, at the very least, put on a good "nice cop" show for the camera.

And even if he did decide that it was ethical to escalate, it still wouldn't have been rational. The political context and your surroundings have to be considered just like any other factor. She's a minor, she's not visibly combative, and there were enough cameras on him to guarantee that whatever happened would be on YouTube in a matter of minutes, allowing for the probability of trial by media. Even if just to make a show for the cameras, other steps could have been taken.

Personally, so long as I had time on my side, my first step would have been to pull up a chair and start chatting about unrelated bullshit, tell a few stupid jokes, etc. Take the attention off the situation. Nobody is going to back down once they've taken a stand in front of their peers, so change the context to one in which you're not presenting yourself as someone who needs to be stood down from in order to move on. And if it did come to force, my first choice would have been to pull the whole damn desk out of the room with her in it. That way she's got two choices. Get up, or get pulled out of the room without me even initiating hands on. And if in that case she were to try and resist from the desk, it'd be much better for the cameras to see her putting hands on first.

Of course I don't know the whole, unbiased story. Nobody does. I will therefore abstain from making judgements regarding his firing and any potential charges, and simply say that it could have been handled better.

I know we don't know all the facts. But even if she stood up and hit him first, he still lost control and used excessive force that's the part I can't get out of my head.

I've seen kids, high out their minds violently trying hit anything and weren't beaten down like that. In fact, the staff took more than a few punches, but never hit back. Because that's not how you deal with that. I also quickly learned I didn't want to be a drug counselor. And to be honest some violence is expected. But the staff knew that and we were all trained for it.

But this wasn't a rehab or even a jail, this was a school and she was a kid.

This girl was quiet and guilty of refusing to leave her seat. They really could have just as easily waited until class was over and dealt with her then. Usually in cases like this, the kid just wants to be heard and feel validated (by feeling validated doesn't mean she was correct but that her feelings were understood), then you discuss what went wrong and what they could have done differently.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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30-10-2015, 03:51 AM
RE: SC Cop and the girl who recorded the video
I am completely with mom. What that video shows is people who had to "win" the confrontation. It was completely unnecessary. And, not just the violence, but even calling that thug into the room. The school's version of what happened, which is always going to be the version most favorable to them, doesn't rise to the level of requiring that thug be called. He's not the only one who should have been fired in my opinion.

If you're a teacher or school administrator and you can't out wait a petulant 16 year old, you're in the wrong job.

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30-10-2015, 05:16 AM
SC Cop and the girl who recorded the video
The observation that there is more than one side to the story, doesn't mean that those sides are equal or that one side's story justifies those actions.

What we do know is what we see in that video. And what we see is a cop who went into a rage and threw a teenager to the ground for sitting in a chair. I don't give a flying fuck what his side of the story his, that wasn't warranted by any stretch of the imagination.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
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30-10-2015, 03:52 PM
RE: SC Cop and the girl who recorded the video
A child being disobedient in the classroom is not something you call the cops for.

Seriously. How is this hard? What would you have done? Easy: Not call the cops. This is not a police matter.

She did not turn her phone in? Fine. You get an F entered into your grade. Won't get up and leave when asked? Fine. You're suspended. Want to still be a bitch about it? Cool. Detention. Schools have been doing these things for years. There was no need whatsoever for a police response to this infraction.

The problem is not HOW the cop handled it. The problem is THAT a cop handled it. This was not a police matter.

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30-10-2015, 04:40 PM
RE: SC Cop and the girl who recorded the video
(30-10-2015 03:52 PM)TwoCultSurvivor Wrote:  A child being disobedient in the classroom is not something you call the cops for.

Seriously. How is this hard? What would you have done? Easy: Not call the cops. This is not a police matter.

She did not turn her phone in? Fine. You get an F entered into your grade. Won't get up and leave when asked? Fine. You're suspended. Want to still be a bitch about it? Cool. Detention. Schools have been doing these things for years. There was no need whatsoever for a police response to this infraction.

The problem is not HOW the cop handled it. The problem is THAT a cop handled it. This was not a police matter.

No one called "the cops", he was a school cop. Just saying.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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