Scottish Independance ahead in Poll
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
11-09-2014, 04:18 AM
RE: Scottish Independance ahead in Poll
(11-09-2014 04:08 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(11-09-2014 04:03 AM)Fidel_Castronaut Wrote:  Scotland can't simply create a Scottish pound.

Not with that attitude. Drinking Beverage

Now are you saying that it is actually more difficult to create an independent state than what most separatist puds make it out to be?

It's all quite silly, really.

I still get the terrible impression that the yes campaign's main mantra has been devised last minute on the back of a cereal box.

The SNPs aim of getting everything up and running by 2016 is laughable, and indeed dangerous. 2016 to unpick a state that's been entwined with 2, or even 3 other states for 300~ years in 2? I'm shocked that people could even think that feasible! I heard someone say it's going to be like unscrambling a scrambled egg. I think that's a conservative outlook, but I guess we'll see next week.

[Image: oie_9101658pvlrOK2Z_zpsd5fb1967.png]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-09-2014, 08:13 AM
RE: Scottish Independance ahead in Poll
(11-09-2014 04:03 AM)Fidel_Castronaut Wrote:  
(11-09-2014 01:12 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  Scottish pound. Problem solved. Ireland did it for a while with the Irish pound.

You could have the Scottish pound alongside the normal pound. Over time the Scottish pound will be the dominate currency and eventually people will only accept the Scottish pound.

The Euro could also be adopted. Ireland did that too.

There's no way Scotland would join the Euro, if they had any sense. There's also nothing to say that Scotland would join the EU, or indeed be given (automatic) membership. Spain and possibly Belgium have already hinted that they will not allow an independent Scotland automatic membership owing to their own seperation issues and the message that would send forward. There's also a question whether Scotland (if it wanted to join the EU at all) would have to negotiate via Article 48. of the TEU (internal) or A.49 (External). If the latter it could theoretically take several years before anything is finalised.

Scotland can't simply create a Scottish pound either because of the savings/loans/investments that are currently held in Sterling. They'd have to gurantee (lender of last resort) on at least a 1:1 basis meaning they'd also have to have a vast amount of capital in reserve, something they don't have and aren't likely to have for a long, long time. Also the very high chance that people would simply move their money out into Sterling in the rUK, effectively leaving given sectors of the new Scottish economy penniless.

Their only real option is either currency union (ruled out prima facie by Westminster) or Sterlingisation - Keeping the pound but being totally at the whim of the BoE and central financial services in Whitehall and Westminster. They'd have the Pound but no control over it, which is worse than what they've got now.

Whichever way you look at it the Yes campaign has been systemically ignoring or covering up the possible effects of their decisions. If the Scots want independence I say good luck to them. I think they'll need it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-28559007

Creating a new currency is not a unique occurrence, it can be done. Money is just symbolic after all. And Scotland can prevent large amounts of cash being transferred out of the country by temporary legislation. At the end of the day it doesn't matter if I buy bread with YEN or US Dollars, the end result (me getting a loaf of bread) is the same.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-09-2014, 08:45 AM
RE: Scottish Independance ahead in Poll
(11-09-2014 08:13 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  
(11-09-2014 04:03 AM)Fidel_Castronaut Wrote:  There's no way Scotland would join the Euro, if they had any sense. There's also nothing to say that Scotland would join the EU, or indeed be given (automatic) membership. Spain and possibly Belgium have already hinted that they will not allow an independent Scotland automatic membership owing to their own seperation issues and the message that would send forward. There's also a question whether Scotland (if it wanted to join the EU at all) would have to negotiate via Article 48. of the TEU (internal) or A.49 (External). If the latter it could theoretically take several years before anything is finalised.

Scotland can't simply create a Scottish pound either because of the savings/loans/investments that are currently held in Sterling. They'd have to gurantee (lender of last resort) on at least a 1:1 basis meaning they'd also have to have a vast amount of capital in reserve, something they don't have and aren't likely to have for a long, long time. Also the very high chance that people would simply move their money out into Sterling in the rUK, effectively leaving given sectors of the new Scottish economy penniless.

Their only real option is either currency union (ruled out prima facie by Westminster) or Sterlingisation - Keeping the pound but being totally at the whim of the BoE and central financial services in Whitehall and Westminster. They'd have the Pound but no control over it, which is worse than what they've got now.

Whichever way you look at it the Yes campaign has been systemically ignoring or covering up the possible effects of their decisions. If the Scots want independence I say good luck to them. I think they'll need it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-28559007

Creating a new currency is not a unique occurrence, it can be done. Money is just symbolic after all. And Scotland can prevent large amounts of cash being transferred out of the country by temporary legislation. At the end of the day it doesn't matter if I buy bread with YEN or US Dollars, the end result (me getting a loaf of bread) is the same.

Yabbut the SNP has stated that they are *NOT* creating a new currency. So there's that. Drinking Beverage

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-09-2014, 11:27 AM
RE: Scottish Independance ahead in Poll
(11-09-2014 08:13 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  Creating a new currency is not a unique occurrence, it can be done. Money is just symbolic after all. And Scotland can prevent large amounts of cash being transferred out of the country by temporary legislation. At the end of the day it doesn't matter if I buy bread with YEN or US Dollars, the end result (me getting a loaf of bread) is the same.

It's a bit more complex than that. Because the value is symbolic, all money is vastly different. The value is dictated by the nation's economic policies and state, not what people necessarily believe in.

Occasional TTA returner then leaverer.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-09-2014, 11:43 AM
RE: Scottish Independance ahead in Poll
A new EU member state - which Scotland would be, if it joined the EU, Salmond's fantasies notwithstanding - is obligated to join the Euro in any case.

... this is my signature!
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-09-2014, 12:24 PM
RE: Scottish Independance ahead in Poll
(11-09-2014 11:43 AM)cjlr Wrote:  A new EU member state - which Scotland would be, if it joined the EU, Salmond's fantasies notwithstanding - is obligated to join the Euro in any case.

But is not forced to do so.

Occasional TTA returner then leaverer.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-09-2014, 12:51 PM
RE: Scottish Independance ahead in Poll
(11-09-2014 12:24 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(11-09-2014 11:43 AM)cjlr Wrote:  A new EU member state - which Scotland would be, if it joined the EU, Salmond's fantasies notwithstanding - is obligated to join the Euro in any case.

But is not forced to do so.

It would be obliged to join first ERM and then the Eurozone if the convergence criteria were met - the treaties are quite explicit. Only the UK and Denmark have formal opt-outs.

The alternative is to pull the Swedish loophole.

Regardless, it's something that would require extensive negotiation and contingency planning - something the SNP has done absolutely none of, and has apparently decided to substitute with wishes and feelings.

... this is my signature!
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-09-2014, 01:00 PM
RE: Scottish Independance ahead in Poll
I thought the Scots were famously level-headed... if this plan is that badly thought out... oh wait... whisky... forgot about that...

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-09-2014, 01:30 PM
RE: Scottish Independance ahead in Poll
(11-09-2014 12:51 PM)cjlr Wrote:  It would be obliged to join first ERM and then the Eurozone if the convergence criteria were met - the treaties are quite explicit. Only the UK and Denmark have formal opt-outs.

And if they don't? They get a strongly-worded letter? The European Union is not known to turn qualifying nations down, regardless of currency.

Occasional TTA returner then leaverer.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-09-2014, 01:41 PM
RE: Scottish Independance ahead in Poll
(11-09-2014 01:30 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(11-09-2014 12:51 PM)cjlr Wrote:  It would be obliged to join first ERM and then the Eurozone if the convergence criteria were met - the treaties are quite explicit. Only the UK and Denmark have formal opt-outs.

And if they don't? They get a strongly-worded letter? The European Union is not known to turn qualifying nations down, regardless of currency.

Several member states would oppose inclusion of an independent Scotland due to their own internal secession movements.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: