Saint or Monster?
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10-07-2015, 06:07 AM
Rainbow RE: Saint or Monster?
(10-07-2015 01:06 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  Hi.

How man can spend his life in worship you ask. Indoctrination would be the answer. Also how many people really believe and what number of them only say it or use their belief to persecute others?

Hi Szuchow, thank you for responding. Truth is relative, the more people believe it, the more relevant it is. Therefore it is only the appearance of truth that depend on the numbers. You can justify the truth of almost anything, even the Resurrection, if you have the numbers to back you up.
If the scientific and intellectual community could make up over 3/4 of the population, religion would cease to exist in that population.

Sometimes I feel that self-awareness has become a curse and not an asset. With self-awareness, we are now very much aware of our weaknesses as well as our strengths. We need to let go of our primitive need to create deities, to overcompensate for our fear of death. Thanks for listening. Shell Heart
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10-07-2015, 06:18 AM
RE: Saint or Monster?
(10-07-2015 06:07 AM)ShellShilo Wrote:  Hi Szuchow, thank you for responding. Truth is relative, the more people believe it, the more relevant it is. Therefore it is only the appearance of truth that depend on the numbers. You can justify the truth of almost anything, even the Resurrection, if you have the numbers to back you up.
If the scientific and intellectual community could make up over 3/4 of the population, religion would cease to exist in that population.

I don't think that truth is relative - it's not matter of number of people believing something to be true. Number don't give even apperance of the truth, they only tell how many people believe in something. Apperance though it's important, but lets not mix it with truth.

(10-07-2015 06:07 AM)ShellShilo Wrote:  Sometimes I feel that self-awareness has become a curse and not an asset. With self-awareness, we are now very much aware of our weaknesses as well as our strengths. We need to let go of our primitive need to create deities, to overcompensate for our fear of death. Thanks for listening. Shell Heart

We need? I don't know how things look like with you but I do not create or believe in deities nor I fear death. As Epicurus said: Death, therefore, the most awful of evils, is nothing to us, seeing that, when we are, death is not come, and, when death is come, we are not.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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10-07-2015, 06:22 AM
RE: Saint or Monster?
Welcome
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10-07-2015, 06:24 AM
Rainbow RE: Saint or Monster?
(10-07-2015 04:03 AM)Banjo Wrote:  
(10-07-2015 03:58 AM)ShellShilo Wrote:  Thank you Banjo for taking the time to respond. I will always respond back. I'm still trying to get use to the forum, but I'll get there. Thanks again! Shell

My pleasure.

In time you will get the hang of it here. Mistakes are nothing more than mistakes. Such as making a double post or thread. Not a huge deal.

Feel comfortable. We (and I suspect I speak for most) are always interested in getting to know sincere people.

Enjoy your time here. Smile

Thank you Banjo, not sure what a thread is or what a double post mean, but thank you for your kind words and your patience. I also am interested in conversing with sincere and honest people. Thanks again Shell. Heart
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10-07-2015, 06:27 AM
RE: Saint or Monster?
(10-07-2015 06:24 AM)ShellShilo Wrote:  
(10-07-2015 04:03 AM)Banjo Wrote:  My pleasure.

In time you will get the hang of it here. Mistakes are nothing more than mistakes. Such as making a double post or thread. Not a huge deal.

Feel comfortable. We (and I suspect I speak for most) are always interested in getting to know sincere people.

Enjoy your time here. Smile

Thank you Banjo, not sure what a thread is or what a double post mean, but thank you for your kind words and your patience. I also am interested in conversing with sincere and honest people. Thanks again Shell. Heart

The line of conversation under a topic is known as a thread. Such as this conversation or thread.

I will show you a double post. They usually happen by accident.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
Banjo.
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10-07-2015, 06:28 AM
RE: Saint or Monster?
This is a post.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
Banjo.
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10-07-2015, 06:29 AM
RE: Saint or Monster?
This is a post.

(Same thing said above. You see? Therefore, double post)

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
Banjo.
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10-07-2015, 07:39 AM
Rainbow RE: Saint or Monster?
(10-07-2015 06:28 AM)Banjo Wrote:  This is a post.
Thanks Banjo Shell Heart
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10-07-2015, 08:59 AM
Rainbow RE: Saint or Monster?
(10-07-2015 06:18 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  
(10-07-2015 06:07 AM)ShellShilo Wrote:  Hi Szuchow, thank you for responding. Truth is relative, the more people believe it, the more relevant it is. Therefore it is only the appearance of truth that depend on the numbers. You can justify the truth of almost anything, even the Resurrection, if you have the numbers to back you up.
If the scientific and intellectual community could make up over 3/4 of the population, religion would cease to exist in that population.

I don't think that truth is relative - it's not matter of number of people believing something to be true. Number don't give even apperance of the truth, they only tell how many people believe in something. Apperance though it's important, but lets not mix it with truth.

(10-07-2015 06:07 AM)ShellShilo Wrote:  Sometimes I feel that self-awareness has become a curse and not an asset. With self-awareness, we are now very much aware of our weaknesses as well as our strengths. We need to let go of our primitive need to create deities, to overcompensate for our fear of death. Thanks for listening. Shell Heart

We need? I don't know how things look like with you but I do not create or believe in deities nor I fear death. As Epicurus said: Death, therefore, the most awful of evils, is nothing to us, seeing that, when we are, death is not come, and, when death is come, we are not.

Thank you Szuchow for your comments. Truth, in our reality, can only be relative. It is an explanation of facts that closely relates to our reality. The truths that you are commenting on are, the abstract (logical), and the absolute(exists outside the mind). I'm not interested in them because they are based on belief and not facts. Relative truth must withstand scientific enquiry. It must be challenged, accepted, or disproved. This is why it will always be relative, until it is proven untrue. Truth is not a matter of belief, it is a matter of acceptance.

Now, if you disagree, then you must believe that truth does not conform to our reality, should not withstand scientific scrutiny, and should only be a matter for belief only.

Not sure of your comment on deities, death, and fear. All tribes, groups or nations, since the dawn of mankind, have created their own deities as part of their burial rituals. If they didn't care what happens when you die, there would be no rituals performed, or no deities to pray to. I think it is more an attempt to understand the unknown, then a fear of death. Not familiar with Epicurus, but my own feeling is... I've been dead for about 13.6 billion years and I'm not aware of it. Whether I come back or not come back, I still won't be aware of it. Think about it, if we could live forever, there would not be a need for a god or a fear of death. Huh

Thanks for listening. Shell Heart
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10-07-2015, 09:07 AM
RE: Saint or Monster?
(10-07-2015 08:59 AM)ShellShilo Wrote:  Relative truth must withstand scientific enquiry. It must be challenged, accepted, or disproved. This is why it will always be relative, until it is proven untrue. Truth is not a matter of belief, it is a matter of acceptance.

I think your use of "relative" is confusing since that implies that it can be different for different people or situations. I agree that our understanding of what is true is tentative, but not relative.

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
America July 4 1776 - November 8 2016 RIP
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