Should private schools receive state funded buses?
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16-08-2012, 11:05 AM
Should private schools receive state funded buses?
Here in LA, this is a growing problem. Our private and public schools are completely intermingled, this is partly because Louisiana's public school systems are mostly pathetic; so, in order to survive, the state needs the funding from the vast amount of private schools which, more of less, carry the state.

Here in Baton Rouge, Parish provided buses are dropping kids off late to private schools and picking them up from school up to an hour after the school lets out. This has caused a parental uproar and a large increase in parents bringing and picking up their kids to/from school. This increases the already horrid traffic situation in BR.

Public school advocates say that if a parent chooses to send their kid to a private school and not take advantage of the free schooling then they don't have the right to state provided buses.

Private school advocates say that their taxes pay for the buses, so their children should be entitled to them no matter when they choose to go to school.

What do y'all think?

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16-08-2012, 11:25 AM
RE: Should private schools receive state funded buses?
(16-08-2012 11:05 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  Private school advocates say that their taxes pay for the buses, so their children should be entitled to them no matter when they choose to go to school.

I agree with the above position, subject to the schools being located within the tax jurisdiction in question.
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16-08-2012, 12:52 PM
RE: Should private schools receive state funded buses?
I'm with Jeff on this.

And, it seems to me that public school advocates are focusing on the wrong thing. The problem is not that private schools are using tax payer dollars to bus in students. The problem is that your public schools suck so badly that the only way to get a decent education is to pay for private school. I'm a big proponent of public schools but what I'm not a proponent is the sense of entitlement and lack of accountability that often accompanies public schools. Focus on doing your job well and things like private schools using your buses will be much less of an issue.

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16-08-2012, 01:39 PM
RE: Should private schools receive state funded buses?
This might be a viable position as long as there are no religious doctrines taught at the private schools - which I doubt is likely. If there is a religious doctrine taught at one of these private schools then it is clearly illegal to let them use the public buses.

This is a complete guess, but I would assume that the public schools are falling apart largely because the religious movements have been attacking them for 40 years with the specific purpose of destroying them. The reward for their malicious attack should not be to ignore the constitution and proved them with further free ammunition which they will use to degrade the public schools further.
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16-08-2012, 01:53 PM
RE: Should private schools receive state funded buses?
(16-08-2012 01:39 PM)RR Edwards Wrote:  This might be a viable position as long as there are no religious doctrines taught at the private schools - which I doubt is likely. If there is a religious doctrine taught at one of these private schools then it is clearly illegal to let them use the public buses.

RR, connect the dots for me here. All the bus does is take you to the school grounds. The religious ed isn't conducted on the bus, and the taxpayers have paid for buses for the kids, so why the issue?
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16-08-2012, 02:33 PM
RE: Should private schools receive state funded buses?
(16-08-2012 01:53 PM)Jeff Wrote:  RR, connect the dots for me here. All the bus does is take you to the school grounds. The religious ed isn't conducted on the bus, and the taxpayers have paid for buses for the kids, so why the issue?
I think we can agree:
Buses are not free
Gas is not free
Bus drivers do not work for free
Bus maintenance is not free

Additionally - the government has decided that a public school system benefits every citizen of the country. I haven't seen evidence that this could possibly be a wrong assessment.

Granted these things, there are 2 separate issues here:
1 - The taxes and money in question is for the public school system and not for anything else.
2 - It is absolutely and clearly illegal to use any government money to support any religion.

Citizens don't get to choose where their taxes dollars go. When the government collects taxes, the money is completely abstracted from the people who payed the taxes. I can't imagine a rational argument that would empower citizens to decide where their tax money goes.

Citizens are required to pay their taxes and therefore hold a trust that the government will not use that money for illegal purposes (like busing children to indoctrination centers).

If Citizens voluntarily choose not to partake in some service the government offers - like public schools, then they have no grounds to directly request the government to pay for an alternative.

The very fact that people ask the schools to perform this service shows that it has value. So not only are they are asking to steal this value from the government they want to use it for an illegal purpose (promote religion with a government program).
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16-08-2012, 02:50 PM
RE: Should private schools receive state funded buses?
(16-08-2012 11:05 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  Private school advocates say that their taxes pay for the buses, so their children should be entitled to them no matter when they choose to go to school.

What do y'all think?

Yeah. Until somebody argues raising taxes to provide for public school students, then the private advocates, if that's what you want to call them, argue against the higher taxes saying that they aren't even going to public schools.

I really don't know what types of problems and conflicts go on between public vs. private education, there weren't any private school kids riding our buses (lucky them), but it seems like things could get kind of deep.

(16-08-2012 01:39 PM)RR Edwards Wrote:  This might be a viable position as long as there are no religious doctrines taught at the private schools - which I doubt is likely. If there is a religious doctrine taught at one of these private schools then it is clearly illegal to let them use the public buses.

This is a complete guess, but I would assume that the public schools are falling apart largely because the religious movements have been attacking them for 40 years with the specific purpose of destroying them. The reward for their malicious attack should not be to ignore the constitution and proved them with further free ammunition which they will use to degrade the public schools further.

I guess that is another reason why religion poisons everything. I remember they questioned Chris Christie about sending his kinds to private schools, given that it seemed coincidental when also taking into account he was a big supporter of cutting funds to education, and he responded that it had nothing to do with his views on the public school's ability to educate his children but his desire to give his kids a "religious" education.

It's already a bad enough conflict that people who are rich enough to afford the choice to provide their children with the type of education they want them to receive are in charge of making important decisions about the overall mass and separate, public education of society in certain areas, so adding in that religious aspect of most private schools is insult to injury.

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16-08-2012, 03:08 PM
RE: Should private schools receive state funded buses?
I wonder though, if public school buses transported kids to private school too..... despite the increased costs for the public school (and do the public schools charge more for bus service? I say that as my town DID charge for bus service depending on the situation, and that was over 20 years ago), and everything else related such as longer times for children to be on buses, earlier pickup times, etc....

If the private school wanted to go on a field trip or had an outing, would they be allowed to use the public bus then? Would driving students not associated with the school owning the bus (paying the driver/etc) have issues with insurance because of it, or have to pay more?

Tax money paying for schools or not, let's be honest, your tax money goes to a lot of things. Even if every single penny I paid in state taxes last year went only to my town, it wouldn't have maintained the upkeep or cost of a single bus, let alone pay for the roads, sewer, water, fire/police/ambulance, etc. But even if the money went to the schools, they wouldn't have applied it just for busses, it'd go for everything there (most likely--give or take). So yeah they're paying taxes and it's a publically funded item--but they don't really pay for it specifically in any way to make it beneficial to be able to use it to transport children to a different destination (especially given potential other problems I mentioned and others).

Think of it this way, in my small town of about 6700 people, there are around 40 school buses, some overlap routes just because they pick up different aged children (four schools, generally one bus goes to one, one to another, and one to the middle and high school--from people on the same road or even same house). The buses are generally full. If they had to pickup students and deliver them to, say three private schools, they may have to hire more drivers, buy more buses, increase times for pickup/delivery, maybe have insurance issues, or just have crowded buses that could be pushing the max capacity load.
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16-08-2012, 07:34 PM
RE: Should private schools receive state funded buses?
No, Private Schools should receive zero government funding.

The idea of private school is money. Like private jails or private hospitals. The idea is that you offer a better service then the current 'free' one and so people pay for that and you earn money.
It's a business just like any other. And so, as a business, if it cannot support and supply it's own bus service (which is part of running a school) then that's it's problem. We live in a free market and if you can't handle the heat then you should get out of the kitchen.
It shouldn't matter if it's a school or corner dairy, a business is a business.

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17-08-2012, 04:47 AM
RE: Should private schools receive state funded buses?
Did people read the OP closely? KC is describing a unique situation as follows:

"Here in LA, this is a growing problem. Our private and public schools are completely intermingled, this is partly because Louisiana's public school systems are mostly pathetic; so, in order to survive, the state needs the funding from the vast amount of private schools which, more of less, carry the state."

If I understand this correctly, the state is in a financial fix where it can't or won't budget enough money to pay for all the public schools needed, and now relies on the fact that many people are sending their kids to private school.

I think we can all understand the purist argument, that the infrastructure or transportation for public and private institutions should not be intermingled. But in this unique situation, as a matter of public policy, does it really make sense for three or four buses to visit every neighborhood to pick up kids for all the different schools? And if the public schools are not available, and the taxpayer is paying for the buses, is it unreasonable to use those buses even if it's for transportation to a private institution? The roadways don't grow more lanes just because there are more schools. You've got to consider the traffic issues associated with a system where large numbers of students are going to private institutions if you're not going to have one bus system. Good public policy avoids being trapped by ideology.
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