Science can answer moral questions
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07-12-2013, 10:10 PM
RE: Science can answer moral questions
(07-12-2013 12:55 AM)DLJ Wrote:  Aside from some Taq vs, Chippy spats, it's a largely adult conversation (with no theists... so far).

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...14?page=18

There is an "Ignore" button for prissy bitches like you who can't handle adult language.

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


You can't have your special pleading and eat it too. -- WillHop
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07-12-2013, 10:23 PM
RE: Science can answer moral questions
(07-12-2013 10:10 PM)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:  
(07-12-2013 12:55 AM)DLJ Wrote:  Aside from some Taq vs, Chippy spats, it's a largely adult conversation (with no theists... so far).

http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...14?page=18

There is an "Ignore" button for smart people like you who can't handle adolescent language.

There fixed it Drinking Beverage

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07-12-2013, 11:29 PM (This post was last modified: 08-12-2013 01:20 AM by IndianAtheist.)
RE: Science can answer moral questions
Hey you guys also should check out his free will video!

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08-12-2013, 12:50 AM
RE: Science can answer moral questions
Childeye, your arguments become worse and worse. Very inconsistent, subjective and all over the place. Let's end our discussion here, if you please. Thank you though for your sincerity, it was fun. Maybe we can take it up another time and remain more focused on the topic.

Thanks Indian atheist for that video share. I find the images and the music distracting from the content, though...

This hypothesis of his is controversial I think. But his arguments are as good as ever, and I can not find a reasonable counter argument at the moment. I would love to see a good counter argument.

Our thoughts are always in context of circumstances that we can not or could not influence.
Question: Exclusively?
Even if we did influence a circumstance, did we do it out of context? Or did we do it in context of other prior influences? Smile

The totality of influences will be the cause for your next conscious thought.


Thinking about this topic is kind of mind numbing, because as I think, I analyse myself thinking, in order to gain insights. A fun topic for sure.

Are there any counter arguments to Sam Harris' hypothesis? I would love to discuss Smile

Fun "paradox": The higher the selection pressure, the slower evolution takes place.
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08-12-2013, 12:47 PM
RE: Science can answer moral questions
(08-12-2013 12:50 AM)Youkay Wrote:  Childeye, your arguments become worse and worse. Very inconsistent, subjective and all over the place. Let's end our discussion here, if you please. Thank you though for your sincerity, it was fun. Maybe we can take it up another time and remain more focused on the topic.
If you do not wish to continue, I will accommodate your polite request. But I would only wish to say that I think you misunderstand me. I don't have anything against what Sam Harris has to say. In fact I find no fault in his reasoning. I have had all of these same thoughts on the subject as I suspect many people have. It's just that he never gives answer to the very questions he is exploring.

Please note how you state your topic, Science can answer moral questions. I am simply arguing that eventually trust is always the issue. Whether you realize it or not, Sam Harris is simply asking the elemental question of is there a God or not? He is saying if there isn't, there ought to be. Assuming we are describing the Godhead as the supreme moral authority. Your topic is suggesting that science can be God. I am saying science can only discover God.

There I've had my say. For the record, I liked the topic and I regret that you do not wish to continue.
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08-12-2013, 01:05 PM
RE: Science can answer moral questions
I disagree again. We can continue, but not here and now. Let's give others a chance to discuss too. Maybe we could enter the Colosseum on this topic.

Fun "paradox": The higher the selection pressure, the slower evolution takes place.
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08-12-2013, 01:30 PM
RE: Science can answer moral questions
Harris seems to forget that there is a logic abyss between descriptive and normative propositions. We can't derive how things ought to be without at least one normative premiss.
At the beginning he says that values are facts about the well being of conscious creatures. While I can accept to some extent that idea, the part about "well being" hides a normative premiss, it implies that "good things are those that increase well being", after defining well being we can derive moral values from scientific, descriptive propositions. But we will always need the moral, non-descriptive axioms.

So no, Harris is wrong in this one, science can't answer (by itself) moral questions.

I'm not saying that a religious moral code is better than what he proposes as a science-based code, I'm just saying that even if his idea is better, it still needs a value element that can't be derived from facts alone

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08-12-2013, 02:06 PM
RE: Science can answer moral questions
(07-12-2013 11:29 PM)IndianAtheist Wrote:  Hey you guys also should check out his free will video!

That video was succinct and very well done. Thanks for the video.
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08-12-2013, 04:58 PM
RE: Science can answer moral questions
(26-10-2013 12:59 PM)Youkay Wrote:  I want to share this video with you,

Sam Harris: Science can answer moral questions

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hj9oB4zpHww

It might help when talking to people who insist that morality can not be derived from science.
Of course Science can answer some moral questions. Science have parts of the truth. But all the truth comes form God.

English is not my native language.
that awkward moment between the Premortal Existence and your Resurrection
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08-12-2013, 05:02 PM
RE: Science can answer moral questions
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A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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