Should churches be taxed?
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26-11-2013, 06:08 PM
RE: Should churches be taxed?
(26-11-2013 06:06 PM)Cephalotus Wrote:  Actually, I always wondered how the priests who take a vow of poverty and a vow of celibacy can even help a married couple with counseling. Most marriage problems revolve around money or the sex getting stale.

Again, judging from people I know who've talked to their priests about this, the priests just told them to stay in abusive relationships because gawd doesn't approve of separation or divorce.
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26-11-2013, 09:52 PM (This post was last modified: 26-11-2013 09:56 PM by grizzlysnake.)
RE: Should churches be taxed?
(26-11-2013 06:06 PM)Cephalotus Wrote:  Actually, I always wondered how the priests who take a vow of poverty and a vow of celibacy can even help a married couple with counseling. Most marriage problems revolve around money or the sex getting stale.
Oh they do more than that. Some play amateur hypnotist and plant false memories of abusive parents during regression therapy sessions (I don't particularly agree with anything to do with hypnosis)

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26-11-2013, 10:03 PM
RE: Should churches be taxed?
(26-11-2013 09:52 PM)grizzlysnake Wrote:  Oh they do more than that. Some play amateur hypnotist and plant false memories of abusive parents during regression therapy sessions (I don't particularly agree with anything to do with hypnosis)

But some religions use advanced science. For example, have you seen those Scientologist auditors with their highly sophisticated e-meters? It's a wheatstone bridge that measures electrical resistance and skin conductance. For a religious device it sounds impressive and scientific.... until you realize they're using it to detect invisible alien beings that are clinging to your body. No
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26-11-2013, 11:03 PM
RE: Should churches be taxed?
(26-11-2013 10:03 PM)frankksj Wrote:  
(26-11-2013 09:52 PM)grizzlysnake Wrote:  Oh they do more than that. Some play amateur hypnotist and plant false memories of abusive parents during regression therapy sessions (I don't particularly agree with anything to do with hypnosis)

But some religions use advanced science. For example, have you seen those Scientologist auditors with their highly sophisticated e-meters? It's a wheatstone bridge that measures electrical resistance and skin conductance. For a religious device it sounds impressive and scientific.... until you realize they're using it to detect invisible alien beings that are clinging to your body. No
those pesky thetans
That e-meter is some messed up shit, all those questions they have to ask you and you have to answer or you're not gonna be "clear" I bet they record those sessions so they can blackmail you latter with all the beans you spill.

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26-11-2013, 11:18 PM
RE: Should churches be taxed?
As an example of what I said: my aunt was going through a rough time, the husband has been pretty abusive for the past 40 years or so, and the alcoholic adult son moved in, and he's even more abusive and possibly physically dangerous, too (they've called the cops because they feared for their lives on several occasions. Yeah, my family is fucked up). Anyway, she asked her priest as well as some of my religious relatives for advice on whether or not she should get out of the situation or not, there is a apartment building place, good security, for senior citizens. They all told her it's better to stay in an abusive relationship than to be separated (not even divorced,but separated).

Thankfully, no thanks to these assholes, she ended up getting an apartment and things are much better for her now. But some of them have literally said that, no matter WHAT your spouse/SO is doing to you, no matter how abusive they are, it's always better to stay in the relationship and try to work it out because gawd. The situation with the aunt was no joke; I seriously would not have been surprised if someone had ended up dead. But you know, better to be abused or dead than offend the skydaddy and break your wedding vows...

Shit got ugly for a while between my parents before my dad died, and they gave my mom the same advice: stay with him no matter what (my dad was addicted to Rx drugs and was an alcoholic, and he was not always pleasant to be around toward the end). And I disagreed with them then, too.

Didn't the show The Sopranos touch on this, also? Carmela was having doubts and the priest told her Gawd wants her to work the problems out and stay married. That's how I imagine a lot of marriage counseling goes. The priest just ignores the problems and tells them Gawd wants them to stay together and work it out, even if the husband is out killing people every day of the week and cheating on his wife.

Anyway, point being, I've seen that a lot: the "don't ever leave your abusive spouse" stuff, which I'd hardly consider a worthwhile service to the public.
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26-11-2013, 11:53 PM
RE: Should churches be taxed?
(26-11-2013 12:13 PM)Adrianime Wrote:  
(26-11-2013 11:58 AM)RaisdCath Wrote:  If money is collected from them as taxes, they can then get on the "gravy train" and demand funds from taxes.

I'm sick and tired of paying for items the federal govt. uses my tax money for.....I don't need religious institutions added to that infamous list.
How can a private business demand money from taxes?


Here's one way.

http://truth-out.org/news/item/20254-mee...are-queens

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27-11-2013, 06:02 AM
RE: Should churches be taxed?
(24-11-2013 07:34 AM)Chas Wrote:  One of the reasons for not taxing churches is the establishment clause.

A government that wanted to favor one church could impose inequitable taxes on the others to the advantage of the favored church, thus violating the spirit of the law.

That's not even part of the question.
Just cancel out their exemptionstatus and the taxcode will do it's job just fine, like it does now for religions that don't have it yet.
Income, from donations or sales, can be taxed just fine.

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27-11-2013, 07:25 AM
RE: Should churches be taxed?
(27-11-2013 06:02 AM)Caveman Wrote:  
(24-11-2013 07:34 AM)Chas Wrote:  One of the reasons for not taxing churches is the establishment clause.

A government that wanted to favor one church could impose inequitable taxes on the others to the advantage of the favored church, thus violating the spirit of the law.

That's not even part of the question.
Just cancel out their exemptionstatus and the taxcode will do it's job just fine, like it does now for religions that don't have it yet.
Income, from donations or sales, can be taxed just fine.

Of course it's part of the question. It is part of the legal reasoning behind non-taxation of churches.

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27-11-2013, 09:31 AM
RE: Should churches be taxed?
(27-11-2013 07:25 AM)Chas Wrote:  One of the reasons for not taxing churches is the establishment clause. A government that wanted to favor one church could impose inequitable taxes on the others to the advantage of the favored church, thus violating the spirit of the law.

Substituting 'church' for 'corporation'.... What should we do when a government wanted to favor one corporation (perhaps one owned by the President's brother) and imposed inequitable taxes on the other corporations to the advantage of the favored one? Why should the treatment of a church, which actually is a corporation, be different from non-church corporations? If one corporation says the solution to man's problem is science (ie a non-profit education ngo), and the other corporation says it's prayer (ie a church), why does the latter deserve special protections not afforded the former?
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27-11-2013, 09:34 AM
RE: Should churches be taxed?
(27-11-2013 09:31 AM)frankksj Wrote:  
(27-11-2013 07:25 AM)Chas Wrote:  One of the reasons for not taxing churches is the establishment clause. A government that wanted to favor one church could impose inequitable taxes on the others to the advantage of the favored church, thus violating the spirit of the law.

Substituting 'church' for 'corporation'.... What should we do when a government wanted to favor one corporation (perhaps one owned by the President's brother) and imposed inequitable taxes on the other corporations to the advantage of the favored one? Why should the treatment of a church, which actually is a corporation, be different from non-church corporations? If one corporation says the solution to man's problem is science (ie a non-profit education ngo), and the other corporation says it's prayer (ie a church), why does the latter deserve special protections not afforded the former?

I am not making a case, I am stating a fact.

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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