Scriptural support for universal morality

[popsthebuilder]

(14-01-2016 08:44 PM)DerFish Wrote:  

(14-01-2016 08:41 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  No, the law is no longer written by the hand of man, but written on the heart through Crist by way of Christ. The only written commands now pertain to wholly loving God which actually equates to being without sin, and loving your neighbor as you love yourself which goes back to judging, the golden rule, equality and mercy.

The law is intact yet known of differently.

So if God Jr hisself has declared that the law will not pass away how izzit that you have the authority to decide that it has?

I DID NOT SAY THE LAW IS PASSED AWAY.

I said it is written on our hearts(believers,followers of Christ).

[Bucky Ball]

(14-01-2016 08:41 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  

(14-01-2016 08:33 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Wrong again pops. JESUS himself said you're wrong.

Matthew 5:18 "For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished."

The Earth is still here, and "everything'' is not accomplished.

Back to square one.
But not to fret, pops.

No, the law is no longer written by the hand of man, but written on the heart through Crist by way of Christ. The only written commands now pertain to wholly loving God which actually equates to being without sin, and loving your neighbor as you love yourself which goes back to judging, the golden rule, equality and mercy.

The law is intact yet known of differently.

You have a full bag of those bullshit rationalizations.
That's NOT what Jesus said.
So you actually think you know better than he ?
Why would he say that if he didn't mean it ?

What ARE you doing here, pops ?

The "old law'' is written on your hearts ? Meaningless drivel. So killing disobedient children is written on your heart ?

[Chas]

(14-01-2016 08:24 AM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  

(13-01-2016 11:52 PM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  




So (Professionals please correct my simplistic errors etc) any sexual reproduction results in RANDOM shuffling/copying of the genetic material from both parents.

Hence the offspring being oh so slightly different/varied from said parents.

This is RANDOM.

It's these teeny, tiny little changes that over a very, very... (Add LOTS of very's here)... amount of time, with the interaction of the surrounding environmental pressures etc which result in both changes to species, new species happening up and too whole new species coming about.

I hope I came close to a good explanation for a blue collar worker.

My point still stands though Pops. The shuffling of genes from parents to offspring is the RANDOM aspect of evolution.

Mutations are random.

The probability of beneficial mutation surviving and being reproduced through offspring is not random.

Sorry try again.

Surviving and reproducing is essentially the definition of beneficial mutation, so you are stating a tautology.

The mutations themselves are random, making the outcome random.

[Fatbaldhobbit]

(14-01-2016 08:28 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Fatbaldhobbit,

I never said I ignored them did I. I never said they weren't pertinent to the understanding of GOD. Just because it can be seen in a negative light doesn't mean that it can't also have positive effects.

We said you ignored them, because you are. You are claiming a universal morality inspired by a god who, according to his direct words and those of his "prophets", is guilty of every atrocity we can understand.

(14-01-2016 08:28 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Stories of people dying by the hand of man because a man told them it was the will of God seems pretty messed up.

Then we agree that the bible is pretty messed up? Because that's what most of it is. Read anything about Moses the great Lawgiver? Pay attention to the parts about the virgins and the taking of captives.

(14-01-2016 08:28 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  There are many lessons to be learned from it. It's clearly stated numerous times I'm scripture that old testaments were for times past, and that if it was the inerrant interpretation of the will of GOD then there would be no need for another testament.

It is also stated clearly, by jesus no less, that the law must be upheld and all will be fulfilled. That's a "truth" of the bible. No matter what you quote, someone can find another quote that directly contradicts it.

So much for the inspiration of an omnipotent deity.

(14-01-2016 08:28 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  People are so quick to talk about the Torah. But we are told that it was only partial testamony, and not full understanding.

Because the torah is the basis for christianity, judaism and islam. It's sort of relevant to discussions about them.

(14-01-2016 08:35 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  According to you, to not be cherry picking I would have to believe every doctrine of every sect of every religion. I stick with the books that the basis of the religions are based on. It isn't cherry picking.

No. By your own admission you stick with certain books and certain passages of those books that support your views. That is the very definition of cherrypicking.

You have done nothing to dispute or disprove any of the refutations of your points.

[popsthebuilder]

(14-01-2016 09:13 PM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  

(14-01-2016 08:28 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Fatbaldhobbit,

I never said I ignored them did I. I never said they weren't pertinent to the understanding of GOD. Just because it can be seen in a negative light doesn't mean that it can't also have positive effects.

We said you ignored them, because you are. You are claiming a universal morality inspired by a god who, according to his direct words and those of his "prophets", is guilty of every atrocity we can understand.

(14-01-2016 08:28 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Stories of people dying by the hand of man because a man told them it was the will of God seems pretty messed up.

Then we agree that the bible is pretty messed up? Because that's what most of it is. Read anything about Moses the great Lawgiver? Pay attention to the parts about the virgins and the taking of captives.

(14-01-2016 08:28 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  There are many lessons to be learned from it. It's clearly stated numerous times I'm scripture that old testaments were for times past, and that if it was the inerrant interpretation of the will of GOD then there would be no need for another testament.

It is also stated clearly, by jesus no less, that the law must be upheld and all will be fulfilled. That's a "truth" of the bible. No matter what you quote, someone can find another quote that directly contradicts it.

So much for the inspiration of an omnipotent deity.

(14-01-2016 08:28 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  People are so quick to talk about the Torah. But we are told that it was only partial testamony, and not full understanding.

Because the torah is the basis for christianity, judaism and islam. It's sort of relevant to discussions about them.

(14-01-2016 08:35 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  According to you, to not be cherry picking I would have to believe every doctrine of every sect of every religion. I stick with the books that the basis of the religions are based on. It isn't cherry picking.

No. By your own admission you stick with certain books and certain passages of those books that support your views. That is the very definition of cherrypicking.

You have done nothing to dispute or disprove any of the refutations of your points.

I said specifically that I do not omit anything from what is in the bible, or other scriptures, but that it has been misinterpreted by some for whatever reason.

Not that the theme of consequences for actions isn't pertinent.

[Banjo]

(14-01-2016 08:51 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  I said it is written on our hearts(believers,followers of Christ).

This sentence has no meaning. If I were to cut out your heart, what would be written on it?

[Fatbaldhobbit]

(14-01-2016 09:22 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  I said specifically that I do not omit anything from what is in the bible, or other scriptures, but that it has been misinterpreted by some for whatever reason.

Not that the theme of consequences for actions isn't pertinent.

If there is Universal Morality then it applies to god as well as man. That would be the universal part.

The Flood:
How many pregnant women do you think died? While the women themselves could have been evil, what crime did the fetuses commit? Innocents murdered by the hand of your god.

What about the babies and toddlers? Physically incapable of evil and intellectually unable to understand evil, these would also be the definition of innocents. All murdered by your god.

Exodus:
The first-born of Egypt. Since "born" was specified we at least can spare the fetuses this time. But, we still have all those innocent babes and toddlers, just like above. Just as innocent and just as dead. Although this time it could be argued that it's worse, since Pharaoh was going to change his mind, then god wouldn't let him.

"Let my people go, or I'll kill the babies."
"Ok, they can go."
"Nah, I really want to kill the babies. You can't let them go."

That's universal alright. Universally FUCKED UP.

Shall we continue?
Wanna talk about Lot? Moses? Job? Jephthah? Hell?



Seriously. You got nothin'.

[Banjo]

So funny. POE thinks he knows what xianity is and how it is all inclusive, of a sort.


Let us live isolated from sinners
2nd Chronicles19:2 And Jehu the son of Hanani the seer went out to meet him, and said to king Jehoshaphat, Shouldest thou help the ungodly, and love them that hate the LORD? therefore is wrath upon thee from before the LORD .

Matthew 8:21 And another of his disciples said unto him, Lord, suffer me first to go and bury my father.
Matthew 8:22 But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead.

Matthew 10:14 And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet.
Matthew 10:15 Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.

Matthew 12:47 Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee.
Matthew 12:48 But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren?
Matthew 12:49 And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!
Matthew 12:50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

Luke 6:22 Blessed are ye, when men shall hate you, and when they shall separate you from their company , and shall reproach you, and cast out your name as evil, for the Son of man's sake.

Luke 14:26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.

John 15:18 If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you.
John 15:19 If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.
John 15:20Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.
John 15:21But all these things will they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that sent me.

1st Corinthians 5:11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

2nd Corinthians 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
2nd Corinthians 6:15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?
2nd Corinthians 6:16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
2nd Corinthians 6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate , saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,

1st John 2:15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

1st John 3:13 Marvel not, my brethren, if the world hate you.

2nd John 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
2nd John 1:10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
2nd John 1:11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.

James 4:4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.

[EvolutionKills]

Pops trying to defend a 'universal' morality that doesn't somehow indict his invisible space wizard as the greatest genocidal psychopath of all time.

[EvolutionKills]

(14-01-2016 09:28 PM)Banjo Wrote:  

(14-01-2016 08:51 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  I said it is written on our hearts(believers,followers of Christ).

This sentence has no meaning. If I were to cut out your heart, what would be written on it?

"Made in China"